902 replies to this topic

[Quaentum]

DieChecker, on 13 February 2013 - 08:55 PM, said:

Osiris's effervescent efflux. Tasty!!

I prefer a good Sphinx Spritzer but they won't sell it to you unless you can say it three times fast.

[cladking]

Quote

I prefer a good Sphinx Spritzer but they won't sell it to you unless you can say it three times fast.

1723b. when the great bread and this wine-like water were given to him.

130c. his food is among you, ye gods; the water of N. consists of wine like that of Rē‘,

Edited by cladking, 13 February 2013 - 10:15 PM.

[cladking]

Quaentum, on 13 February 2013 - 04:51 PM, said:

Please explain how the existence of ramps, and chisel marks on the stones are dependent on interpretation

There are no construction ramps.  There are chisel marks and saw marks on stones.

[cladking]

cormac mac airt, on 13 February 2013 - 12:51 AM, said:

Interpretations from professionals in the field trump the unqualified opinion of some dude in Indiana whose knowledgebase is sorely lacking and who has a penchant for proclaiming some version of "Nuh uh" to pretty much everything that IS known. Solely because he doesn't understand it. BTW, the plural of anecdote isn't data.

"Interpretations", assumptions, and educated guesses can all be very valuable but they can all
be entirely wrong as well.   This is why you have to investigate things.  Well... ...this and because
you never know everything.  Even after we know how the pyramids were built we still should inves-
tigate even if the anomalie in need of investigation implies ramps had been used.

Real science never stops.

[cladking]

DieChecker, on 12 February 2013 - 11:41 PM, said:

As has been pointed out numerous times, the ramps are not there, because they were taken down and dumped into the quarry. No one leaves scaffolding hanging on the outside of their building after it is built. So your arguement is illogical. If you are waiting for conclusive proof, such will not be coming, unless someone invents faster then light movement. Then we could effectively look into the past and see what they did, but since that is not going to happen, we can only guess, and the best guess is ramps. The Egyptians had ramps, and needed to elevate stone... the end.


I beg to differ. Science requires oversight and confirmation, and funding, resources and personnel. All of which require organization, which means beuracracy/committees.

DieChecker, on 12 February 2013 - 11:41 PM, said:

As has been pointed out numerous times, the ramps are not there, because they were taken down and dumped into the quarry. No one leaves scaffolding hanging on the outside of their building after it is built. So your arguement is illogical. If you are waiting for conclusive proof, such will not be coming, unless someone invents faster then light movement. Then we could effectively look into the past and see what they did, but since that is not going to happen, we can only guess, and the best guess is ramps. The Egyptians had ramps, and needed to elevate stone... the end.

In other words they must have used ramps.

If we knew what was in the quarry it might actually be sufficient to prove ramps.  But we
don't know what is or was there so it's just hearsay.  No scientific sampling has been done
and the anecdotal reports are conflicting.  The same applies to the material building up the
northern cliff face. It's easy enough to say this equates with ramps but there's still no evidence
that they built them this way.

There's no reason that ramps wouldn't show up on the gravimetric or infrared scanning.  After
all dragging them straight up the side DID in fact show up on the gravimetric scan so maybe we'd
see ramps on the infrared or ultraviolet.  We won't ever know because they're afraid of the pyramid.

Quote

I beg to differ. Science requires oversight and confirmation, and funding, resources and personnel. All of which require organization, which means beuracracy/committees.

Human progress has always been the result of the efforts of a single individual in almost every single
instance.  In fact, it is most of the time the result of serendipity or accident rather than genius.

"Congress" is the opposite of "Progress".  ...And such it has always been.

[third_eye]

Harte, on 13 February 2013 - 07:09 PM, said:

Sorry.  All we gots is soda water.

You can thank Cladking for that.

Harte

Well, I guess that'll do fine I suppose, Mr. Harte.
I'll shall remember to send 'im a card then shouldn't I ?

Now, would a back rub be considered out out of the question then?
No, I won't consider asking for a ramp.

[DieChecker]

cladking, on 13 February 2013 - 10:17 PM, said:

There are no construction ramps.  There are chisel marks and saw marks on stones.

Oh yes there is.

[DieChecker]

cladking, on 13 February 2013 - 10:31 PM, said:

In other words they must have used ramps.

More like, "They very probably used ramps.".

Quote

If we knew what was in the quarry it might actually be sufficient to prove ramps.  But we
don't know what is or was there so it's just hearsay.  No scientific sampling has been done
and the anecdotal reports are conflicting.  The same applies to the material building up the
northern cliff face. It's easy enough to say this equates with ramps but there's still no evidence
that they built them this way.

What if they took 2000 samples from the quarry and C-14 dated them? And it came back as being deposited in 3 waves of debris, all paralleling the construction dates of the 3 great pyramids? Would that be good proof of ramps?

Quote

There's no reason that ramps wouldn't show up on the gravimetric or infrared scanning.  After
all dragging them straight up the side DID in fact show up on the gravimetric scan so maybe we'd
see ramps on the infrared or ultraviolet.  We won't ever know because they're afraid of the pyramid.

I thought the Bui gravimetric map DID seem to show ramps.


http://hdbui.blogspot.com/

Edited by DieChecker, 14 February 2013 - 03:40 AM.

[Harte]

third_eye, on 13 February 2013 - 11:44 PM, said:

Well, I guess that'll do fine I suppose, Mr. Harte.
I'll shall remember to send 'im a card then shouldn't I ?

Now, would a back rub be considered out out of the question then?
No, I won't consider asking for a ramp.

Only if you provide the single malt that goes with the soda.

Harte

[third_eye]

Harte, on 14 February 2013 - 01:22 PM, said:

Only if you provide the single malt that goes with the soda.

Harte

toss the soda Mr Harte, alls we needs is a cube of blue ice.
what I have here is a bottle of Glen 15yr old golden honey

[cladking]

DieChecker, on 14 February 2013 - 03:40 AM, said:

What if they took 2000 samples from the quarry and C-14 dated them? And it came back as being deposited in 3 waves of debris, all paralleling the construction dates of the 3 great pyramids? Would that be good proof of ramps?

You'd actually want to see two waves, ideally.  Unfortunately though we don't really know
that G and G2 didn't overlap somewhat in construction which might make these two waves
a little subtle.

The problem is really quite simple; orthodox theory has utterly failed and we don't have a
single point of fact to use as a basis for understanding.  The theory  has failed because it
is bad theory and for no other reason.  It's bad theory because there were too many con-
founding factors and too little evidence to work with.  Obviously a good sampling and under-
standing of the material in the quarry is of utmost importance and should have been inclu-
ded in my list of projects to start immediately. Whatever overlies the bottom of the quarry
can provide any number of possible clues about construction and cleanup after building.

Quote

I thought the Bui gravimetric map DID seem to show ramps.


http://hdbui.blogspot.com/

You're not seeing ramps.  Go back to the page and look at all the information on one picture.  It
looks like a square.  If you draw in the five steps you'll see that this is a five step pyramid and the
"ramps" simply disappear.  Bui specifically denies anyone permission to use this drawing with the
steps drawn in.  But you can see where these steps go and they are 81' 3" apart and equally spac-
ed.  This is a five step pyramid and this is one of the things that would be proven by infrared ima-
ging which is one of the things they are terrified of.  The only possible reason to build these five
steps is that they were pulling stones up 81' 3" at a time.  This maximum height varied with each
pyramid strongly suggesting a natural cause rather than something like maximum rope lenght.  As
I said countless times ramps have been utterly debunked.  They did not have the resources or will
to build long ramps and drag stones up them. There is no evidence whatsoever of the resources or
will to do such a thing and there is extensive evidence of other means to build that would involve
the caves under "the Mouth of Caves".

People need to forget about ramps and ask the powers that be how the pyramids were really built.
Just because they don't much care how they were built they should not be allowed to duck the ques-
tion and avoid the tests.  This is the third millineum and we deserve better than "because I said so".

Why are they so afraid?

Edited by cladking, 14 February 2013 - 04:23 PM.

[Tutankhaten-pasheri]

The gravimetric map indicates a spiral, though whether it ascends or is on horizontal plane is not proved, though I would think commonsense has it ascending. If the BUI was actually showing steps, then they would surely not show a spiral pattern, but a series of squares of decreasing size one inside the other.

[Quaentum]

cladking, on 13 February 2013 - 10:17 PM, said:

There are no construction ramps.  There are chisel marks and saw marks on stones.

I did not say construc tion ramps, i said ramps.  Of course they did not have the time to just create ramps for the fu n of it.  They would have had a practical application so what was it?

[Harte]

Quaentum, on 14 February 2013 - 06:24 PM, said:

I did not say construc tion ramps, i said ramps.  Of course they did not have the time to just create ramps for the fu n of it.  They would have had a practical application so what was it?

Quaentum,

Cladking already knows that remains of ramps at the foot of the G.P. have been discovered, indicating that the stones were lifted out of the quarry (that is right in front of the G.P.) with ramps.

He has also been shown the many and varied remains of ramps at other pyramid sites - including ramps that are still there even to this day.

It makes no difference to him.  Once everything was ramped up out of the quarry, then the soda water geyser equipment took over, according to him.

Obviously, there's no geyser there.  But that doesn't matter to him.  Nor does he care to explain how neighboring pyramids were constructed - presumably each has its own geyser(?)

After all, several pyramids nearby are fully comparable to the Great Pyramid, they're just a few meters shorter.

Harte

[cladking]

Atentutankh-pasheri, on 14 February 2013 - 05:04 PM, said:

The gravimetric map indicates a spiral, though whether it ascends or is on horizontal plane is not proved, though I would think commonsense has it ascending. If the BUI was actually showing steps, then they would surely not show a spiral pattern, but a series of squares of decreasing size one inside the other.

Nope.

I'm well aware that people see a spiral but they want to see a spiral and there is some
information on this scan that does seem to reflect a spiral.  But this is misinterpretation
of pretty direct evidence.  If you copy this thing on a sheet of paper you can easily draw
in the five steps that are 81' 3" high each.  Draw them in boldly and the so called spiral
almost entirely disappears.  There are only three lines suggesting a spiral, but more im-
portantly there is a line that shows a reverse spiral that is impossible if they represent
construction ramps.  Hence these can not be showing a spiral and it's an optical illusion
caused primarily by the fact that this scan is looking at only the outside of the pyramid.
Since it's a five step pyramid and the only way to clad it was from the upper steps down
we're only seeing what occurred on the exterior finishing operations.  They had ample bal-
last as they were finishing up so the easiest way to move stones was to lift them to the
step above where they were needed and drag them down temporary inclines on the out-
side.

There are numerous places these steps appear and if they ever do simple tesating they
will appear in many more places.  They had to be built with step because there was a lim-
ited height to which they could lift stones.  This height was known as "3b3w" or "heaven",
I believe.  All the evidence is all around us and it is misinterpreted.

I've requested permission to post the picture of the five step pyramid and even went to the
trouble to learn how to do it but they will not give me permission.  They are apparently a-
ware that these are five steps but don't want it "published" anywhere.  There is an entrench-
ed status quo that ignores things like the caves at Giza as they continue to trowel for ramps.
Until people insist on facts there will be no change.

What are they afraid of?