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[Archived]Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood


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#4921    Abramelin

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 12:10 PM

View PostThe Puzzler, on 16 May 2011 - 11:42 AM, said:

joy
early 13c., "feeling of pleasure and delight," from O.Fr. joie, from L. gaudia, pl. of gaudium "joy," from gaudere "rejoice," from PIE base *gau- (cf. Gk. gaio "I rejoice," M.Ir. guaire "noble"). Joy-riding is Amer.Eng., 1908.

http://www.etymonlin...ex.php?term=joy

I think when the slaves were freed, from Babylon, say, they rejoiced quite a bit.

Check my etymology for "goat", a page back.

I really am clairvoyant, LOL !!

==

Quote

The word noble as in to know has no connection - what has connection in the form of noble is:

Nobility, a hereditary caste
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble

Noble may be to know, as in famous, but nobility is always about class and distinction of caste as Wiki tells us above. Free or a slave. Slaves were not nobility.

I have heard of noble slaves, and I also have heard of imprisoned nobility.

Noble is about respect and power and being generous.

OK, this is not my thing.


#4922    The Puzzler

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 12:23 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 16 May 2011 - 12:10 PM, said:

Check my etymology for "goat", a page back.

I really am clairvoyant, LOL !!

==



I have heard of noble slaves, and I also have heard of imprisoned nobility.

Noble is about respect and power and being generous.

OK, this is not my thing.

Some things are not my thing.

Generally it was imo a noble prince who was seen as such, maybe King Arthur or Galahad - but the noble part is really who they were, royalty or freemen and not slaves. (imo)


About goat, think of Pan here - he is a goat - he is also a possible form of Hades, as the Devil or Satan in Hell, the red hot inferno of death, that was once Hades.

So, that goat and gadir are very much alike again doesn't suprise me because the base is probably some kind of same word for the person who was in Hell. The gatekeeper or something, it will come to me.


The goat is very tied in with the Underworld.

The scapegoat was a goat that was designated (Hebrew לַעֲזָאזֵֽל ) la-aza'zeyl; either "for absolute removal" (Brown-Driver-Briggs Lexicon) or possibly "for Azazel" (some modern versions taking the term as a name) and outcast in the desert as part of the ceremonies of the Day of Atonement, that began during the Exodus with the original Tabernacle and continued through the times of the temples in Jerusalem.

Throughout the year and on the Day of Atonement, the the record of all the sins of the Israelites was transferred to the Tabernacle by the blood of the sacrifices. On the Day of Atonement, the tabernacle was cleansed of all the accumulated sins by the ritual described in Leviticus 16. At that time the high priest transfers the accumulated sins from the tabernacle to the scapegoat which is then sent into the desert wilderness. The Tabernacle is thus cleansed of sin.[6]

This has been interpreted to be a prefigure of the final judgment by which sin is removed forever from the universe. Through the sacrifice of Jesus, the sins of the believers are forgiven them, but the fact that sins were committed still exist on record in the "Books" of heaven (see Revelation 20:12). After the final judgment, the responsibility for all those forgiven sins are accredited to the originator of sin, Satan. After which, Satan is destroyed in the Lake of Fire. Sin no longer will exist anywhere.[7]

Since this goat is sent away to perish,[8] the word "scapegoat" has come to mean a person who is blamed and punished for the sins, crimes or sufferings of others, generally as a way of distracting attention from the real causes. The story of the scapegoat in Leviticus has also been interpreted as a symbolic prefigure of the self-sacrifice of Jesus, who takes the sins of humanity on his own head, having been crucified on a cross outside the city by order of the high priests.

http://en.wikipedia....ki/Scapegoating

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#4923    The Puzzler

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 12:57 PM

The primary sense seems to have been "beloved, friend, to love;" which in some languages (notably Germanic and Celtic) developed also a sense of "free," perhaps from the terms "beloved" or "friend" being applied to the free members of one's clan (as opposed to slaves, cf. L. liberi, meaning both "free" and "children"). Cf. Goth. frijon "to love;" O.E. freod "affection, friendship," friga "love," friğu "peace;" O.N. friğr, Ger. Friede "peace;" O.E. freo "wife;" O.N. Frigg "wife of Odin," lit. "beloved" or "loving;" M.L.G. vrien "to take to wife, Du. vrijen, Ger. freien "to woo."
http://www.etymonlin...x.php?term=free


Note Liberi is there. Also Frya comes from these forms too. Freyr only means Lord because the word is relative to free or liberi.

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#4924    Abramelin

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 01:10 PM

This is more my thing:


View PostAbramelin, on 14 May 2011 - 04:04 PM, said:


It's the Pax Christi symbol, said the have been composed/seen by Emperor Constantine (a merging of the Greek letters chi and rho):

Posted Image
monogram Chi-Rho
According to Sir Flinders Petrie - the Egyptologist - the monogram Chi-Rho was the emblem of the Egyptian God, Horus, thousands of years before Christ and is therefore a link between Horus the savior, and Christ the savior. I had already noted on several occasions the links between these ancient characters and so this was highly believable and conclusive.


And also notice the alpha and omega signs.. the beginning and end...  of the Yule wheel??

http://www.nissaba.n...opic.php?t=1022

Another 'christian' influence in the OLB??

++++++++

EDIT:

From the OLB:

"What appears at the top is the signs of the Juul—that is, the first symbol of Wr-alda, also of the origin or beginning from which Time is derived; this is the Kroder, which must always go round with the Juul."

http://oeralinda.angelfire.com/

Well, what is that 'kroder' thing... it is a wheelbarrow : http://kroder-krooder.hyves.nl/ (or the one using it, a "kruier"/"krooier" in Dutch)

Posted Image

Now look again at the chi-rho symbol again, and look at the top.

Nice 'kroder', eh??

.
.


All this talking about God for a while (ADEL) really inspired me, lol.

I have been talking about the Christian (or adopted by Christians) sign of the Chi-Rho.

What became very popular soon after it was adopted/invented, was adding the Greek letters Alpha and Omega, left and right of the sign:


Posted Image

The extra letters point to a proverb about God: "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."

Now watch this example of the Yule Wheel in the Oera Linda Book (it is right below the letter index in the OLB, Plate II, http://oeralinda.angelfire.com/#at ):

Posted Image

The OLB letters around the circle say, WRALDA. What is realy nice, is that left is the OLB letter for "A" and to the right is the OLB letter for "W". The OLB "W" is of course not the same as the Greek Omega, but it sure as hell looks similar. So top right of the Yule wheel you have the first letter of Wralda, top left you have the last letter of Wralda.

And for those who don't know, Wralda is the OLB equivalent for God.

This is all about Christian ideas slipping into the OLB. No surprize when you consider who are the 'suspects', heh.

==

EDIT:

To make it even more clear: here the Chi-Rho sign with added OLB Yule wheel "kroder" (=wheelbarrow) on top:

Posted Image

.

Edited by Abramelin, 16 May 2011 - 01:38 PM.


#4925    The Puzzler

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 02:19 PM

Wheelbarrow hey, OK, I could see that, cool.

Just one wheel on a wheelbarrow, the wheel pusher, the one who pushes the time around - the Kroder.

Like one of those Council workers who pushes along the stick with a wheel to measure the distance as the wheel turns it measures...

Didn't Otharus say before about Alpha and Omega letters as part of Wralda?

I'm not sure what symbol is being referred to as the Horus one that is a chi-ro one unless the ankh is meant...?

But certainly, Horus is symbolic of Jesus as well.

Self-taught amateur Egyptologist Gerald Massey argued that the deity of Horus and Jesus shared identical mythological origins in his 1907 book Ancient Egypt, the light of the world.[12] His views have been repeated by theologian and Toronto Star columnist Tom Harpur, author Acharya S, and political comedian Bill Maher.[13][14][15] Theologian W. Ward Gasque composed an e-mail to twenty leading Egyptologists, including Professor Emeritus of Egyptology at the University of Liverpool Kenneth Kitchen, and Professor of Egyptology at the University of Toronto Ron Leprohan. The e-mail detailed the comparisons alleged by Massey which had been repeated by Harpur. The scholars were unanimous in dismissing any similarities suggested by Massey, and one Egyptologist criticized the comparison as "fringe nonsense."[16]

To the right a 15th century painting by Fra Filippo Lippi of the Madonna. On the left Isis and Horus, respectively the wife-sister and son of Osiris. "When Christianity was spreading across the Empire, it's clear that it deliberately took images from the pagan world in which it lived and into which it spread and used those images."[17] Egyptologist E. A. Wallis Budge suggests possible connections or parallels in Osiris' resurrection story with those found in Christianity:

"The Egyptians of every period in which they are known to us believed that Osiris was of divine origin, that he suffered death and mutilation at the hands of the powers of evil, that after a great struggle with these powers he rose again, that he became henceforth the king of the underworld and judge of the dead, and that because he had conquered death the righteous also might conquer death...In Osiris the Christian Egyptians found the prototype of Christ, and in the pictures and statues of Isis suckling her son Horus, they perceived the prototypes of the Virgin Mary and her child."



The OLB tells us also that Jessos is called Buda.

The study of Jesus from a mythographical perspective is the examination of the narrative of Jesus, the Christ ("the Anointed") of the gospels, Christian theology and folk Christianity as a central part of Christian mythology. It has been noted since antiquity, and in modern scholarship since the 19th century, that Jesus Christ has striking parallels to other deities worshipped in Hellenistic religion, specifically to the cult of Dionysus in the Greek mystery religions and with the Buddha.
http://en.wikipedia....ative_mythology

They report as I said before that Christians worship Serapis as Christ, so the trinity is really God, earth and bounty, father, mother, son (children).

Osiris ruling the Underworld sounds rather Hades-like too.

I'm not really sure what you were pointing out in your post...

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#4926    The Puzzler

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 02:40 PM

In the OLB Kroder is later translated as carrier,

Whenever the Carrier has completed a period


It reminds me of the turtle who carries the world on his back, he would be a carrier too.

--------

I don't beleive that Steele guy's translation is right, I think this is said literally...

Sixteen hundred years ago (she writes, 593 B.C.), Atland was submerged; and at that time something happened which nobody had reckoned upon.

AT THAT TIME.

It doesn't say, now.

That is Jessos was born when Atland was submerged. I reckon he's been floating around for way longer than 2000 years.

So, this Buda/Jessos person born at that time -

He was taught the manners and customs of the Frisians by his Frisian friend, who was actually a slave at the time and Jessos bought his freedom from him.

He LIBERATED him.

Jesus - Liber. I can also say that I think you'll find purse can equate to DEL.

So, if this same teaching is of Horus, it would mean it's quite possible the OLB is truthful in telling us that this man born around 2193BC in/near Atland was the original man who spread the message of 'Jesus', which in fact, according to the OLB, was really FRISIAN.

Therefore, in all cultures who took this Liber God on, that is, Horus, Dionysus, Liber, Jesus, Buddha, were really taking on Frisian values.

That's why it compares both Frya and Jessos in the one sentence as equals. When the light of Frya and Jessos has been extinguished...

Edited by The Puzzler, 16 May 2011 - 02:45 PM.

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#4927    Abramelin

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 02:45 PM

View PostThe Puzzler, on 16 May 2011 - 02:19 PM, said:

Wheelbarrow hey, OK, I could see that, cool.

Just one wheel on a wheelbarrow, the wheel pusher, the one who pushes the time around - the Kroder.

Like one of those Council workers who pushes along the stick with a wheel to measure the distance as the wheel turns it measures...

Didn't Otharus say before about Alpha and Omega letters as part of Wralda?

I'm not sure what symbol is being referred to as the Horus one that is a chi-ro one unless the ankh is meant...?

But certainly, Horus is symbolic of Jesus as well.

Self-taught amateur Egyptologist Gerald Massey argued that the deity of Horus and Jesus shared identical mythological origins in his 1907 book Ancient Egypt, the light of the world.[12] His views have been repeated by theologian and Toronto Star columnist Tom Harpur, author Acharya S, and political comedian Bill Maher.[13][14][15] Theologian W. Ward Gasque composed an e-mail to twenty leading Egyptologists, including Professor Emeritus of Egyptology at the University of Liverpool Kenneth Kitchen, and Professor of Egyptology at the University of Toronto Ron Leprohan. The e-mail detailed the comparisons alleged by Massey which had been repeated by Harpur. The scholars were unanimous in dismissing any similarities suggested by Massey, and one Egyptologist criticized the comparison as "fringe nonsense."[16]

To the right a 15th century painting by Fra Filippo Lippi of the Madonna. On the left Isis and Horus, respectively the wife-sister and son of Osiris. "When Christianity was spreading across the Empire, it's clear that it deliberately took images from the pagan world in which it lived and into which it spread and used those images."[17] Egyptologist E. A. Wallis Budge suggests possible connections or parallels in Osiris' resurrection story with those found in Christianity:

"The Egyptians of every period in which they are known to us believed that Osiris was of divine origin, that he suffered death and mutilation at the hands of the powers of evil, that after a great struggle with these powers he rose again, that he became henceforth the king of the underworld and judge of the dead, and that because he had conquered death the righteous also might conquer death...In Osiris the Christian Egyptians found the prototype of Christ, and in the pictures and statues of Isis suckling her son Horus, they perceived the prototypes of the Virgin Mary and her child."



The OLB tells us also that Jessos is called Buda.

The study of Jesus from a mythographical perspective is the examination of the narrative of Jesus, the Christ ("the Anointed") of the gospels, Christian theology and folk Christianity as a central part of Christian mythology. It has been noted since antiquity, and in modern scholarship since the 19th century, that Jesus Christ has striking parallels to other deities worshipped in Hellenistic religion, specifically to the cult of Dionysus in the Greek mystery religions and with the Buddha.
http://en.wikipedia....ative_mythology

They report as I said before that Christians worship Serapis as Christ, so the trinity is really God, earth and bounty, father, mother, son (children).

Osiris ruling the Underworld sounds rather Hades-like too.

I'm not really sure what you were pointing out in your post...


"I'm not really sure what you were pointing out in your post..."

What I am pointing out in the last post, and other posts, is that Christian symbols and ideas have been used for the OLB: monotheism, Jesus, the Flood, and now this Chi-Rho thing.

If you consider who are the suspects for creating the OLB, then it is no surprize at all.

And whatever the origins of the Chi-Rho sign may be, it became truelly popular in the Christian era. And of course the one with the added Greek letters, Alpha and Omega. Just compare the Chi-Rho sign with the Alpha and Omega ("I am the Begining and the End, the First and Last" and so on) with the Yule wheel where the letters A and W, the end and beginning are on top, A and W being the end and beginning of Wralda...

=

Yes, Otharus thought the Omega sign stands for the Yule weheel (or visa versa); he even showed a Yoga Asana that depicted/resembled a circle/Yule wheel.


#4928    Abramelin

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 02:52 PM

Kroder => kruier => carrier.

What the kruier/carrier uses is a 'kroder' or wheelbarrow.

(I showed you a Hyves site (a Dutch sort of Facebook) for people with the family name Kroder and Krooder, and it uses a wheelbarrow as background pic.}

The carrier in the Yule wheel carries time around the year wheel.

The whole point is not trying to dissect every word you read to pieces, the point is simply seeing a large similarity (in appearence and meaning) between the used symbols.


#4929    The Puzzler

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 03:06 PM

Back to the Underworld, I already covered Idunna, Ithunna to Athena before.

Yes, she has eggs in the OLB but maybe over time by the time we see her later as Nahallenia and Idunna the eggs have become apples. I see them as near identical symbols. The eggs are relative to the Sun God and in the same types of Slavic religions, the sun is an apple, so they seem interchangable to me.

Here's an interesting person carrying a basket of eggs:

Another legend tells of when Mary Magdalene went to the sepulchre to anoint the body of Jesus. She had with her a basket of eggs to serve as a repast. When she arrived at the sepulchre and uncovered the eggs, the pure white shells had miraculously taken on a rainbow of colors.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pysanka

If you go to that website, check out those gorgeous eggs, how marvellous a workmanship on those, I love them.

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#4930    The Puzzler

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 03:27 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 16 May 2011 - 02:52 PM, said:

Kroder => kruier => carrier.

What the kruier/carrier uses is a 'kroder' or wheelbarrow.

(I showed you a Hyves site (a Dutch sort of Facebook) for people with the family name Kroder and Krooder, and it uses a wheelbarrow as background pic.}

The carrier in the Yule wheel carries time around the year wheel.

The whole point is not trying to dissect every word you read to pieces, the point is simply seeing a large similarity (in appearence and meaning) between the used symbols.
I do both.

Middle English carrien from Anglo-Norman carier (modern French: charrier). Replaced native Middle English ferien "to carry, transport, convey" (from Old English ferian) and Middle English aberen "to carry, bear, endure" (from Old English āberan).

Bear, endure...

Posted Image

The main man carrier of them all, he bears the weight of the Heavens and endures the pain of it. He is the carrier of the wheel of Heaven.


The etymology of the name Atlas is uncertain and still debated. Virgil took pleasure in translating etymologies of Greek names by combining them with adjectives that explained them: for Atlas his adjective is durus, "hard, enduring",[7] which suggested to George Doig[8] that Virgil was aware of the Greek τλήναι "to endure"; Doig offers the further possibility that Virgil was aware of Strabo's remark that the native North African name for this mountain was Douris.[9]

Some modern linguists derive it and its Greek root from the Proto-Indo-European root *tel, 'to uphold, support'; others[citation needed] suggest that it is a pre-Indo-European name.

Thus, he was Atlas Telamon, "enduring Atlas," and became a doublet of Koios, the embodiment of the celestial axis around which the heavens revolve.


http://en.wikipedia....tlas_(mythology)

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#4931    SlimJim22

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 03:54 PM

The Chi-Ro actually comes more from Mithras as the cosmic Christ that Jesus Christ. It is impressive that they chose a symbol that is so significant when you increase the scope beyond the material world. It is heavily involved with the precessional cycle (as a lot of myths are) and various other mysteries.

The so-called celestial origin of crucifixion in solar myths is said to be a sun crossing over the celestial equator, the heavenly sign of the equinoxes. The image of a crossover in the sky would be a cross like the Greek letter Chi (X) not a Plus (+). The traditional Roman sign of the Christian was Chi Ro, the first two letters of the name Christ.
Plato, in his dialogue Timaeus said that when the creator of the universe first formed the cosmos, he shaped its substance in the form of the letter X, representing the intersection of the zodiac and the celestial equator (or the ecliptic and celestial planes), which depicts the cosmic sphere.


Eggs on the other hand are thought to represent mushrooms when they are carried in baskets. This goes back to Ishtar and Tammuz and maybe Isis and Horus. The thing is, wouldn't that means it predates 2193bce. Supposing the OLB was genuine wouldn't it be more likely that Egypt influenced the Frisians rather than the other way round?

http://www.atlantean...nd-phoenix.html

"I belive no thing, I follow the Law of One. I am a Man-O'-Sion under construction."

#4932    Abramelin

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 04:31 PM

Puzz, you are suggesting that Kroder comes from Atlas, or visa versa??

LOL, now I can't wait to see how you will distort these names, and make them change into eachother.


.

Edited by Abramelin, 16 May 2011 - 04:33 PM.


#4933    Abramelin

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 04:35 PM

View PostSlimJim22, on 16 May 2011 - 03:54 PM, said:

The Chi-Ro actually comes more from Mithras as the cosmic Christ that Jesus Christ. It is impressive that they chose a symbol that is so significant when you increase the scope beyond the material world. It is heavily involved with the precessional cycle (as a lot of myths are) and various other mysteries.

The so-called celestial origin of crucifixion in solar myths is said to be a sun crossing over the celestial equator, the heavenly sign of the equinoxes. The image of a crossover in the sky would be a cross like the Greek letter Chi (X) not a Plus (+). The traditional Roman sign of the Christian was Chi Ro, the first two letters of the name Christ.
Plato, in his dialogue Timaeus said that when the creator of the universe first formed the cosmos, he shaped its substance in the form of the letter X, representing the intersection of the zodiac and the celestial equator (or the ecliptic and celestial planes), which depicts the cosmic sphere.


Eggs on the other hand are thought to represent mushrooms when they are carried in baskets. This goes back to Ishtar and Tammuz and maybe Isis and Horus. The thing is, wouldn't that means it predates 2193bce. Supposing the OLB was genuine wouldn't it be more likely that Egypt influenced the Frisians rather than the other way round?

http://www.atlantean...nd-phoenix.html

But Jim, it is not just about the Chi-Rho sign, it is about the Chi-Rho sign to which , left and right, two Greek letters have been added.

And THAT was a Christian 'invention'.

And THAT combination looks a lot like the OLB Yule wheel with Wralda written around it and a 'kroder' on top.

.

Edited by Abramelin, 16 May 2011 - 04:48 PM.


#4934    Abramelin

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 05:54 PM

The Christian influences in the OLB:


We have the parable of the 10 virgins:

At that time the kingdom of heaven will be like ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom. Five of them were foolish and five were wise. (Mat 25:1,2)


And we have the Vestal Virgins, who didn't really disappear but 'transformed' into nuns:

While the Pontifex Maximus continues to the present day as an office of the higher order in the Catholic Church, the order of the vestals was disbanded in 394 AD, when non-Christian cults were banned by Theodosius. The Church, wisely trying to keep the general population with a sense of familiarity, readily adopted the use of convents and position of nuns that held many of the same rules and customs as the Vestals.

http://www.unrv.com/...tal-virgins.php

In ancient Roman religion, the Vestals or Vestal Virgins (Vestales, singular Vestalis), were priestesses of Vesta, goddess of the hearth. The College of the Vestals and its well-being was regarded as fundamental to the continuance and security of Rome, as embodied by their cultivation of the sacred fire that could not be allowed to go out.

http://en.wikipedia....i/Vestal_Virgin

Compare that with the OLB and it's eternal flame/lamps carrying virgins, and the OLB "Fasta" of course.


We have Noah's Flood (2194 BC according to the OLB).

We have a monotheistic religion (Wralda/Jahweh).

We have a Yule wheel (with 'kroder'/wagonbarrow, or the letter -P- and the end and beginning of the name of Wralda, A and W), a sign much alike the Chi-Rho symbol with the Alpha and Omega.

We have the oppostion between liberal/humanistic and conservative (or primitive, superstitious, believing just about anything, meant to scare and dominate people) religion, the Fryans and the 'Fijnen'/Finns/Magyar.

We have an OLB Jessos, and the Jesus of the Christians.

=

Concerning the main 'suspects' of creating the OLB:

Joost Halbertsma was a vicar/linguist/historian/fanatic Frisian nationalist, Haverschmidt was a preacher/poet/loved to write using an alias.

I think I will find more.

Edited by Abramelin, 16 May 2011 - 06:10 PM.


#4935    Abramelin

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 06:16 PM

View PostThe Puzzler, on 16 May 2011 - 03:06 PM, said:

Back to the Underworld, I already covered Idunna, Ithunna to Athena before.

Yes, she has eggs in the OLB but maybe over time by the time we see her later as Nahallenia and Idunna the eggs have become apples. I see them as near identical symbols. The eggs are relative to the Sun God and in the same types of Slavic religions, the sun is an apple, so they seem interchangable to me.

Here's an interesting person carrying a basket of eggs:

Another legend tells of when Mary Magdalene went to the sepulchre to anoint the body of Jesus. She had with her a basket of eggs to serve as a repast. When she arrived at the sepulchre and uncovered the eggs, the pure white shells had miraculously taken on a rainbow of colors.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pysanka

If you go to that website, check out those gorgeous eggs, how marvellous a workmanship on those, I love them.

OK, great, another possible Christian influence on the OLB.



+++

EDIT:

We all know the saying, "If you can't beat them, join them."

But I think the 19th century Frisian nationalists had a better idea: "If you can't beat them, twist their words, and use their words to your own advantage."

It was a kind of mental judo...

.

Edited by Abramelin, 16 May 2011 - 06:34 PM.