Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


* - - - - 2 votes

[Merged] Abortion and beliefs

atheist pro live abortion rights of the unborn

  • Please log in to reply
90 replies to this topic

#61    Beckys_Mom

Beckys_Mom

    Sarcastic Muppet..!

  • Member
  • 51,193 posts
  • Joined:01 Nov 2005
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Ireland

  • "I hate pretentious people. I mean, what is the point in applying exorbitantly extensive vocabulary, it is just straightforwardly unnecessary".

Posted 27 November 2012 - 02:24 PM

Our hospitals are run by the NHS, So I looked up info on the risk  if any ..and found info from the NHS site  below

Risks of an abortion

No clinical procedure is entirely risk free, but abortion poses few risks to a woman's physical health, particularly when carried out during the first 12 weeks of pregnancy.
Having an abortion will not usually affect your chances of becoming pregnant and having normal pregnancies in future.



Risks at the time of an abortion

There is a low risk of problems occurring during an abortion. However, there are more likely to be problems if an abortion is carried out later in a pregnancy.
The risks associated with abortions are:
  • haemorrhage (excessive bleeding) - occurs in about 1 in every 1,000 abortions
  • damage to the cervix (the entrance of the womb) - occurs in no more than 10 in every 1,000 abortions
  • damage to the womb - occurs in up to 4 in every 1,000 abortions during surgical abortion, and less than 1 in 1,000 medical abortions carried out at 12-24 weeks
Risks after an abortion

After an abortion, the main risk is infection in the womb, which is usually caused by failing to completely remove all of the foetus and associated tissue.

If an infection is not treated, it could lead to a more severe infection of your reproductive organs, such as pelvic inflammatory disease (PID), which can cause infertility or ectopic pregnancy(where a fertilised egg implants itself outside of the womb, usually in one of the fallopian tubes). However, the risk of an infection can be reduced by taking antibiotics at the time of the abortion.


http://www.nhs.uk/Co...ages/Risks.asp

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 27 November 2012 - 02:26 PM.

Posted ImageRAW Berris... Dare you enter?

If there's a heaven...I hope to hell I get there !

#62    GreenmansGod

GreenmansGod

    Bio-Electric sentient being.

  • Member
  • 9,255 posts
  • Joined:23 Jun 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Hurricane State

  • May the laughter ye give today return to thee 3 fold.

Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:29 PM

View Postmarkdohle, on 27 November 2012 - 01:07 PM, said:

Like I said, I deal with women who have had abortions.  Many had them over 30 years ago and are still suffering for the choice that they made.  Often forced into it by men who do not want to take any kind of responslibility for their actions.  It is again men who get the most benefit out of this law, many women carry the burden all the days of their lives.  I am not in branding, but into helping and healing.  We can adjust to anything, things will get worse, and we will adjust.  Until it is too late and they they come for you because you are old, in the way or a bother...you will have no say.

peace
mark



Don't be silly, of course their are risk, there are for any medical prodecure.

peace
Mark

Woe be to those who are so desperate for counseling they go to the likes of you for "professional and unbiased counseling."  I don't live in vacuuming,  I have talked to many women in both situations. Depression and grief go along with any loss, whether it is planned or not. How the loss is treated has a big role in how one deals with it.  I would advice any woman going through such a situation to seek help from a professional counselor who is unbiased.

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#63    glorybebe

glorybebe

    Non-Corporeal Being

  • Member
  • 8,699 posts
  • Joined:24 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Canada

Posted 27 November 2012 - 04:34 PM

Good gravy.  Here we go again with someone trying to tell us that their way is the right way and we should all change our opinions to match theirs.  Sure, we can feel strongly about things, but to constantly use biased information to prove a point only makes those of us who believe it is thr woman's body and business dig our heals in deeper.

Save the Earth! It's the only planet with chocolate!

#64    darkmoonlady

darkmoonlady

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,254 posts
  • Joined:09 Nov 2003
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Medford Oregon

  • Get busy livin' or get busy dyin'-Shawshank Redemption/Life is a buffet and most poor suckers are starving to death-Auntie Mame

Posted 27 November 2012 - 05:51 PM

Here is any easy fix, if you don't like abortion don't have one. If you don't have a uterus, stop worrying about it.

Edited by darkmoonlady, 27 November 2012 - 05:51 PM.

“The beauty of religious mania is that it has the power to explain everything. Once God (or Satan) is accepted as the first cause of everything which happens in the mortal world, nothing is left to chance …or change... logic can be happily tossed out the window. Religious mania is one of the few infallible ways of responding to the worlds vagaries, because it totally eliminates pure accident. To the true religious maniac, it’s ALL on purpose” – Stephen King, The Stand

#65    JGirl

JGirl

    Pajama Goddess

  • Member
  • 8,788 posts
  • Joined:23 Sep 2010
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:British Columbia Canada

Posted 27 November 2012 - 05:56 PM

View PostDarkwind, on 27 November 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

Woe be to those who are so desperate for counseling they go to the likes of you for "professional and unbiased counseling."  I don't live in vacuuming,  I have talked to many women in both situations. Depression and grief go along with any loss, whether it is planned or not. How the loss is treated has a big role in how one deals with it.  I would advice any woman going through such a situation to seek help from a professional counselor who is unbiased.
+1

JGirl's official tune of the day - hear it here!


Posted Image.. but as for this house of cards you are building..  a butterfly fart would knock it down.


#66    Beckys_Mom

Beckys_Mom

    Sarcastic Muppet..!

  • Member
  • 51,193 posts
  • Joined:01 Nov 2005
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Ireland

  • "I hate pretentious people. I mean, what is the point in applying exorbitantly extensive vocabulary, it is just straightforwardly unnecessary".

Posted 27 November 2012 - 05:59 PM

View PostDarkwind, on 27 November 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

  I would advice any woman going through such a situation to seek help from a professional counselor who is unbiased.

Exactly.. It is far better to turn to someone who is unbiased..that way you are not going to suffer any guilt or shame

I personally don't feel any woman who have their personal reasons to abort, should have to be made feel like an outcast...I wouldn't like it myself

Posted ImageRAW Berris... Dare you enter?

If there's a heaven...I hope to hell I get there !

#67    JGirl

JGirl

    Pajama Goddess

  • Member
  • 8,788 posts
  • Joined:23 Sep 2010
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:British Columbia Canada

Posted 27 November 2012 - 09:23 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 27 November 2012 - 11:37 AM, said:

Actually it is three threads  on the same topic of abortion  .. This one, the Canada one, and this - http://www.unexplain...wtopic=238269   All about abortions
isn't this considered spamming?

JGirl's official tune of the day - hear it here!


Posted Image.. but as for this house of cards you are building..  a butterfly fart would knock it down.


#68    Beckys_Mom

Beckys_Mom

    Sarcastic Muppet..!

  • Member
  • 51,193 posts
  • Joined:01 Nov 2005
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Ireland

  • "I hate pretentious people. I mean, what is the point in applying exorbitantly extensive vocabulary, it is just straightforwardly unnecessary".

Posted 27 November 2012 - 10:09 PM

View PostJGirl, on 27 November 2012 - 09:23 PM, said:

isn't this considered spamming?

It can be, but it is up to the mods to descide

Posted ImageRAW Berris... Dare you enter?

If there's a heaven...I hope to hell I get there !

#69    ZaraKitty

ZaraKitty

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,202 posts
  • Joined:10 Mar 2012
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Australia

  • I can see it in their eyes, they've already died.

Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:15 PM

View Postmarkdohle, on 27 November 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

I am not for the current law being resinded, it would only endanger women more.  However, abortions clincs are in it for the money.  Those who work there for a long time become hardened and lots of abuse does happen.  What bothers me is how people don't want to look at it.

Peace
Mark

Doctors are out to scam us by killing our babies. Must be those damn Athiests again.

The internet is a series of tubes, and those tubes are full of cats.

#70    ZaraKitty

ZaraKitty

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,202 posts
  • Joined:10 Mar 2012
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Australia

  • I can see it in their eyes, they've already died.

Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:16 PM

Can we get the mods to get dohle to stop posting multiple abortion threads? It's offensive to say the least. One was fine, but three?

The internet is a series of tubes, and those tubes are full of cats.

#71    glorybebe

glorybebe

    Non-Corporeal Being

  • Member
  • 8,699 posts
  • Joined:24 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Canada

Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:38 PM

View PostZaraKitty, on 28 November 2012 - 09:16 PM, said:

Can we get the mods to get dohle to stop posting multiple abortion threads? It's offensive to say the least. One was fine, but three?

Well, she believes strongly..... :huh:

Save the Earth! It's the only planet with chocolate!

#72    Professor Buzzkill

Professor Buzzkill

    Integrity is all we have

  • Member
  • 2,583 posts
  • Joined:20 Oct 2008
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:White Cloud

Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:50 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 27 November 2012 - 12:16 AM, said:

To sum up what I said before -  One is not a baby .. the other is..

At 8 months its an almost fully developed baby..the 8 week foetus is not..  Many will class it as murder if you kill a baby at 8 months, and the law will too, that is why they draw the line after 20 weeks in many places, it's done for a reason

EXAMPLE -  If a mother is 8 months pregnant  ( or a little over ) and she is faced with a critical medical situation, that can result to her own death..  What the doctors  will do is, remove the baby  by C-Section  ..  Do what they can to save  BOTH mother and child.. They wouldn't be likely or able to do that with an 8 week old foetus ..



Only  one is human .. The eight month old baby is a human..a baby human ... The 8 week old foetus  is not, it is still developing and has a long way to go .. When a woman is 8 months pregnant, her baby  can survive, where the 8 week old foetus cannot..   Both are worlds apart.  I explained this previously..


I love the way you deliberately left out my question in your answer.

Quote

"Let me pose my question differently. Why can we remove an 8 week old fetus from its mother to kill it, when we cannot remove an 8 month old child from its mother to kill it? Both are getting all their nurishment through the mother, both cannot survive without her constant attention and care. "


Also, there is not an accepted scientific discription of being a "person" but   Philosophers have stated (quite correctly in my opinion) "that the newborn doesn’t yet meet their definition of a “person”—“an individual who is capable of attributing to her own existence some (at least) basic value such that being deprived of this existence represents a loss to her.”"

which leads me agian to my question, why is it acceptable to kill an 8 week old fetus and not an 8 week old baby (i.e. after birth abortion)

Quote

"[W]hen circumstances occur after birth such that they would have justified abortion, what we call after-birth abortion should be permissible. … [W]e propose to call this practice ‘after-birth abortion’, rather than ‘infanticide,’ to emphasize that the moral status of the individual killed is comparable with that of a fetus … rather than to that of a child."



http://www.slate.com...fanticide_.html


#73    ZaraKitty

ZaraKitty

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,202 posts
  • Joined:10 Mar 2012
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Australia

  • I can see it in their eyes, they've already died.

Posted 29 November 2012 - 02:29 AM

View Postglorybebe, on 28 November 2012 - 09:38 PM, said:

Well, she believes strongly..... :huh:

Not an excuse, it's offensive.

Live by this, if you feel so strong: Don't like abortions? Don't have one.

stay out of everyone's business. Saying the doctors are doing it just for the money and they're 'literally' throwing away live human babies is outrageous and false. NOBODY spends 10 years at medical school just to scam you.

The internet is a series of tubes, and those tubes are full of cats.

#74    JGirl

JGirl

    Pajama Goddess

  • Member
  • 8,788 posts
  • Joined:23 Sep 2010
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:British Columbia Canada

Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:47 AM

View Postglorybebe, on 28 November 2012 - 09:38 PM, said:

Well, she believes strongly..... :huh:
she is a he - and he just opens a new thread when he doesn't want to address questions asked of him on this one. he has an agenda. he is not exposing so called scammer abortionists. he is against abortion and is doing whatever he can to put it in a bad light to serve his own belief system.

JGirl's official tune of the day - hear it here!


Posted Image.. but as for this house of cards you are building..  a butterfly fart would knock it down.


#75    darkmoonlady

darkmoonlady

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,254 posts
  • Joined:09 Nov 2003
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Medford Oregon

  • Get busy livin' or get busy dyin'-Shawshank Redemption/Life is a buffet and most poor suckers are starving to death-Auntie Mame

Posted 29 November 2012 - 04:04 AM

What I find interesting is (not knowing the OP's religion aside) the Christian agenda regarding abortion has nothing to do with biblical precedent. Before the 1850's or so abortions weren't anything to write home about until the Catholics vs. Protestant ugliness brought it to a head. That and social Darwinism which was directed at anyone thought to "out breed" the better classes of people. The bible says if you cause a woman to lose a baby (doesn't really specify when) you owe the woman five scheckles. They also didn't name their infants until a month after birth because you didn't "waste" a good name on a baby until it was viable. Take also that the Jewish Torah says a baby isn't "born" or alive until it takes its first breath. So in reality the Christian agenda wasn't so much about saving the unborn as making sure the poor didn't outbreed the better classes of people (who could afford doctors to have abortions). Since then it's just as much propaganda to get the flock all worked up to pour more money into the church.

“The beauty of religious mania is that it has the power to explain everything. Once God (or Satan) is accepted as the first cause of everything which happens in the mortal world, nothing is left to chance …or change... logic can be happily tossed out the window. Religious mania is one of the few infallible ways of responding to the worlds vagaries, because it totally eliminates pure accident. To the true religious maniac, it’s ALL on purpose” – Stephen King, The Stand




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users