Revelations 1:8, 1:18, 3:7 and 17:8

[GoldenWolf]

Revelation 1:18:

I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Revelation 3:7:

And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth;

Revelation 1:8:

I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

Revelation 17:8

The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

Edited December 28, 2015 by Mystic Crusader

[jamesjr191]

Im familiar with much of the Bible but i seem to be lost guessing where your going or what your trying to state here.

Edited December 28, 2015 by jamesjr191

[Space Commander Travis]

...And?

[Davros of Skaro]

MC believes the God of the Bible is real. Except MC believes it's demonic out to trick, and torture people as it did to MC

[toast]

Boiler: He told us this story... four years ago?

Doolittle: No I think it was four years ago.

Boiler:[pauses] That's what I said.

Boiler: [sometime later] I'm sure it was four years ago.

(Dark Star/ J. Carpenter)

[ellapenella]

Revelation 1:18:

I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Revelation 3:7:

And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth;

Revelation 1:8:

I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

Revelation 17:8

The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

do you think like that you're like the anti chirst or something?You put up some FN weird stuff. is all I got to say unless you actually for once here on UM say something to us about what it is exactly that's puzzling you? Like whaaat the hell with these religious posts?

[Glockornothing]

do you think like that you're like the anti chirst or something?You put up some FN weird stuff. is all I got to say unless you actually for once here on UM say something to us about what it is exactly that's puzzling you? Like whaaat the hell with these religious posts?

My religious post: Psalm 144:1: "Blessed be the Lord my Rock, who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle."

Buy a gun and learn how to use it, well at least that's my interpretation .

[GoldenWolf]

Pointing out that the god of the bible is indeed the beast of revelation.

[GoldenWolf]

My religious post: Psalm 144:1: "Blessed be the Lord my Rock, who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle."

Buy a gun and learn how to use it, well at least that's my interpretation .

A contradiction to the first amendment.

The First Amendment (Amendment I) to the United States Constitution prohibits the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble

Edited December 29, 2015 by Mystic Crusader

[jamesjr191]

Ok, perfect sense now. God admits to being the beast of Revelations

So he is like ying/yang, light/dark.....ok ......Personally i dont subscribe to fairy tales and myths but whatever gets you through the nights ok with me.

[Sundew]

To understand Revelation you need to have a good background in the Old Testament. While there is not a single direct quote from the O.T. in Revelation, there are some 400 inferences to it. It is primarily written to Jews who would understand the references; the Church is mentioned only in the first 4 chapters and again in the last 2, the rest of the book deals with the nations in conflict with Israel and with God's judgements.

The Primary character of the book is the Lamb, a reference to Christ as a sacrifice and one the Jews would be quite familiar with from the sacrificial system of the O.T. The Lamb was a sin offering in the time of Tabernacle/Temple sacrifices.

To pick and choose passages and assign meaning to them that was not intended will get you nowhere. And there is a lot of symbolism in the Book of Revelation, as well as literal events, one must discern the difference for it to make sense.

[ellapenella]

My religious post: Psalm 144:1: "Blessed be the Lord my Rock, who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle."

Buy a gun and learn how to use it, well at least that's my interpretation .

I get you Glockornothing. I think you're one of the good guys, too.

[ellapenella]

Pointing out that the god of the bible is indeed the beast of revelation.

O.K try showing us WHY you're seeing this.

[Glockornothing]

A contradiction to the first amendment.

The First Amendment (Amendment I) to the United States Constitution prohibits the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble

Me, expressing my 1st Amendment right to post what I want (not creating law) contradicts the 1st Amendment, ok then. I guess that's why they also created my favorite, the 2nd to help protect people who do want to express their 1st. Edited December 29, 2015 by Glockornothing

[XenoFish]

God is whatever you imagine it to be.

[docyabut2]

To me its was John `s dreams and visions of his own times.as much as we all would like to figure them out to our times:)

Edited December 29, 2015 by docyabut2

[Space Commander Travis]

It's certainly up there in my list of favourite works of fantasy fiction, the only thing it's lacking really is Dwarves.

[ellapenella]

Pointing out that the god of the bible is indeed the beast of revelation.

O.K So,you do believe in God and you do believe in an beast described in the book of revelation.I don't think you're trolling about it because you've been at this same point since I've joined the UM community.

How are you reading the book,from what perspective of times are you understanding the events that have already taken place in the book? Which of the event gives you this idea that God in the bible is a beast? what is the beast in the book of revelation, to you?

[GoldenWolf]

O.K So,you do believe in God and you do believe in an beast described in the book of revelation.I don't think you're trolling about it because you've been at this same point since I've joined the UM community.

How are you reading the book,from what perspective of times are you understanding the events that have already taken place in the book? Which of the event gives you this idea that God in the bible is a beast? what is the beast in the book of revelation, to you?

You honestly can't see it in this, it is in bold:

Revelation 1:18:

I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Revelation 3:7:

And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth;

Revelation 1:8:

I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

Revelation 17:8

The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

The beast, the most malignant narcissistic madman that was, is and will be.

Malignant narcissism is a psychological syndrome comprising an extreme mix of narcissism, antisocial personality disorder, aggression, and sadism.^[1] Often grandiose, and always ready to raise hostility levels, the malignant narcissist undermines organizations in which they are involved, and dehumanizes the people with whom they associate.^[2]

^{Kernberg described malignant narcissism as a syndrome characterized by a narcissistic personality disorder (NPD), antisocial features, paranoid traits, and egosyntonicaggression. Other symptoms may include an absence of conscience, a psychological need for power, and a sense of importance (grandiosity). Pollock wrote: "The malignant narcissist is presented as pathologically grandiose, lacking in conscience and behavioral regulation with characteristic demonstrations of joyful cruelty and sadism".[7]}

^{While narcissists are common malignant narcissists are less common. A notable difference between the two is the feature sadism or the gratuitous enjoyment in the pain of others. A narcissist will deliberately damage other people in pursuit of their own selfish desires but may regret doing so and will in some circumstances show remorse for doing so, however a malignant narcissist will harm others and enjoy doing so, showing little empathy or regret for the damage they have caused.}

https://en.wikipedia...nant_narcissism

http://www.sagacious...morally-insane/

Unparalleled narcissism, sociopathy and sadism.

-----------------

The polar opposite of a good role model.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Mystic Crusader

[Mr Walker]

Pointing out that the god of the bible is indeed the beast of revelation.

That runs counter to the entire narrative of the bible. Your first 3 verses are referring to god, the last to satan. The bible divides the world and human kind into good and evil. God represents good. satan represents evil. It is a story of conflict and it just doesn't make sense to have a confusing sub plot where both good and evil are the same being. This is true even if the story was an allegory for the human condition, where there exists in humans the potential for good and evil and we must choose.

In the end of the bible story, god/good wins out over evil/satan, and humanity lives in a golden age of peace and plenty. Allegorically, if we can win the battle in our own heart and mind, we individually, will be in a state of peace and plenty. Literaly if humanity can keep the force within them on the side of light we can transform the earth into a paradise but if we go to the dark side it will all end very badly as we destroy the earth and ourselves.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Mr Walker

[Mr Walker]

You honestly can't see it in this, it is in bold:

The beast, the most malignant narcissistic madman that was, is and will be.

Malignant narcissism is a psychological syndrome comprising an extreme mix of narcissism, antisocial personality disorder, aggression, and sadism.^[1] Often grandiose, and always ready to raise hostility levels, the malignant narcissist undermines organizations in which they are involved, and dehumanizes the people with whom they associate.^[2]

^{Kernberg described malignant narcissism as a syndrome characterized by a narcissistic personality disorder (NPD), antisocial features, paranoid traits, and egosyntonicaggression. Other symptoms may include an absence of conscience, a psychological need for power, and a sense of importance (grandiosity). Pollock wrote: "The malignant narcissist is presented as pathologically grandiose, lacking in conscience and behavioral regulation with characteristic demonstrations of joyful cruelty and sadism".[7]}

^{While narcissists are common malignant narcissists are less common. A notable difference between the two is the feature sadism or the gratuitous enjoyment in the pain of others. A narcissist will deliberately damage other people in pursuit of their own selfish desires but may regret doing so and will in some circumstances show remorse for doing so, however a malignant narcissist will harm others and enjoy doing so, showing little empathy or regret for the damage they have caused.}

https://en.wikipedia...nant_narcissism

http://www.sagacious...morally-insane/

Unparalleled narcissism, sociopathy and sadism.

-----------------

The polar opposite of a good role model.

But that is nothing like the descriptions of god in the bible. No author is going to present their god in that way This interpretation comes from two things A misunderstanding of the nature of life and the

state of mind of people 4000 years ago, and trying to impose modern values and attitudes over a story from that time. If you use modern values then many of the great heroes of ancient time real and mythological were pathologically violent, rapist, ego maniacs but that is a false interpretation/misunderstand of how they were, and more importantly, how the authors perceived them to be in the story telling.

God was god to ancient peoples and his characteristics were not subject to human flaws or weakness. What we see as pride was an attribute they saw as necessary for a god The judaeo Christian god is is described as both just and merciful .Today people expect mercy to dominate over justice. They would be reluctant to wipe out a million people to stop a plague for example (and having modern science/medicine changes our view here) Heck they are reluctant to execute a mass murderer, rapist or child abuser. But to people of the OT this was a logical procedure . ONly god could stop a plague or sin in the world and he had a job to do. I just cant find the sort of god you describe in any of the bible. I see a god "drawn" by the minds of the people who worshipped him in a time of great war and violence, where women were virtual slaves, and slavery was an important basis for economies, and people lived short brutal lives with little hope of improvement or relief

Just to take one point God HAD a conscience. He wept to have to do some of the things the story had him do. He sought alternatives. BUT in the end he did what was necessary That necessity was created by HUMAN nature free will and choice ( according to the bible story) . One of the obligations of a god in human minds is to do what is needful of doing, even when this is a hard choice (power generates responsibility to act.) We also impute the expectation of this quality to our leaders and rulers in the world.. ( i do not have the power to destroy the world, but half a dozen men do, and we gave them that power and entrusted them with it. We do the same when we construct our gods, or interpret the nature of gods )

Edited January 1, 2016 by Mr Walker

[Davros of Skaro]

Yep...The Beast is Loki all right.