Prayer works?

[R3LOAD]

I obviously didn't write this but i found it very interesting, tell me what you guys think.

HOUSTON - Nurse Ginny Weisz recounts a vivid incident a few years ago, when a baby's heart stopped beating during birth. As the medical team worked for more than 30 minutes to revive the infant, Ms. Weisz prayed intensely. Suddenly she said firmly out loud, "Father, let this baby live." And, she adds, "I believed He would." The baby revived, and "turned out to be a perfectly normal child." Weisz has three children and a busy life as a practicing nurse. But she is now considering going back to school to get her PhD in nursing so she can research the effects of prayer on health. Experiences like this among medical professionals are part of a culture shift - still in the fledgling stage - that is driving a new field of research: the links between religious faith and the healing of body and mind. The growing evidence is increasingly pointing to physical- and mental-health benefits for patients who hold spiritual or religious convictions. The several hundred studies that have now been published on the subject cover addictions, patient survival, coping with stress, rate of recovery from illness, and other health-care issues. In his book, "The Faith Factor: Proof of the Healing Power of Prayer," Georgetown University medical professor Dale Matthews says: "Scientific studies show that religious involvement helps people prevent illness, recover from illness, and - most remarkably - live longer. The more religiously committed you are, the more likely you are to benefit." Three recently published studies, discussed this week by 700 heath-care professionals gathered here for a course about "Spirituality and Healing in Medicine," add weight to the findings. * Patients are 12 times more likely to survive open-heart surgery if they depend on their religious faith and social support . * Over a 28-year study period, mortality for frequent attendees of religious services was almost 25 percent lower than for people who attended less frequently. For women, the figure was 35 percent. * Those who attend religious services at least once a week have been shown to have stronger immune system functioning. In discussing spirituality and medical outcomes at the meeting here, David Larson of the National Institute for Healthcare Research (NIHR) called the power of faith "the forgotten factor." He says it has been "neglected and mishandled" because of scientific attitudes toward religion. But new research results, and Americans' own strong belief in God and the power of prayer, are driving researchers and others in the medical community to try to remedy this, he says. A key challenge, however, is the difficulty of defining spirituality and religion. NIHR, a private nonprofit organization, is working with researchers to try to ensure some consistency in the research and to maintain the idea of "a search for the sacred."

Still controversial But even as research efforts expand, they remain controversial. Dr. Larson himself calls such research "the anti-tenure factor" - and he's only half joking. "If you study this, you will actually go backward" in your career, he says. Herbert Benson, a pioneer in the field and president of Harvard's Mind/Body Institute, which has sparked meetings like the one here, has lived with controversy for 30 years since he first suggested in a study that meditation produced physiological changes in the body. "The battle is not won," says Harold Koenig, director of the Center for the Study of Religion/Spirituality and Health at Duke University Medical Center. "There is a lot of resistance." The meeting here, sponsored by the Mind/Body Institute and the Institute of Religion at the Texas Medical Center, included a day for health-care professionals to learn about the healing practices of several faiths, including Buddhism, Judaism, Roman Catholicism, the Pentecostal faith, and Christian Science. Virginia Harris, chairman of the board of directors of the Christian Science Church, which publishes this newspaper, explored the elements of prayer and how they contribute to spiritual healing of oneself and others.

Intercessory prayer Perhaps most controversial is research on prayer, particularly intercessory prayer, in which others pray for the individual seeking healing. The only published research in this area is a 1988 study showing that heart patients who were prayed for had fewer complications of various kinds than patients who did not receive such prayer. Dr. Koenig says other studies of this type are not likely to get published. "We're getting close to convincing people that religion and spirituality ... can help people stay healthy," he says. "But to convince doctors about effects of intercessory prayer.... Doctors can't deal with something supernatural." Indeed, in a 1996 article in American Scientist magazine, Keith Stewart Thomson, a former president of the Academy of Natural Sciences, writes of prayer studies: "Matters of the human spirit are not well suited to investigation by the scientific method. Whether prayer is a subject amenable to any kind of scientific analysis is a tricky question...." Larson agrees that studies of prayer should not be a priority. "It's an important dimension, but we can get way ahead of ourselves. We need to slow down and take the most solid approach." But Larry Dossey, a physician and the author of "Healing Words" and "Prayer Is Good Medicine," is an advocate of intercessory prayer studies. Such research, he says, is already demonstrating the "nonlocal" nature of consciousness - that mind is infinite in space and time, that is, immortal. In "The Faith Factor," Dr. Matthews says it's not known how intercessory prayer works, but he supports study of the issue. In fact, Matthews has designed such a study of rheumatoid-arthritis patients, while the Mind/Body Institute's Dr. Benson has begun a lengthy project involving patients undergoing surgery. Interest in patient spirituality appears to be growing among mental-health practitioners as well - or at least a long-held resistance to it may be lessening. Over the years, psychiatry has stuck religion with labels such as "universal obsessional neurosis," "infantile helplessness," and "borderline psychosis." NIHR's Larson says he began this field of study after he was taught as a psychiatric student about the dangers of religious belief. When he looked into the research, "I found it was actually beneficial," he says. Duke University's Koenig says many studies now show intrinsic faith to be the most important factor in patients' recovery from depression. Indeed, American Psychiatric Association guidelines now call on members to respect patients' religious views and not to impose their own religious or antireligious attitudes on those they're trying to help. For research aspirant Weisz, praying for patients or talking with them about their beliefs seems natural. But many of her nurse colleagues hesitate out of concern about imposing on their patients. It isn't that they aren't interested, she says. Weisz sees the conference here as offering a kind of confirmation - and inspiration - for health-care professionals to incorporate prayer into their treatment of patients.

What The Research Shows Studies relating to physical health * Greater religious involvement has been associated with lower blood pressure, fewer strokes, lower rates of death from heart disease, lower mortality after heart surgery, and longer survival in general. * A strong religious faith and active involvement in a religious community appear to be the combination most consistently associated with better health.

Studies relating to mental health * People who are more religious experience greater well-being and life satisfaction, less depression, less anxiety, and are much less likely to commit suicide. * Therapies for depression and anxiety that incorporate religious beliefs in treatment result in faster recovery from illness than do traditional therapies.

Cost-benefit studies * Heart-surgery patients who are religious have 20 percent shorter post-operative hospital stays than nonreligious patients (1987). * Hospital stays are nearly 2-1/2 times longer for older patients who don't have a religious affiliation (1997). * Heart-surgery patients assigned chaplain intervention showed an average two days shorter length of stay, or about $4,200 cost savings per patient (1995). Summation of physical- and mental-health studies: Harold Koenig, M.D., associate professor of psychiatry, Center for the Study of Religion/Spirituality and Health, Duke University Medical Center.

[Daughter of the Nine Moons]

Moved to a more appropriate forum.

[Kit Walker]

Sorry, that is not what a controlled experiment said:

Study: Prayer doesn't affect heart patients

NEW YORK (AP) -- In the largest study of its kind, researchers found that having people pray for heart bypass surgery patients had no effect on their recovery. In fact, patients who knew they were being prayed for had a slightly higher rate of complications.

Researchers emphasized their work does not address whether God exists or answers prayers made on another's behalf. The study can only look for an effect from prayers offered as part of the research, they said.

They also said they had no explanation for the higher complication rate in patients who knew they were being prayed for, in comparison to patients who only knew it was possible prayers were being said for them.

The work, which followed about 1,800 patients at six medical centers, was financed by the Templeton Foundation, which supports research into science and religion. It will appear in the American Heart Journal.

Dr. Herbert Benson of Harvard Medical School and other scientists tested the effect of having three Christian groups pray for particular patients, starting the night before surgery and continuing for two weeks. The volunteers prayed for "a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications" for specific patients, for whom they were given the first name and first initial of the last name.

The patients, meanwhile, were split into three groups of about 600 apiece: those who knew they were being prayed for, those who were prayed for but only knew it was a possibility, and those who weren't prayed for but were told it was a possibility.

The researchers did not ask patients or their families and friends to alter any plans they had for prayer, saying such a step would have been unethical and impractical.

The study looked for any complications within 30 days of the surgery. Results showed no effect of prayer on complication-free recovery. But 59 percent of the patients who knew they were being prayed for developed a complication, versus 52 percent of those who were told it was just a possibility.

Dr. Harold G. Koenig, director of the Center for Spirituality, Theology and Health at the Duke University Medical Center, who did not take part in the study, said the results did not surprise him.

"There are no scientific grounds to expect a result and there are no real theological grounds to expect a result either," he said.

Science, he said, "is not designed to study the supernatural."

[Imaginary Friend]

This is why the "Search" engine is invaluable as a tool to avoid double subject postings.

This article/topic is already available on page 2 of this forum. Link

[Beckys_Mom]

I obviously didn't write this but i found it very interesting, tell me what you guys think.

HOUSTON - Nurse Ginny Weisz recounts a vivid incident a few years ago, when a baby's heart stopped beating during birth. As the medical team worked for more than 30 minutes to revive the infant, Ms. Weisz prayed intensely. Suddenly she said firmly out loud, "Father, let this baby live." And, she adds, "I believed He would." The baby revived, and "turned out to be a perfectly normal child." Weisz has three children and a busy life as a practicing nurse. But she is now considering going back to school to get her PhD in nursing so she can research the effects of prayer on health. Experiences like this among medical professionals are part of a culture shift - still in the fledgling stage - that is driving a new field of research: the links between religious faith and the healing of body and mind. .

What a beautiful story...I love to read about lil infants/babies that pull through bless them ...prime example of the very FACT ..yes I said FACT......that prayer works....I so believe in prayer...(no BM aint going soft lol) but its true PRAYER WORKS

You have to give prayer a chance and you have to put your complete heart and soul into a prayer...if you dont so much as believe in it...then dont bother praying...you have to believe in it and trust in God to hear you and answer you

You cant just ramble off a prayer like it is some kind of wish!!!!!! dont be silly ....if you do that...don't hold your breath in getting any kind of answers

I have a couple of prime examples of my own....ahem...

When I lost my 1st child..I was heart broken and angry at myself....I broke down and couldn't face anyone.....I prayed night and day...I poured my heart out, and talked to God as if he was standing in front of me....I asked him to please give me one more chance and grant me a child, one that healthy...and I gave God my reasons as to WHY it was so important for me to be a mother....with in a couple of weeks I was pregnant again...I was in shock and too afraid to take the test, incase like others it turned out - negative!!! so I waited another week, it was killing me to find out..but I did it and there it was..Positive...and I gave birth to a gorgeous healthy lil girl last Sept 2005 called Rebecca........this folks is all down to faith in prayer

Another story.....There is a man that lives 3 miles from me called Jake..he and his family have always had it rough, their home broken into, and he lost his job...he still went along to my moms christian meetings, and they ALL prayed. The following few weeks had passed...he was forever praying for God just to help him find some way out of his mess, so he could help his young family..............He never gambled or drank for that matter.......but one day as he was in getting a newspaper he stood beside a lotto machine and something told him to get a lucky dip...so out of the blue he did...then kicked himself becasue he never believed in gambling, especially when he had little to gamble with.......Jake won over £300,000 and he was sooo over the moon...he was able to pay off the mortgage of his home and keep the roof over his families heads..and he was able to provide new things for his kids and he went out and bought new clothes and soon landed himself another job...but for the 1st time Jake was able to provide again and take his family on a well deservd holiday......he thanks the lord...he never prayed for money..he only prayed for the help and God must have known if Jake had this money he would make good use of it..................just another prime example that prayer does work

WOW that was long LOL

[Darsawl]

will power can pull people through

just such a strong enough belief that a medicine will make you beter can actually make it work.

That is why they do double blind studys to test that it is not just the poeples belief that they will get better that makes them do so.

Hope or hopefullness will change the persons attitude to positive which might be enough to make them better

This is not usally the case though

but since it has happened i see no way prayer could hurt besides false hope but if it could help it would be worth that risk.

[eden grange]

PLACEBO

[science101]

I said it once. I will say it time and time again. It works for me!

[R3LOAD]

I have a couple of prime examples of my own....ahem...

When I lost my 1st child..I was heart broken and angry at myself....I broke down and couldn't face anyone.....I prayed night and day...I poured my heart out, and talked to God as if he was standing in front of me....I asked him to please give me one more chance and grant me a child, one that healthy...and I gave God my reasons as to WHY it was so important for me to be a mother....with in a couple of weeks I was pregnant again...I was in shock and too afraid to take the test, incase like others it turned out - negative!!! so I waited another week, it was killing me to find out..but I did it and there it was..Positive...and I gave birth to a gorgeous healthy lil girl last Sept 2005 called Rebecca........this folks is all down to faith in prayer

Thats really special, no joke. Congradulations on your daughter. My mother says im special because i was born after 4 miscariages (sorry for spelling) and i was born on friday october 13th on a full moon.. a few days after my birth there was the famous san francisco earthquake....she said a few of her friends where afraid to go near me but i think its all just one big coincidence

[Beckys_Mom]

Thats really special, no joke. Congradulations on your daughter. My mother says im special because i was born after 4 miscariages (sorry for spelling) and i was born on friday october 13th on a full moon.. a few days after my birth there was the famous san francisco earthquake....she said a few of her friends where afraid to go near me but i think its all just one big coincidence

You wernt just speacial to her tyleriscool...you where her miracle and dont ever forget it.....just in the same way my lil Becky is my lil miracle

If you have any more stories that you know of...please post them thanks

[Beckys_Mom]

I said it once. I will say it time and time again. It works for me!

Thats because you are a true believer

[R3LOAD]

Thats because you are a true believer

I think prayer has alot to do with the saying "if you want something bad enough, it will come true" all your concentration and energy is focused in one direction.....there in no discussion that energy is not there so this might be part of it...idk just what i think

[+Link of Hyrule]

I believe prayer works. I've seen it work. However, prayer is not a repeated mantra said over and over again as if God will listen to quantity over quality.

One also has to consider those that actually pray to God because they Love him and talk to Him on a personal basis regularaly, as opposed to those that offer up prayers for intercession when it suits them, as if God were some kind of genie in a bottle.

[Beckys_Mom]

I believe prayer works. I've seen it work. However, prayer is not a repeated mantra said over and over again as if God will listen to quantity over quality.

One also has to consider those that actually pray to God because they Love him and talk to Him on a personal basis regularaly, as opposed to those that offer up prayers for intercession when it suits them, as if God were some kind of genie in a bottle.

Exactly...people tend to pray only when they want something and make their prayers sound like wishes....and when they get what they want....thats it...God wont hear from them again...and then they wonder WHY in all good time has gone...has things gotten just as bad for them.....well it would be because they didnt care to thank God in the 1st place and they rambled off their quick lil wishes and letf it at that

[science101]

It's not what you pray for! It's how you pray as stated in Matthew 6:5-8:

Also, when you pray, you must not be as the hypocrites; because they like to pray standing in the synagogues and on the corners of the broad ways to be visible to men. Truly I say to you, they are having their reward in full. You, however, when you pray, go into your private room and, after shutting the door, pray to your Father who is in secret; then your Father who looks on in secret will repay you. But when praying, do not say the same things over and over again, just as the people of the nations do, for they imagine they will get a hearing for their use of many words. So, do not make yourselves like them, for God Your Father knows what things You are needing before you ask him.