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The Ancient Alien Theory Is True


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#8776    seeder

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:00 PM

View Postzoser, on 11 March 2013 - 07:44 PM, said:

Your saying that glaciers caused this?



What a fascinating thought :cry:

By the way the link is here:

http://secretsofthes...trified-stones/

and on that link after the analysis was done ...it says...

"Whilst the spectra do not show explicitly that the surface is vitrified, the layer does have the composition, sheen, hardness and glassy texture of a glaze. It is very likely that the glaze was made from a ceramic paste applied to the limestone surface."

:tu:





.

Edited by seeder, 11 March 2013 - 08:02 PM.

The England team visited an orphanage in Brazil today. “It’s heartbreaking to see their sad little faces with no hope” .....said Jose, age 6.
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#8777    Oniomancer

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:26 PM

View Postzoser, on 11 March 2013 - 07:44 PM, said:

Your saying that glaciers caused this?



What a fascinating thought :cry:

By the way the link is here:

http://secretsofthes...trified-stones/

And how, pray tell, do glaciers polish rock? It's ice. Ice should shred on hard granite, right?

Right?

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#8778    seeder

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:42 PM

View PostOniomancer, on 11 March 2013 - 08:26 PM, said:

And how, pray tell, do glaciers polish rock? It's ice. Ice should shred on hard granite, right?

Right?

:tu:    Dont expect an answer Mr O, he logs off soon as he gets his legs smacked! I suspect he hopes when he comes back -that  many posts have been made that bury such teasers

The England team visited an orphanage in Brazil today. “It’s heartbreaking to see their sad little faces with no hope” .....said Jose, age 6.
It's not the depth of the rabbit hole that bugs me... It's all the rabbit poop you stumble over on your way down...
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#8779    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:42 PM

I'm afraid I'm getting rather bored with Vitrification. If people are going to keep talking about it I'm afraid I may have to find something else to read, perhaps this interesting theory that they never went to the Moon. Perhaps Mr. Z might find it interesting?

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

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Posted Image


#8780    scowl

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:56 PM

View Postzoser, on 11 March 2013 - 04:25 PM, said:

So now you appear to be saying that granite isn't hard at all and is in fact easy to split :no:

Do you ever understand anything we write? Have you even seen granite in nature? It almost always layered. In fact much of it is commercially worthless because it falls apart when you quarry it. About a quarter of my state is granite and you'll find granite slides everywhere.

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Also that granite on granite gives a nice polished shine :no:

That you can polish one stone with another stone of equal or greater hardness. This is well known.

Also granite can have very flat sides naturally and require very little polishing. I'll look for some photos I took last summer around a glacial lake which had granite outcrops everywhere. You can learn a lot by going outside and looking at these things in real life.

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Dream on.

Or of course you could try and prove your point.

You didn't even understand my points! Go back and watch your little YouTube videos.

Quote

Since few seem willing to do that here recently I'm not holding my breath.

And I won't be holding my breath for your Ancient Astronauts to return to Earth so we can teach them about concrete.


#8781    scowl

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:17 PM

View Postzoser, on 11 March 2013 - 07:52 PM, said:

Still no explanations for the moulding, vitrification and precision joins.

View Postzoser, on 11 March 2013 - 07:48 PM, said:

Explain this:

Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

Zoser, what happens when you take a rock and scrape it against another rock of equal hardness?

Answer this question before you continue to ask foolish questions.


#8782    Slave2Fate

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:23 PM

View PostLord Vetinari, on 11 March 2013 - 08:42 PM, said:

I'm afraid I'm getting rather bored with Vitrification. If people are going to keep talking about it I'm afraid I may have to find something else to read, perhaps this interesting theory that they never went to the Moon. Perhaps Mr. Z might find it interesting?

Indeed. Who's to say that some descendant of zoser's in a couple hundred years doesn't claim we couldn't have made it to the moon without alien intervention? Or do people already say that? Please, please tell me people don't already say that...

"You want to discuss plausibility then you have to accept reality." -Mattshark

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You know... the plural of ``anecdote'' is not ``data''. Similarly, the plural of ``random fact'' is not ``mystical symbolism''. -sepulchrave


#8783    Slave2Fate

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:26 PM

View Postscowl, on 11 March 2013 - 10:17 PM, said:

Zoser, what happens when you take a rock and scrape it against another rock of equal hardness?

Answer this question before you continue to ask foolish questions.

Those rocks look exactly like what stone abrasion would look like. Molding, my ass...

Edited by Slave2Fate, 11 March 2013 - 10:26 PM.

"You want to discuss plausibility then you have to accept reality." -Mattshark

"Don't argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level then beat you with experience." -Obviousman

You know... the plural of ``anecdote'' is not ``data''. Similarly, the plural of ``random fact'' is not ``mystical symbolism''. -sepulchrave


#8784    Myles

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 11:34 PM

Posted Image


Clearly this precision was done by scraping walnuts across this rock.
Please provide evidence that it was not.    The burden is on you.


#8785    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 12:27 AM

Walnuts?
Are you crazy?
It's clear to me the gnomes employed by the Fair Folk to engrave the lines on that rock were pished that day so they did a straight line that meandered all across the rock.


#8786    DONTEATUS

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 02:18 AM

View PostMyles, on 11 March 2013 - 11:34 PM, said:

Posted Image


Clearly this precision was done by scraping walnuts across this rock.
Please provide evidence that it was not. The burden is on you.
Thats Gotta bee It ! I can see the writing on the Stoned people now ! Lets make a squiggly trough so the Ice cream looks really Kool as it makes it way down from the High Andes to the creamery To be poured into the Hand made little stone bowls that all the common people have to make , Now were getting to the real answers to the AA Theory`s ! :tu:

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#8787    Kludge808

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 02:44 AM

No, no, guys!  It was AIL-E-UNZ!  They showed me once during the daily transmissions from the mothership.  It was really cool.  They used a small ship like Lazar's sports model and on-board phasers to do the cutting.  Well, not really phasers 'cuz they're science fiction but the same idea.  Zip-zap and it's all done.  They even had antigravity beams to put them in place.  The local residents only had to stand back and watch.  Why do it?  Basic artistic whims based on images drawn from the natives' minds.  No grand project or anything, just an occasional artistic outlet for the on planet staff.  They didn't have a lot of time for that, though.  They were too busy with stuff like genetic injunearing, a side result of which was politicians and Paris Hilton.  (The latter was a human-alien crossbreeding experiment gone horridly wrong and they've apologized profusely for it.)  They also claim responsibility for McDonald's and aren't quite sure if that was a good or bad thing.  Anyway, tools & stuff found at the sites were from the local populations trying to duplicate the results and obviously they fell way short.  I mean, who can compete with phasers and other cools stuff?

*sigh* ... that was fun but let's get down to reality.  It's boring but a necessary part of everyday life.  Well, for most of us anyway.

First off, I don't know what sort of engineer Zoser is but I had a split major, Aeronautical (a fancy form of Mechanical) and Electrical.  In both, knowing something about materials is necessary although for different reasons.  "Something" is not "all about" and I'm smart enough to know that.  However, I'm also smart enough to know that copper work hardens and that copper alloys are even stronger.  Not a whole lot harder on the Mohs Scale but definitely stronger.  For example, not many copper cannons were made while bronze was used for them in significant numbers.

What does that have to do with anything?  Bronze was known to both the Egyptians and the Andean natives with the latter using it extensively in the construction of Pumapunku.  Okay, so why is that important?  Because it give some added insight as to how an assortment of structures were made.  It has already been shown that a copper and sand drill works nicely for boring holes in stone - even granite - and the same technology can be used for an assortment of other grinding uses.  Using bronze rather than pure copper makes the job somewhat easier although it's still labor intensive.  Both societies obviously knew that even though there's only direct evidence that the Egyptians used it.  By extension, this leads to a similar knowledge by the Tiwanaku even though no tools have been found to date of which I'm aware.  Copper/bronze and sand saws are also known to have been used in Egypt which also extends to the Tiwanaku understanding the same techniques.

Now, before anyone screams that it had to be aliens because the societies are separated by quite a distance, let me make something quite clear.  Parallel developments in technology between widely separated cultures exist throughout history.  Get used to it since it's a known fact and no aliens are required.  Or did aliens also present humans with bows & arrows, spears, knives, an understanding of textiles - spinning & weaving specifically, rope making and a whole great number of other things that also were developed independently?  You can't pick & choose which came from aliens and which were human developments.

Someone mentioned splitting the rocks at where ever they were quarried.  This depends on climate.  Cutting/drilling into the rock using the aforementioned methods is the first step in either case.  Can't cut/drill granite*?  Since when?  Abrasion works wonderfully.  It's slow and, as with everything else, labor intensive, but it works.  In Egypt, insert dry wooden wedges and add water.  The wood expands creating a crack.  Continue with this using larger wedges until the piece finally breaks off.  At Pumapunku, just add water.  At the altitude it was built, all you have to do is wait for it to freeze.  We all know water expands as it freezes so it acts like the swelling wood creating a crack in the rock.

* Why are we discussing granite in the first place?  Anyway, I'll get to it in a bit.

Pumapunku was built from red sandstone and andesite which is an igneous rock typical to the region.  Since it is native to the region, it's a pretty safe bet the locals knew how to work with it.  Sandstone's relatively easy to work so there's no magic involved there.  Andesite takes a bit more effort but it also was in common use as evidenced by the number of other structures the Tiwanaku built using the same materials and techniques.  Pumapunku is unique only that it had religious significance in their creation mythos.  Nothing more.  It was also built in three phases dating from the 5th century to the 16th century so assuming all of the pretty work was done by the ancients is a bit presumptuous.

Let's look at granite for a moment.  That sarkoph ... sarcofi ... dead person holder thingie made of carved granite is significant despite having been regarded as meaningless by A Certain Party.  It was made some time around 200AD, memory serving.  The ability to do work of that order didn't happen overnight.  It took years - centuries - to get it to that point which means the basics of working with granite date well back in history.  Several societies including the ancient Egyptians used it in their architecture which gives us several data points to work with in developing a timeline for granite working.

Polishing granite wasn't a much a problem as some would have us think.  Again, it's labor intensive but it involves two pieces of granite, the work surface and the tool which can be equally large if not larger, and an abrasive.  Corundum - emery, rubies, emeralds and more prosaic forms - which is harder than granite was known into the neolithic era and was available already broken down as "black sand" in the case of emery.  Obsidian, another igneous rock, was also known and was chipped into any of a number of useful sharp objects including surgical knives.  Obsidian chips are also a good abrasive once pulverized and, of course, sand is as well.  Flipping to the other side of the Atlantic, corundum was available in South America, though not in large quantities, and the Tiwanaku did a lot of trading.  However, naturally rotted (ie, made into a sand-like state, usually through weathering) andesite would have also been available and it would have made a wonderful abrasive to use in cutting and finishing chunks of andesite.

Something else came to mind as I wrote the above.  One method of splitting ricks is to light a fire on the surface to be split along a line where it's supposed to happen.  (The rock would likely have been scored or drilled along that line beforehand.)  Once the rock's nice hand hot, push the fire out of the way and pour cold water on the same line.  A few times like that and thermal stress takes its toll resulting in a crack pretty much where its wanted.  Olive oil and charcoal would have been wonderful for such a fire in ancient Egypt and both were available in abundance.  I don't know what would have been the olive oil equivalent for the Tiwanaku but they also had charcoal.

Did I offer proof of anything?  Not really but no one here can since none of us were there when the structures were being built.  Instead what I've offered is a common sense view of how the stones were cut and fitted in both societies using some understanding of history and basic materials without having to resort to magic, aliens, our interdimensional analogs or really short guys named Bob.  I fully expect the AA crew to say it's all impossible and the ancients couldn't possibly have possessed such knowledge & talents without offering any evidence of such claims.  They'll fly back to their AA explanation and present more pictures which mean absolutely nothing.  Why?  Because that's all they have and it's easier than doing any real homework.

Oh, wait.  I forgot.  There's that nasty conspiracy centered at the Vatican to hide all the evidence of alien intervention.  We have to take it on basic faith any such evidence exists even though there's no documented evidence of the Church's undertaking any such activity.  Drat, that's also part of the conspiracy - hiding the evidence of hiding the evidence.  I'd like to know how this particular thrice bitten piece of haggagh got started and what "evidence" has been offered to support it.

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#8788    Kludge808

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 02:50 AM

View Postseeder, on 11 March 2013 - 05:49 PM, said:

I know life gets dull if you're by yourself mate. Ive reached that conclusion many times that you have to be single, just from observing the fact you usually log on first thing before work, then instantly after work, and every minute of the weekends.

Try socializing mate. Join a club, watch a cinema film, heck even online dating, anything than sit there alone day after day, living only for one thread, obsessive posting and reposting the same crap all the blinking time
*whimper* ... I'm single and alone and all like that.  Does that make me a Zoser-clone? :no: :o <_< :wacko:

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#8789    Slave2Fate

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 03:59 AM

View PostKludge808, on 12 March 2013 - 02:44 AM, said:

No, no, guys!  It was AIL-E-UNZ!  They showed me once during the daily transmissions from the mothership.  It was really cool.

*Snipped a bunch of relevant stuff*

Hey Kludge, I hope you are doing well, and it's good to see you here even though this thread degenerates into a one man circus on occasion. All your points are valid, just expect them to be hand waived away (without justification mind you) by a certain party.  :tu:

Edited by Slave2Fate, 12 March 2013 - 03:59 AM.

"You want to discuss plausibility then you have to accept reality." -Mattshark

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You know... the plural of ``anecdote'' is not ``data''. Similarly, the plural of ``random fact'' is not ``mystical symbolism''. -sepulchrave


#8790    seeder

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 04:08 AM

View PostKludge808, on 12 March 2013 - 02:44 AM, said:

.  They were too busy with stuff like genetic injunearing, a side result of which was politicians and Paris Hilton.

injunearing, haha :clap:  very witty!

A great post kludge. Pity - but anymore text than a paragraph means doser wont read it. He needs moving images, alien music and voice-over men with deep voices saying  mysterious things!

But a breath of fresh air nonetheless on a very tired and frustrating fred  thread !   Its sad but zoser isnt here for reasoned discussion and exchange of ideas. His strategy is not to listen - while incessantly wanting everyone else to listen to him. Then if the information presented to him, yet again gets too close to the possible  truth...its the classic zoser swerve he does, and the subject gets changed back to something else we have rinsed every fact from!   Admittedly we can only know so much, speculate even more, and thats where zoser feels the aliens come in, when we have to say....well, we dont know for sure how they did stuff.

But not knowing things didnt prevent the Parthenon from being built a thousand years before, now did it?

The England team visited an orphanage in Brazil today. “It’s heartbreaking to see their sad little faces with no hope” .....said Jose, age 6.
It's not the depth of the rabbit hole that bugs me... It's all the rabbit poop you stumble over on your way down...
“It's easier to fool people - than to convince them that they have been fooled.”  Mark Twain