Women with “seditious” eyes

[Persia]

Women unveiling their eyes in public in Saudi Arabia will be forced to fully cover up their faces if their eyes are found to be seditious, according to the Gulf Kingdom’s most feared Islamic law-enforcement group.

http://www.emirates247.com/news/region/women-with-seditious-eyes-must-cover-up-2010-11-14-1.317325

[Ketzer]

It doesn't surprise me at all. Freakin stupid.

[minera]

Women unveiling their eyes in public in Saudi Arabia will be forced to fully cover up their faces if their eyes are found to be seditious, according to the Gulf Kingdom’s most feared Islamic law-enforcement group.

http://www.emirates247.com/news/region/women-with-seditious-eyes-must-cover-up-2010-11-14-1.317325

What a backwards and ridiculous country. Maybe they should just do away with all the females, then they don't have to find more stupid laws to keep them enslaved.

[Ryinrea]

Well, it Saudis what do you expect from people that are ruled by very conservative view points?

The Saudis practices Hanbali which is the most conservative view point of Sharia Law.

Edited December 18, 2010 by Ryinrea

[meryt-tetisheri]

Women unveiling their eyes in public in Saudi Arabia will be forced to fully cover up their faces if their eyes are found to be seditious, according to the Gulf Kingdom's most feared Islamic law-enforcement group.

http://www.emirates2...-11-14-1.317325

Who defines "seditious" and how? Will it be according to the shape, color, expression, glint...???

They are going too far. They are not enforcing 'Islamic' modesty or chastity . Rather, it is as if they are going out of their way to tell the world that they believe themselves to be weak-willed, helplessly ruled by instincts, incapable of self-discipline to such an extent that a lock of hair or a pretty eye might make them go berserk! There is more than one reason to pity Saudi women !

[Knight Of Shadows]

they should make laws to prevent their men from traveling to

other countries for " pleasure " before forcing such things

beside they should also watch their " royality "

sexual behavior before waving stupid things

i never liked saudia and it's laws they're hippocrates

those who enforces those laws are the most one who break them

" in secret "

[farandaway]

With all the BS these women have to put up with, it's no wonder their eyes are 'seditious'.

I've always wondered--why are these men so afraid of women? Do they really hate their mothers, wives and daughters so much?

[Wickian]

With all the BS these women have to put up with, it's no wonder their eyes are 'seditious'.

I've always wondered--why are these men so afraid of women? Do they really hate their mothers, wives and daughters so much?

They don't hate them. They just believe their God wants them to dominate women in every possible way because women are inferior beings.

[Knight Of Shadows]

wrong actually wickian what you said total crap

the real deal is that in islam woman should keep her beauty

to her husband only and not to display it for all to see

but in case of saudia and islamic countries .. they're going too far

[minera]

wrong actually wickian what you said total crap

the real deal is that in islam woman should keep her beauty

to her husband only and not to display it for all to see

but in case of saudia and islamic countries .. they're going too far

Actually I have to agree with wickian. They do think women are second class accordng to their behavior. They think women are all hungry for sex and men and have to be kept in line or they might jump at the next male or entice and cast spells on them or something with their eyes. Ladylike behavior and modesty should not be legistlated. However the men should also be able to control their animal insticts which it seems they cannot so the women have to be hidden away from them. It is obwioius they know nothing of how men should behave towards women not like some lavicious animals. After all if women were not created there would be no men. They should respect those who give life not treat them like animals or second class citizens. In a way its good that the women hide themselves from those animalistic males who are so weak that they cannot even resist looking into the eyes of the women. Since the eyes are the window to the soul maybe they just don't like what they see.

[pickletoes]

Aren't we a bunch of hypocrites here? The Western World called it first about 20 years ago!!!!

Edited December 19, 2010 by pickletoes

[Knight Of Shadows]

who are " they " minera ??

i am a muslim and i am from middle east and i do not think

women are second glass i do not think my sister and mother is second

glass they're more successful and better than me

that and along with many many people who share this whom also muslims

what you saying is the lies that been made up about islam by world wide

media that's been focusing lately on making islam appear as bad

as they can ..

the " tradition " that you view are too strict on women are arabic

culture ... just coz it's different culture doesn't mean it's retarded

we might think the same of west ? right ? ... from your current point view

no sex before marriage ? is that a big deal ? isn't that part of christianty

too ? isn't christians non cover their body too ?

now why when muslim girl cover her body you get to call it " retarded "

or " restriction " or voilation of women right

and when a non does that ... she's honest servant of god ?

please you need to read alot on the background of the topic before

agreeing with pointviews you don't know where they came from

arabic traditions are very different than europe

by the way nothing of what you said about arabs or muslims view

women as sex hungry monsters is true

it's the opposite you're claiming thoughts on other people's behalf

how accurate could it be ?

and like i said it's all about different cultures

[minera]

(/quote)

by the way nothing of what you said about arabs or muslims view

women as sex hungry monsters is true

it's the opposite you're claiming thoughts on other people's behalf

how accurate could it be ?

and like i said it's all about different cultures

seems to me that the so called religious police are already claiming the thoughts on the behalf of their women. Therefore they have to be covered so that the male does not get 'enticed' by some woman whose eyes may look 'seditious'. I am not sure I agree with a culture that stones their women in public, do not allow them to go anywhere without a male relative and have to be completely covered even their eyes. Nor do I agree with beating women with canes as the Taliban imams did on television. But then like you say it is about different cultures............

[minera]

who are " they " minera ??

i am a muslim and i am from middle east and i do not think

women are second glass i do not think my sister and mother is second

glass they're more successful and better than me

that and along with many many people who share this whom also muslims

what you saying is the lies that been made up about islam by world wide

media that's been focusing lately on making islam appear as bad

as they can ..

the " tradition " that you view are too strict on women are arabic

culture ... just coz it's different culture doesn't mean it's retarded

we might think the same of west ? right ? ... from your current point view

no sex before marriage ? is that a big deal ? isn't that part of christianty

too ? isn't christians non cover their body too ?

now why when muslim girl cover her body you get to call it " retarded "

or " restriction " or voilation of women right

and when a non does that ... she's honest servant of god ?

please you need to read alot on the background of the topic before

agreeing with pointviews you don't know where they came from

arabic traditions are very different than europe

by the way nothing of what you said about arabs or muslims view

women as sex hungry monsters is true

it's the opposite you're claiming thoughts on other people's behalf

how accurate could it be ?

and like i said it's all about different cultures

I do live in North America but that is not the origin of MY birth. I know too well about different cultures.

But I also know there are fanatics that take cultural beliefs and behavior and hide behind their different religions.

In some cultures a woman can be killed to save the family 'honor' or if her family did not provide enough 'dowry' etc.

What I am saying is that the over zealous 'religious' police are taking things too far where a woman cannot even show her eyes in public in case it might offend some man. There is no where in the Quoran where women have to cover themselves and even their eyes. I agree abbout modesty and proper behavior but I disagree when it is complete control. Arabic traditions are one thing but but it should not be legistlated into law. Only God has a right to decide who is worthy not man. Also there are Arab cultures that do not force to comply to law of how to dress or behave with 'religious police'.

[minera]

who are " they " minera ??

i am a muslim and i am from middle east and i do not think

women are second glass i do not think my sister and mother is second

glass they're more successful and better than me

that and along with many many people who share this whom also muslims

what you saying is the lies that been made up about islam by world wide

media that's been focusing lately on making islam appear as bad

as they can ..

the " tradition " that you view are too strict on women are arabic

culture ... just coz it's different culture doesn't mean it's retarded

we might think the same of west ? right ? ... from your current point view

no sex before marriage ? is that a big deal ? isn't that part of christianty

too ? isn't christians non cover their body too ?

now why when muslim girl cover her body you get to call it " retarded "

or " restriction " or voilation of women right

and when a non does that ... she's honest servant of god ?

please you need to read alot on the background of the topic before

agreeing with pointviews you don't know where they came from

arabic traditions are very different than europe

by the way nothing of what you said about arabs or muslims view

women as sex hungry monsters is true

it's the opposite you're claiming thoughts on other people's behalf

how accurate could it be ?

and like i said it's all about different cultures

I don't think I used the word 'retarded'. That would imply that someone was backwards in some way.

But maybe you can clarify to me if it is religious or cultural to cover ones' self?

A 'nun' on the other hand is supposedly 'married' to her church and religion, and not only is she considered a 'servant' but also the 'wife' to the

holy spirit. But today nuns do not dress in completely covering garments,rather depending on their convent the cover their heads.

So are we talking about Arabic traditions or religious enforcement to adhere to a law made by men? I know quite a few muslims and they do not wear the

burqua or a head scarf....but then I guess they are a different culture of Muslims than those is Saudi Arabia. In some cultures they believed in human sacrifice. Usually in those cases they were once again young virgin girls who were sacrificed. Either way I think the Saudi's are getting carried away with their 'religious police' and there is nothing 'cultural' about it. By 'them' I am reffering to the 'religious police' and the fanatic imams who do not seem to trust their women to behave according to the cultural norm....unless it is by some way suggesting it is a 'religious' behavior and nothing to do with culture.

[pickletoes]

Minerva, for you to try to absolve Christianity or Western culture from barbaric acts and condemn Arabic culture is a bit sad. I agree with King that many cultures have things in them that fanatics take too far. It is inappropriate to judge a group by the actions of a group of extremists.

Don't Christians make this argument when "The West Borough Baptist Church" or Jim Jones and the People's Temple, David Koresh, KKK members that praise God and believe he wants a separated race system, do things like tie black men to the backs of pick up trucks and drag them around until they die, assassination of Martin Luther King Jr. and other religious black leaders etc burn crosses on people's property and lynch them, attack homosexuals, kill homosexuals, kill people who run abortion clinics, etc etc etc.

Also the Anabaptist Sects in the US still wear head coverings. Not only that but it was part of the Catholic Canon for women to cover their heads in Catholic churches all the way up to 1983.

http://www.catholicdoors.com/faq/qu249.htm

I don't know where you are getting your information but Nuns certainly do cover up these days. It depends on where you go.

And don't forget about the extremism of the Anchoresses of the Middle Ages. They often had themselves walled into churches to prove their devotion to God.

http://sandradodd.com/sca/anchoress

[Corp]

You know the people you've listed are seen a wackos by the majority of Christians right? And that none of their believes are part of Western legal systems? No one is forcing all women to the nuns so you can't compare the two cases.

[minera]

Minerva, for you to try to absolve Christianity or Western culture from barbaric acts and condemn Arabic culture is a bit sad. I agree with King that many cultures have things in them that fanatics take too far. It is inappropriate to judge a group by the actions of a group of extremists.

Don't Christians make this argument when "The West Borough Baptist Church" or Jim Jones and the People's Temple, David Koresh, KKK members that praise God and believe he wants a separated race system, do things like tie black men to the backs of pick up trucks and drag them around until they die, assassination of Martin Luther King Jr. and other religious black leaders etc burn crosses on people's property and lynch them, attack homosexuals, kill homosexuals, kill people who run abortion clinics, etc etc etc.

Also the Anabaptist Sects in the US still wear head coverings. Not only that but it was part of the Catholic Canon for women to cover their heads in Catholic churches all the way up to 1983.

http://www.catholicdoors.com/faq/qu249.htm

I don't know where you are getting your information but Nuns certainly do cover up these days. It depends on where you go.

And don't forget about the extremism of the Anchoresses of the Middle Ages. They often had themselves walled into churches to prove their devotion to God.

http://sandradodd.com/sca/anchoress

My aunt is a nun. In Italy some nuns wear the habit, some just the head covering. As I said it depends where you are but most do not wear the full garment not even during mass in the Vatican. I was there when Pope John Paul died, and while nuns were distinguishable they were not dressed in the complete black garbs.

I am not trying to absolve Christianity by any means. I have my own view on religion, and even though I am Catholic I do not attend Church unless its funeral or babtism. There are reasons but I do not belive in organized religion. I believe in the creator of everything and it is non denominational and we are all a part of it and I say it because it is sexless. An energy that is a part of everything and everyone. To me cultures are introduced to keep humans of like mind and family ties together and separate from the rest. I find religion is no longer soul motivated but politically so. People can believe what they chose but I never understood why in almost all religions and cultures women are always been treated as less important than men and somehow property. Despite what religions say we are animals. No different than any other animal on this planet and we are not 'special' or above them as we tend to think. But we are also dangerous, not only to each other but to this planet we call home. Its just a matter of time before we destroy ourselves because of religion and politics.

I am not trying to absolve Christianity for anything. I am not a Christian, although born Catholic I have attended other churches and so far I like the Buddist religion the best. It teaches love and Karma which I belive. We are here to learn. If we oppress others we will be oppressed in the next life.

Amaste

[Jinx Jack]

These Laws are simply creating alot of other problems...such as same sex attraction. there has been alot of cases here specially with boys, and to much extent girls also. There is no-point in covering the eyes, cause women here have found another way to show off(or whatever you might call it) by wearing body fitting Burqa(whole body veils).

[minera]

Minerva, for you to try to absolve Christianity or Western culture from barbaric acts and condemn Arabic culture is a bit sad. I agree with King that many cultures have things in them that fanatics take too far. It is inappropriate to judge a group by the actions of a group of extremists.

Don't Christians make this argument when "The West Borough Baptist Church" or Jim Jones and the People's Temple, David Koresh, KKK members that praise God and believe he wants a separated race system, do things like tie black men to the backs of pick up trucks and drag them around until they die, assassination of Martin Luther King Jr. and other religious black leaders etc burn crosses on people's property and lynch them, attack homosexuals, kill homosexuals, kill people who run abortion clinics, etc etc etc.

Also the Anabaptist Sects in the US still wear head coverings. Not only that but it was part of the Catholic Canon for women to cover their heads in Catholic churches all the way up to 1983.

http://www.catholicdoors.com/faq/qu249.htm

I don't know where you are getting your information but Nuns certainly do cover up these days. It depends on where you go.

And don't forget about the extremism of the Anchoresses of the Middle Ages. They often had themselves walled into churches to prove their devotion to God.

http://sandradodd.com/sca/anchoress

I am not absolving Christianity of anything nor do I blame the Arab culture for their behavior. I just dislike how women are treated by both religions although some religions more than others. Actually the topic had nothing to do with religion just the fact that some fanatics found another way to take away rights of women and like it or not whe one has no say about ones life of even allowed to took at the world without covering their eyes, it is a form of ownership and enslavement. What next, they cut out the womens tounges because they might have 'sexy' or lavicious voices?????

[Knight Of Shadows]

well minera you should know that you taking " taliban leader " or something

as example of all muslims ?

you originally saying that all muslims view women as sex hungry ?

and also agreeing that in islam women are being less than men ?

you were refering to points that has no facts in it

traditions are simple cases such example :

arabic girls don't have sex before marriage

western girls might does that before marriage even have kids before

merriage

this is what it means different traditions and cultures

you comparing different traditions and blame it on religion

and i had no idea what you were talking about the nun

my point was christians nuns wear full body cover except face

muslims girls wears hair cover too ? so what's the big deal ?

you did not explained why it's different

married to church or spirit or else ... does that makes the muslim

girl who wear the same as nun ? less than men ?

DO YOU THINK NUNS ARE LESS THAN MEN IN CHRISTIANITY ?

i myself don't think so

and for islamic pointviews islam suggest " there's no forcing in the religion "

it's hadith of the prophet mohamaad meaning a girl who do not want

to wear headcover she's free to do so .. of course she's breaking

islamic rulez but when she meets her god he can judge her for it

but you looking at some stupid examples of islam such as " saudia "

and " taliban " are you serious ?

my sisters wore their hair cover on their free will at the age of

18 before they used to go out without it and they're muslims

like i said .. cultures has main role in it

and because a culture is different than yours doesn't make your culture

is better or the right one ?

this is a mere example so treat it lightly

an arabic person with arabic culture and background

would say about a western woman who have sex with person she just met

a whore ? do you think that's justifed ?

from his look and pointview it's very wrong

but from your look and culture it's normal thing ?

you still don't get it ?

and when you want to discuss islam saudia arabia isn't the best

example of it .. it's the worst

their laws only applies on the poor and weak

and they turn blind eyes on their royals who does the worst things

[minera]

You know the people you've listed are seen a wackos by the majority of Christians right? And that none of their believes are part of Western legal systems? No one is forcing all women to the nuns so you can't compare the two cases.

I agree with Corp. What do all the nutcases or extremist have to do with forcing a woman to cover her eyes because some Imam in Saudi decided it was somehow breaking religious law and the 'religious police' should enforce them to cover their eyes. No one can say that is not control. It has nothing to do with piety or religion but with control by some pretty nutty individuals. Imagine getting arrested by the religious police if you hold your wife's hand while walking in public. Those old fools (the Imams)know nothing about affection and somehow view everything in a sexual context.

[meryt-tetisheri]

There is no place really for discussing Christianity here. The comparison should be between different traditions and different interpretations of both Quran & Hadith; both being vague enough to allow different definitions of 'modesty' required, or which parts exactly should be covered exactly.The tradition of covering the eyes is native to some, but not all, parts of Saudi Arabia. It remains a fact that Muslim women are forbidden to cover their faces during haj (pilgrimage) when they are in the holiest sanctuary of Islam. The problem is there are those who are pushing for it even outside SA. Personally I find it inhumane to force a woman to walk in the sun at +45° c temperature, totally wrapped up in thick black material, now even her eyes would be covered, further adding damaged eye sight to the burqa's health risks. I also find it profoundly insulting to the men who require it!

[Knight Of Shadows]

I agree with Corp. What do all the nutcases or extremist have to do with forcing a woman to cover her eyes because some Imam in Saudi decided it was somehow breaking religious law and the 'religious police' should enforce them to cover their eyes. No one can say that is not control. It has nothing to do with piety or religion but with control by some pretty nutty individuals. Imagine getting arrested by the religious police if you hold your wife's hand while walking in public. Those old fools (the Imams)know nothing about affection and somehow view everything in a sexual context.

Geee you keep insulting people and using words you don't know what

they means !!

" Imam " is the arabic words to describe the person who's leading

the prayer in the Mosque ! they has nothing to do with enforcing laws

or such ..

[minera]

Geee you keep insulting people and using words you don't know what

they means !!

" Imam " is the arabic words to describe the person who's leading

the prayer in the Mosque ! they has nothing to do with enforcing laws

or such ..

Well I guess if I used a word I don't know is insulting then it is not intentionally insulting, so my appologies about the Imam 'insult'.

Actually I am referring to the "The Commission for the Promotion of Virtue and Prevention of Vice" member in Saudi Arabia who demanded that a mans wife must cover her eyes because they were too seditious. A fight ensued and the husband was stabbed in the back by the said 'prevention of vice' member. I guess not covering ones eyes if they are female is a worse 'vice' than stabbing someone in the back. And if you consider that sort of behavior as a normal cultural behavior then I am surprized, particularly since the so called Vice Prevention member had no right to speak to another mans wife in such a way that he insulted her husband and to top it off stabbed the poor man who righteously defended his wife's honor in the back.