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Can UFOs cause air accidents ?


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#16    mcrom901

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 02:10 AM

Abstract:

Spherical unidentified anomalous phenomena (UAP), of both plasma and solid-like kinds, have often been observed in the world. Several monitoring campaigns have permitted us to know better some structural properties and temporal behaviour of such phenomena. On the basis of what has been observed so far, and considering the deduced constants that characterize the phenomenon, and of the consequent physical working-hypotheses that results, possible dangers to aviation are examined from several point of view of physical science; both natural and nonnatural features of these kind of UAP are considered. A systematic instrumented observational plan is proposed, involving both recurrence areas and time flaps of the phenomenon itself.


http://www.narcap.or..._2.4_MaxTeo.pdf


#17    pallidin

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 03:59 AM

What's a time flap" ?


#18    Timonthy

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 06:22 AM

View PostSaru, on 02 November 2012 - 02:28 PM, said:

Could the distraction of a UFO sighting during a flight be enough to cause a collision or crash ?
The main problem with this is which definition of 'UFO' everyone is using.

A bird flies past the cockpit, the pilot freaks out, the plane crashes. If we didn't know it was a bird, then a UFO caused the crash...

Edit: Like how recently that flying shark apparently endangered a commercial plane...

View Postpallidin, on 03 November 2012 - 03:59 AM, said:

What's a time flap" ?
Time flaps maybe? Or time flapse? :ph34r:

Edited by Timonthy, 03 November 2012 - 06:26 AM.

Posted Image


#19    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 08:03 AM

In this 1974 case in Mexico, a UFO collided with a civilian plane and crashed.  This probably accidental although it's possible the UFO was malfunctioning or had been damaged after being fired on in the US.  NORAD was tracking the UFO on radar.

http://www.google.co...NGf_8B8bgN4_SUg


#20    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 08:11 AM

DENVER – The Federal Aviation Administration is investigating a mystery in the sky. A mysterious object flying over Denver nearly caused a mid-air collision Monday evening, 9Wants to Know has learned.

As investigators know, the mystery object did not show up on radar Monday.

Investigators believe this object, whatever it is, could pose a serious safety hazard to planes.

Radio transmissions from LiveATC.net confirm a nervous-sounding pilot reported a strange object at 5:17 p.m. Monday.

The pilot is heard telling air traffic control: “A remote controlled aircraft, or what? Something just went by the other way … About 20 to 30 seconds ago. It was like a large remote-controlled aircraft.”

The corporate jet, a Cessna Citation 525 CJ1, was flying at 8,000 feet above sea level over Cherry Creek when the mystery object came close enough to make any pilot nervous.

http://www.google.co...xWGUUb79VvsO8GQ


#21    Hawkin

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 06:54 PM

Wonder why some ufo's show up on radar and some don't?

It's good to have some skepticism so you won't be gullible & naïve. But to much skepticism
can make you narrow minded to all possibilities no matter how unconventional.

#22    mysticwerewolf

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 09:23 PM

Thanks,  themacGuffin, for the link i couldn't find ( i am not that good with computers) that was the one i was talking about, save that the show i saw said one of the  us team was the person talking about it. with no names given and no evidence it's kinda hard to confirm.  but if there are exterestrial craft in wandering thoughtour atmosphere  it is bound to happen  eventually  if it hasn't already.


#23    synchronomy

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 12:48 AM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 03 November 2012 - 08:03 AM, said:

In this 1974 case in Mexico, a UFO collided with a civilian plane and crashed.  This probably accidental although it's possible the UFO was malfunctioning or had been damaged after being fired on in the US.  NORAD was tracking the UFO on radar.

http://www.google.co...NGf_8B8bgN4_SUg
Maybe this one is a tall tale?
Did you see the disclaimer at the end of the story?

This makes a great story, but is it true?
No documentation has ever been released by either the Mexican or US governments about this UFO crash. All of this is taken from rumor and the telling of the story over and over again. Until documentation about this event is made available to the public the truth may never be known.


At the heart of science is an essential balance between two seemingly contradictory attitudes--an openness to new ideas, no matter how bizarre or counterintuitive they may be, and the most ruthless skeptical scrutiny of all ideas, old and new.
This is how deep truths are winnowed from deep nonsense. -- Carl Sagan

#24    booNyzarC

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 12:53 AM

View Postsynchronomy, on 04 November 2012 - 12:48 AM, said:

Maybe this one is a tall tale?
Did you see the disclaimer at the end of the story?

This makes a great story, but is it true?
No documentation has ever been released by either the Mexican or US governments about this UFO crash. All of this is taken from rumor and the telling of the story over and over again. Until documentation about this event is made available to the public the truth may never be known.


That has never stopped a compelling UFO story from making the rounds, but it's a good observation all the same.  :tu:


#25    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 02:09 AM

View Postsynchronomy, on 04 November 2012 - 12:48 AM, said:

Maybe this one is a tall tale?
Did you see the disclaimer at the end of the story?

This makes a great story, but is it true?
No documentation has ever been released by either the Mexican or US governments about this UFO crash. All of this is taken from rumor and the telling of the story over and over again. Until documentation about this event is made available to the public the truth may never be known.



I saw it, but I thought it was such a wimpy, limp and wishy-washy thing to say that I couldn't abide it.  

It was a real UFO case, though.

Edited by TheMacGuffin, 04 November 2012 - 02:24 AM.


#26    booNyzarC

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 02:45 AM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 04 November 2012 - 02:09 AM, said:

It was a real UFO case, though.

Well I guess that settles it then.  :unsure2:

Good thing we have you here to tell us which ones are genuine and which ones aren't.


#27    DONTEATUS

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 04:44 AM

It was a real UFO ! I can vouch for that Guy!  
Or was that  "What Happens in Las Vegas stays in Las Vegas " ? :yes:

This is a Work in Progress!

#28    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 08:23 PM

This was was also from Mexico in 1974.  Shades of Freddy Valentich.

Posted Image


http://www.ufoeviden...ses/case311.htm




Source: APRO Bulletin, Vol. 24 No. 2 (Aug 1975)
On May 2, 1974, Carlos Antonio de los Santos Montiel, 23, left Mexico City in his Piper Aztec 24, registered as XB-XAU, for Zihuatenajo, state of Guerrero. He arrived there in the afternoon and although he had originally planned to return that day, he decided to stay over and return on the 3rd. He had dinner at 8 p.m. and retired.

The morning of the third was cloudy with considerable smog, mist and very poor visibility. Carlos took off, nevertheless, at 10:30, without having his breakfast. He climbed his little plane to 13,500 feet but conditions were still bad so he climbed to 14,500 where he found a clear blue sky and continued on his return trip to Mexico City.

Arriving in the area of Tequesquitengo, Carlos decided to lose altitude in order to make visual contact with Lake Tequesquitengo and verify his position, instead of depending on his instruments. When he got down underneath the cloud cover, ground mist and fog blocked his view of the Lake. Then things began to happen.

When he looked from the left (he had been gazing through his left side window) to the front he became aware of something on his right and glanced in that direction and was shocked to see an object with the appearance of two plates joined together at the rim with a cupola which had what seemed to be a little window and an antenna on top. It was positioned 20 centimeters above the surface of the wing and about 1 1/2 meters from the Piper's cabin. (See drawing by Staff Artist Robert Gonzales.) A glance back to the left revealed another object of the same description in the same position above the left wing.

"I was petrified," Carlos told officials later, "after I saw a third object which seemed about to collide head-on with the windshield. But it went beneath the aircraft and I heard a strange noise from below as though it had collided with the underside of the plane."

Carlos then noted that his airspeed had decreased from 140 nautical miles per hour to 120. He tried to bank to the left, in an attempt to "bump" the object away from his plane but the controls were frozen and would not move. He then tried to let down the landing gear, hoping to get rid of the object under him, but with no results.


#29    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 08:29 PM

View Postsynchronomy, on 04 November 2012 - 12:48 AM, said:

Maybe this one is a tall tale?
Did you see the disclaimer at the end of the story?



This Coyame UFO crash in Mexico was leaked by some sources within the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) which sometimes did that back in the 1970s.

http://www.google.co...dekUv1efKnhvU2Q


"On 25 Aug 74, at 2207 hrs, US Air Defense radar detected an unknown object approaching US airspace from the Gulf of Mexico. Originally the object was tracked at 2,200 (2,530 mph) knots on a bearing of 325 degrees and at an altitude of 75,000 feet, a course that would intercept US territory about forty miles southwest of Corpus Christi, Texas.


After approximately sixty seconds of observation, at a position 155 miles southeast of Corpus Christi, the object decelerated to approximately 1700 (1,955 mph) knots, turned to a heading of 290 degrees, and began a slow descent.

It entered Mexican airspace approximately forty miles south of Brownsville, Texas. Radar tracked it approximately 500 miles to a point near the town of Coyame, in the state of Chihuahua, not far from the US border. There the object suddenly disappeared from the radar screens.

During the flight over Mexican airspace, the object leveled off at 45,000 feet, then descended to 20,000 feet. The descent was in level steps, not a smooth curve or straight line, and each level was maintained for approximately five minutes.

The object was tracked by two different military radar installations. It would have been within range of Brownsville civilian radar, but it is assumed that no civilian radar detected the object due to a lack of any such reports. The point of disappearance from the radar screens was over a barren and sparsely populated area of Northern Mexico. At first it was assumed that the object had descended below the radar's horizon and a watch was kept for any re-emergence of the object. None occurred.
At first it was assumed that the object might be a meteor because of the high speed and descending flight path. But meteors normally travel at higher speeds, and descend in a smooth arc, not in "steps." And meteors do not normally make a thirty-five degree change in course. Shortly after detection an air defense alert was called. However, before any form of interception could be scrambled, the object turned to a course that would not immediately take it over US territory. The alert was called off within twenty minutes after the object's disappearance from the radar screen.

Fifty-two minutes after the disappearance, civilian radio traffic indicated that a civilian aircraft had gone down in that area. But it was clear that the missing aircraft had departed El Paso International with a destination of Mexico City, and could not, therefore, have been the object tracked over the Gulf of Mexico.

It was noted, however, that they both disappeared in the same area and at the same time."


#30    ReaperS_ParadoX

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 12:00 AM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 04 November 2012 - 08:23 PM, said:

This was was also from Mexico in 1974.  Shades of Freddy Valentich.

Posted Image


http://www.ufoeviden...ses/case311.htm




Source: APRO Bulletin, Vol. 24 No. 2 (Aug 1975)
On May 2, 1974, Carlos Antonio de los Santos Montiel, 23, left Mexico City in his Piper Aztec 24, registered as XB-XAU, for Zihuatenajo, state of Guerrero. He arrived there in the afternoon and although he had originally planned to return that day, he decided to stay over and return on the 3rd. He had dinner at 8 p.m. and retired.

The morning of the third was cloudy with considerable smog, mist and very poor visibility. Carlos took off, nevertheless, at 10:30, without having his breakfast. He climbed his little plane to 13,500 feet but conditions were still bad so he climbed to 14,500 where he found a clear blue sky and continued on his return trip to Mexico City.

Arriving in the area of Tequesquitengo, Carlos decided to lose altitude in order to make visual contact with Lake Tequesquitengo and verify his position, instead of depending on his instruments. When he got down underneath the cloud cover, ground mist and fog blocked his view of the Lake. Then things began to happen.

When he looked from the left (he had been gazing through his left side window) to the front he became aware of something on his right and glanced in that direction and was shocked to see an object with the appearance of two plates joined together at the rim with a cupola which had what seemed to be a little window and an antenna on top. It was positioned 20 centimeters above the surface of the wing and about 1 1/2 meters from the Piper's cabin. (See drawing by Staff Artist Robert Gonzales.) A glance back to the left revealed another object of the same description in the same position above the left wing.

"I was petrified," Carlos told officials later, "after I saw a third object which seemed about to collide head-on with the windshield. But it went beneath the aircraft and I heard a strange noise from below as though it had collided with the underside of the plane."

Carlos then noted that his airspeed had decreased from 140 nautical miles per hour to 120. He tried to bank to the left, in an attempt to "bump" the object away from his plane but the controls were frozen and would not move. He then tried to let down the landing gear, hoping to get rid of the object under him, but with no results.
HOLY CRAP. that would be scary as hell

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