49 replies to this topic

[Neognosis]

Quote

Wow!  That is one incredibly assinine remark, IMO.  It takes two don't forget.  Men are just as culpable when it comes to making babies.

So then the man should have an equal say in whether or not to abort the fetus, right?

Horseshit. IF you don't want to get pregnant, don't have unprotected sex with a man.

How is it even remotely fair that the man in these cases has almost ZERO parental rights, absolutely ZERO say in whether to abort the pregnancy or not, yet they have to pay?

It's because our legal system is about 30 years behind the economic reality that women can support themselves without the help of a man now.

[libstaK]

Neognosis, on 31 October 2012 - 12:33 PM, said:

So then the man should have an equal say in whether or not to abort the fetus, right?

Horseshit. IF you don't want to get pregnant, don't have unprotected sex with a man.

How is it even remotely fair that the man in these cases has almost ZERO parental rights, absolutely ZERO say in whether to abort the pregnancy or not, yet they have to pay?

It's because our legal system is about 30 years behind the economic reality that women can support themselves without the help of a man now.

Here's an idea, if a man doesn't want to find himself paying child support, how about he doesn't have unprotected sex with a woman.

[Neognosis]

But then he has absolutely NO say in whether to abort the fetus or not?

How is that justified?

Women want the right to choose. Great, I support that. But their right to choose, if it is to be made independent of what the father wants, should result in the father not being obligated to support her decision.

And no child support without parental rights.

Seems women want to be independent and have control over their own bodies, except when it comes to paying for it.

Edited by Neognosis, 31 October 2012 - 01:33 PM.

[libstaK]

Neognosis, on 31 October 2012 - 01:33 PM, said:

But then he has absolutely NO say in whether to abort the fetus or not?

How is that justified?

Women want the right to choose. Great, I support that. But their right to choose, if it is to be made independent of what the father wants, should result in the father not being obligated to support her decision.

And no child support without parental rights.

Seems women want to be independent and have control over their own bodies, except when it comes to paying for it.

As I have pointed out above, the answer for a man to avoid all of this injustice is well within his grasp - don't have unprotected sex with a woman.  If you want to be a pappa then make sure the terms are understood and agreed by both parties or simply understand that sex has consequences.  No matter which way you cut it, the consequences are totally controllable and avoidable, but alas crying over spilt milk is so much more fun for some.

[JGirl]

Neognosis, on 31 October 2012 - 12:33 PM, said:

So then the man should have an equal say in whether or not to abort the fetus, right?

Horseshit. IF you don't want to get pregnant, don't have unprotected sex with a man.

How is it even remotely fair that the man in these cases has almost ZERO parental rights, absolutely ZERO say in whether to abort the pregnancy or not, yet they have to pay?

It's because our legal system is about 30 years behind the economic reality that women can support themselves without the help of a man now.

it is the responsibility of both parties involved if a pregnancy is not wanted.
if a woman does get pregnant i feel it is her choice ultimately whether she will allow the pregnancy to continue. it is her body and her choice, right or wrong in another's eyes.

[glorybebe]

JGirl, on 31 October 2012 - 04:28 PM, said:

it is the responsibility of both parties involved if a pregnancy is not wanted.
if a woman does get pregnant i feel it is her choice ultimately whether she will allow the pregnancy to continue. it is her body and her choice, right or wrong in another's eyes.

Exactly!  If he unzips his pants and doesn't wrap up, he should be prepared for what could happen.

[BiffSplitkins]

I wonder what the rest of the story really is?  I wonder what provoked Child Support to get involved in the first place? Did the lesbian couple go on public assistance or something? I know here in New York they require that child support be collected if you are collecting public assistance.

[JGirl]

BiffSplitkins, on 31 October 2012 - 05:21 PM, said:

I wonder what the rest of the story really is?  I wonder what provoked Child Support to get involved in the first place? Did the lesbian couple go on public assistance or something? I know here in New York they require that child support be collected if you are collecting public assistance.

this is something to think about - good point.
perhaps they are caught up in it as well as he is, and aren't the ones who instigated it in the first place

[BiffSplitkins]

JGirl, on 31 October 2012 - 05:55 PM, said:

this is something to think about - good point.
perhaps they are caught up in it as well as he is, and aren't the ones who instigated it in the first place

But if the article stated that, then this story would not be about a couple of cold-hearted lesbians going after a couple of happy go lucky gay guys now would it?
Otherwise this story could pertain to anyone, not just gays. There would be a million other stories that would fit this same profile. The 'gay' factor just makes the story more 'sexy' for media hype.

Edited by BiffSplitkins, 31 October 2012 - 06:31 PM.

[Abramelin]

libstaK, on 31 October 2012 - 01:14 PM, said:

Here's an idea, if a man doesn't want to find himself paying child support, how about he doesn't have unprotected sex with a woman.

So all I need is an armed bodyguard outside my bedroom while I'm having sex.

[JGirl]

Abramelin, on 31 October 2012 - 07:00 PM, said:

So all I need is an armed bodyguard outside my bedroom while I'm having sex.

wouldn't he have to be inside the room to protect you?

[Abramelin]

JGirl, on 31 October 2012 - 07:02 PM, said:

wouldn't he have to be inside the room to protect you?

I rarely date female serial killers, so I will try my luck.

[Professor Buzzkill]

libstaK, on 31 October 2012 - 01:44 PM, said:

As I have pointed out above, the answer for a man to avoid all of this injustice is well within his grasp - don't have unprotected sex with a woman.  If you want to be a pappa then make sure the terms are understood and agreed by both parties or simply understand that sex has consequences.  No matter which way you cut it, the consequences are totally controllable and avoidable, but alas crying over spilt milk is so much more fun for some.

Is it still the mans fault when the woman gets him drunk, hides the condoms and lies about being on the pill?

Is that entrapment? because the guy is going to be paying for it for 18 years without any way to prove he has been wronged.

[JGirl]

Professor Buzzkill, on 31 October 2012 - 07:27 PM, said:

Is it still the mans fault when the woman gets him drunk, hides the condoms and lies about being on the pill?

Is that entrapment? because the guy is going to be paying for it for 18 years without any way to prove he has been wronged.

how does someone else get you drunk? that's just shifting responsibility
hides the condoms?? why does he need to get a condom from her - he again is responsible
lies about the pill? yet again, why is he not taking responsibility for it himself? oh you're on the pill you say?  no problem then i'm not going to worry about it then. duh

[Neognosis]

Quote

As I have pointed out above, the answer for a man to avoid all of this injustice is well within his grasp - don't have unprotected sex with a woman.

Unless you are the woman, then you get to be irresponsible and not take precautions, and then collect a paycheck for the next 18 years, without even giving the father parental rights. Does that seem right to you?


YOUR BODY
YOUR CHOICE
fine, then it's also YOUR financial responsibility

You want the choice, you have to pay for it. Or give the father the same parental rights as you.

Tell me how that is not just.