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Evolution - really?


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#31    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 09:52 PM

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 09:46 PM, said:

Okay, a good response, at least you know how to defend your position. But every piece of evidence you have presented could also be explained by God creating all living things with a degree of similarity. As for the bacteria thing, that is an example of micro evolution, which does happen. Thats why there are different breeds of dogs and other such things. But evolution does not account for the origin of life.

Evolution has never claimed to explain the origins of life. It only has to do with the changes in a population of organisms over time. More specifically, the change in the allele frequency of a population over time. That is all evolution is. Micro and macro evolution are the same thing, the only difference is time.

Edit: God did it is not even a hypotheses. It can be a belief, but is scientifically meaningless. (Thus a biologist like myself dismisses it) It cannot be tested, it cannot be observed, and more importantly, cannot be falsified. The beauty of the Theory of Evolution is that it would only take one piece of evidence to falsify it. One out of place fossil, one organism (on Earth) that does not share genetic similarities. This evidence has not, and has never, been found.

Edited by Imaginarynumber1, 03 September 2012 - 09:55 PM.

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#32    The Mule

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:07 PM

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 09:46 PM, said:

Okay, a good response, at least you know how to defend your position. But every piece of evidence you have presented could also be explained by God creating all living things with a degree of similarity. As for the bacteria thing, that is an example of micro evolution, which does happen. Thats why there are different breeds of dogs and other such things. But evolution does not account for the origin of life.

dogs?? really guy?? You dont even know humans bred all those dog species???

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#33    Blueogre2

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:23 PM

View PostThe Mule, on 03 September 2012 - 10:07 PM, said:

dogs?? really guy?? You dont even know humans bred all those dog species???
Of course I do, why would you think I did not? Human breeding is an example of controlled micro evolution


#34    Abramelin

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:24 PM

Evolution is about how life evolved, not about the origin of life.

I hope the thick skulled humans amongst us will some day allow that one to enter their brains.

However, I have no great hopes about that ever happening soon.


#35    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:28 PM

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 10:23 PM, said:

Of course I do, why would you think I did not? Human breeding is an example of controlled micro evolution

Micro and macro evolution are the same thing. They work based on the same mechanisms and have the same end result.

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#36    Supersquatch

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:29 PM

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 09:46 PM, said:

Okay, a good response, at least you know how to defend your position. But every piece of evidence you have presented could also be explained by God creating all living things with a degree of similarity.

And your point is? I could say ancient aliens created every animal and did it in a way to replicate evolution, that doesn't make it true. If science can explain it, why would we need God? And why would God intentionally make every animal similar to one another?

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 09:46 PM, said:

As for the bacteria thing, that is an example of micro evolution, which does happen. Thats why there are different breeds of dogs and other such things. But evolution does not account for the origin of life.

First off, there is also evidence for "macroevolution": http://www.unexplain...showentry=26026. Second, dogs are a completely different species than wolves. Third, evolution does account for the diversity of life.

Edited by Taylor Reints, 03 September 2012 - 10:30 PM.

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#37    Abramelin

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:37 PM

There are times I think threads like these are proof of ongoing evolution.

Some of us will never understand anything (by just being stubborn or dangerously religious), and while they will be frantically busy trying to find out how to tie their shoes, others are building rockets and spaceships to escape this hell-hole of stupidity.



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#38    Blueogre2

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:43 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 September 2012 - 10:37 PM, said:

There are times I think threads like these are proof of ongoing evolution.

Some of us will never understand anything (by just being stubborn or dangerously religious), and while they will be frantically busy trying to find out how to tie their shoes, others are building rockets and spaceships to escape this hell-hole of stupidity.



.
Really dude? There is nothing stupid about not wanting to risk your eternal fate on a half baked theory that can't even be demonstrated in a lab much less in reality. I don't have anything against evolution, and if it were to turn out to be true then I would be totally cool with it, it would just show that God created us over eons of gradual change instead of instantly but I just don't see anything that proves to me without a shadow of a doubt that its real. And I am not about to anger God by falling for such a thing


#39    Supersquatch

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:46 PM

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Really dude? There is nothing stupid about not wanting to risk your eternal fate on a half baked theory that can't even be demonstrated in a lab much less in reality.

Read my post that shows proof of speciation. Also, Pascal's Wager is dumb. Why don't you believe in Allah, then? You'd be risking your eternal fate if you didn't.

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

I don't have anything against evolution, and if it were to turn out to be true then I would be totally cool with it, it would just show that God created us over eons of gradual change instead of instantly but I just don't see anything that proves to me without a shadow of a doubt that its real. And I am not about to anger God by falling for such a thing

Evolution, abiogenesis, the big bang, etc. explain why we are here perfectly. So why would we need to bring in a deity with no evidence whatsoever?

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#40    Abramelin

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:48 PM

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Really dude? There is nothing stupid about not wanting to risk your eternal fate on a half baked theory that can't even be demonstrated in a lab much less in reality. I don't have anything against evolution, and if it were to turn out to be true then I would be totally cool with it, it would just show that God created us over eons of gradual change instead of instantly but I just don't see anything that proves to me without a shadow of a doubt that its real. And I am not about to anger God by falling for such a thing

They did demonstrate that in a 'lab': ask any microbiologist.

The evolution of microbes goes exponentially faster than that of any other being.

Read about it, or ignore it.

Your choice.


#41    Alienated Being

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:52 PM

Denying evolution equates to denying the principles of gravity. You, sir, belong in the psyche ward.


#42    Blueogre2

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 10:58 PM

All these posts fighting so hard for evolution but what are you fighting for? To prove that humans are an accident of nature? That the universe has no real direction or point to it. That death is the end and our lives are ultimately sad jokes? Are you really going to fight for that?


#43    BaalZebul Nehebkau

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 11:01 PM

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 10:58 PM, said:

All these posts fighting so hard for evolution but what are you fighting for? To prove that humans are an accident of nature? That the universe has no real direction or point to it. That death is the end and our lives are ultimately sad jokes? Are you really going to fight for that?
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#44    Supersquatch

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 11:04 PM

View PostBlueogre2, on 03 September 2012 - 10:58 PM, said:

All these posts fighting so hard for evolution but what are you fighting for? To prove that humans are an accident of nature? That the universe has no real direction or point to it. That death is the end and our lives are ultimately sad jokes? Are you really going to fight for that?

Good avoidance of the actual points being made.

Nobody here is a nihilist, and if they are, it doesn't relate at all to their religion. I'm happy and an atheist. If you look at it as "Humans are an accident of nature", then, yeah, it sounds nihilistic. Good thing I don't remind myself that everyday. Also, I don't care really how human beings got here. Death may be the end, but we all have to let go eventually. You have one life to live, so live it.

I'm not fighting for pessimism, I'm fighting for the facts.

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#45    Blueogre2

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 11:08 PM

View PostTaylor Reints, on 03 September 2012 - 11:04 PM, said:

Good avoidance of the actual points being made.

Nobody here is a nihilist, and if they are, it doesn't relate at all to their religion. I'm happy and an atheist. If you look at it as "Humans are an accident of nature", then, yeah, it sounds nihilistic. Good thing I don't remind myself that everyday. Also, I don't care really how human beings got here. Death may be the end, but we all have to let go eventually. You have one life to live, so live it.

I'm not fighting for pessimism, I'm fighting for the facts.
You may not remind yourself of it but nevertheless if you accept the evolutionary world view it's a fact that you can not escape. Life is a accident and their is no hope of a afterlife. You say you don't care how we got here but really how we got here is the most important thing because it determines everything else.





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