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Roswell: Two Crashes, Not One

roswell coverup

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#16    Hazzard

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 04:57 PM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 06 August 2012 - 04:11 PM, said:

Some people even say there were three.

I heard as much as five. :td:

The Roswell legend gets sillier for every crash the add,...

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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#17    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:14 PM

View PostHazzard, on 06 August 2012 - 04:57 PM, said:

I heard as much as five. :td:

The Roswell legend gets sillier for every crash the add,...

In that respect, it does seem like a tall tale that has grown with the telling.   I do agree that a lot of nonsense about Roswell has been tossed into the stew over the years, as well as a lot of deliberate misinformation and disinformation.

As I said, the only document I ever say that was even remotely connected to this case was that there were two "incidents: in New Mexico in 1947 that were reclassified Top Secret, but neither of them mentioned "Roswell" at all.  That name didn't come up.  

The other thing I know is that the whole balloon explanation is bogus.


#18    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:22 PM

My impression is that at the time, the military wouldn't even have thought of this as the "Roswell Incident", if they had bothered to give it a name at all, but more likely as the "White Sands Incident", or at least something related to other UFO reports that they had been having at White Sands.

They would have thought of it as UFO showing interest in the rocket test there, which had been going on even before Kenneth Arnold's famous sighting in 1947.  Dr. Robert Sarbacher was involved in these tests, and his son said that he was equipping missiles with cameras to get better pictures of the UFOs.


#19    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:23 PM

DR. ROBERT SARBACHER

Posted Image

"Dr. Robert Sarchacher was a preeminent scientist. A Harvard graduate, he was Dean of the Graduate School of Georgia Institute of Technology; Director of Research at Wedd Laboratories; an accomplished inventor; a Scientific Consultant to the U.S. Marines and government agencies; and connected to the Joint Research and Development Board (JRDB) of the US DOD. One of his research specialities was remote controlled rockets.

In the 1980s Sarbacher confirmed to researchers William Steinman, Stan Freidman, Jerry Clark and William Moore several truths about UFOs and ET. He indicated that in the early 1950s he was officially made aware of a crash of a non-terrestrial craft in the Southwest- a crash that occured at that time or likely some time prior, and may well have been the Roswell UFO crash. He had confirmed to them (as well as to scientist Wilbert Smith of Canada three decades prior) that the subject was classified higher that the development of the Atom Bomb. He said that the debris was very light and very tough. He understood that the aliens were lightweight and constructed somewhat like insects. He said that a small group of people were likely involved in the crash debris analysis and included Von Braun, Vannevar Bush, Oppenheimer, and Eric Walker, among others.

Recently, respected researcher D.M. Duncan located Sarbacher's son, Robert Sarbacher, Jr., living in Texas. Duncan had a revealing dialog with Sarbacher. It was learned that the younger Sarbacher had once questioned his father about the UFO phenomena. His Dad spoke sparingly about the saucer subject.

Sarbacher Jr. said of his father: "He knew that they were real for the obvious reason that they would be going 600 mph and then make a direct 90 degree turn in mid-air without slowing down...separated from all inertia and gravity. Dad said that the reason he was called in was to build the right kind of missile to track these things since they were way too fast for any of our planes to catch. They wanted the missile to not destroy any of the UFOs, but to be able to track them. So Dad had cameras installed (like on the V-2 rockets) so when the UFO comes into our air space we would shoot missiles at them with cameras on them, since only a missile could keep up with the speed turns."

Stunned at the revelation, Duncan wanted to clarify this, and Sarbacher's son replied, "Yes, exactly to track UFOs, or rather to photograph and watch them...When he first told me about the missiles...the first thing I thought was, what? You were trying to destroy them? He (Sarbacher Sr.) said very normally and matter of factly, "No, we put cameras on the end of them."


http://ufocon.blogsp...v-2-flying.html


#20    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:25 PM

Wouldn't you like to get Dr. Sarbacher's UFO papers, and those of his other colleagues at the time?  I know I would!


"J. Andrew Kissner was a former New Mexico State Representative from Las Cruces, N.M. During the 1990s, Kissner provided assistance to Congressman Steven Schiff of N.M. in ascertaining the truth about the UFO crash at Roswell. Schiff was instrumental in facilitating studies conducted by the the U.S. GAO and USAF on the crash.

Kissner maintains that while he worked in Las Cruces, near White Sands Missile Range, he received information from a trusted high-ranking officer who worked there. Kissner wrote that at White Sands, he was told that in 1947: "A radar target instantaneously appeared next to the ascending V-2 missile, and immediately the V-2 rocket changed course." Kissner says his White Sands military officer source "saw a photograph of a flying disc taken from a camera aimed through a V-2 rocket window. The object changed course, taking a northeasterly track, one that brought the rocket crashing to earth two minutes later only six miles east and slightly north of the community of Alamogordo, New Mexico, 40 degrees off the V-2's project flight path."

Kissner continues: "Whatever had mysteriously appeared and vanished after observing a V-2 in flight in close proxity to the rocket, it apparently affected the rocket's trajectory. That event became an immediate priority with a very small, closed circle of highly ranked general staff officers and civilian scientists assigned to the Joint Research and Development Board (JRDB.)"

Kissner wonders if the saucer at Roswell was somehow brought down purposely or inadvertently by such V-2 or other rocket exercises."


#21    DONTEATUS

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 11:48 PM

View PostHazzard, on 06 August 2012 - 04:57 PM, said:

I heard as much as five. :td:

The Roswell legend gets sillier for every crash the add,...
No Hazzard  Roswell gets Sillier as each thread is filled in. ITs Like a Story Board in some B-rated Holylwierd Movie !
I cant wait for the next instalitation !

This is a Work in Progress!

#22    coolguy

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 05:31 PM

very  interesting good read. in the frist report  in the news paper it says USAF has crashed flying disc.
then the next day they said it was something else and the last  65 years they been comeing up with so many cover ups and they even got caught up in there own lies.


#23    badeskov

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 05:42 PM

View Postcoolguy, on 07 August 2012 - 05:31 PM, said:

very  interesting good read. in the frist report  in the news paper it says USAF has crashed flying disc.
then the next day they said it was something else and the last  65 years they been comeing up with so many cover ups and they even got caught up in there own lies.

Actually, no they haven't come up with so many cover stories. The USAF story has actually been the most consistent component in all of this, where as the ET proponents have been all over the place.

Cheers,
Badeskov

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#24    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 07:55 PM

View Postbadeskov, on 07 August 2012 - 05:42 PM, said:

Actually, no they haven't come up with so many cover stories. The USAF story has actually been the most consistent component in all of this, where as the ET proponents have been all over the place.

Since you're so interested in science, Bad, why don't you tell us more about Dr. Sarbacher, and his colleague Dr. Eric Walker?


#25    WoIverine

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:24 PM

McG there was another thread about Valiant Thor, not sure if you saw it, do you have any info on that guy?


#26    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:36 PM

View PostSpid3rCyd3, on 07 August 2012 - 08:24 PM, said:

McG there was another thread about Valiant Thor, not sure if you saw it, do you have any info on that guy?

Frank Stranges said that his people lived underground on the planet Venus, and that he worked in the Pentagon from 1957-60, where he had contact with people at the highest levels of the US government, including Eisenhower.




#27    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:48 PM

My opinion of Valiant Thor is that it was all a hoax.  Someone even knew what the guy's real name was, but I've forgotten it.  He wasn't from outer space, though.


#28    badeskov

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:58 PM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 07 August 2012 - 07:55 PM, said:



Since you're so interested in science, Bad, why don't you tell us more about Dr. Sarbacher, and his colleague Dr. Eric Walker?

Why, what's the point with respect to the post I made to coolguy1? I see no relevance whatsoever.

Cheers,
Badeskov

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#29    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 09:06 PM

View Postbadeskov, on 07 August 2012 - 08:58 PM, said:

Why, what's the point with respect to the post I made to coolguy1? I see no relevance whatsoever.

I was just wondering if you wanted to tell us anything new or interesting, especially about scientists like those who were involved in investigating UFOs.  At least, I know that they were and I have proved it many times.


#30    psyche101

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 12:00 AM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 06 August 2012 - 04:28 PM, said:

I don't believe any of the "official" stories about balloons, that's for sure.  I have never seen one of those "official" reports about UFOs that was true yet.  Those are just designed for the incurious masses, the John Q. Publics and the media bubbleheads who want to meet their deadlines by reporting whatever is in the press release.  None of it is true.

I have even shown on here more than once that no such balloon flights were ever launched that met the criteria of what they cover up boys would have us believe.  

Okay, the official and skeptical "explanation" is bilge water and bogus, but what's new?  They almost always are false and blatantly so, based on the assumption that most people are fools and will never dig into UFOs any further.

I don't know if the UFOs crashed or were shot down, or even if they ran into each other, but we have 500-600 witnesses at this point who have come forward and said they saw something out of this world.  More than one of these UFO crashes have happened over the years, and someone has always gone in and cleaned up the mess, sent the wreckage to Wright-Patterson or wherever.

There is a whole lot of disinformation being mixed into the pot here, all kinds of BS and obfuscation, but it is happening and being covered up.  As for those who assert that aliens are so advanced that they would never crash, all I can say is that accidents will happen.  It's a flawed and imperfect universe.

Some people also assume that they are flying all these little craft across thousands of light years of space, which I have never believed was true.  They may originally be from somewhere way "out there" but they are based nearby, maybe on or near this planet.


The balloon theory makes a great deal more sense if one takes all the opinions out of it, and just concentrates on the documents from the time frame, I agree and have also shown that the hypothesis put forward cannot be, due to documents from the time frame, but that does not discount balloons, it just changes the parameters. Crareys diary tells the story on that one I feel.

The article says that debunkers doubt one crash, well that is not true at all, most debunkers are happy with the MOGUL claims, and agree something crashed, the object that crashed has always been the debate. No evidence exists at all for the one recognised crash, how two are going to ever be proven is beyond me. Nobody even agrees on the size of the recognised crash scene. It offers no answers, as such, I suspect this is merely another diversion. It sounds Bragaliaesque.

French's claim is an old one, not sure how it made current news.

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