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Cryptozoology Outside the USA

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#1    3.0

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:02 AM

It is my observation that interest in cryptozoology tends to be local,  to the home of the monster.  And that the interest in the subject  appears to be mostly in English speaking counries USA (Bigfoot), Canada (Ogopogo), England (Loch Ness Monster). I am wondering what cryptpzoology animals might be in other countires. For example, continental Europe doesn't seem to have many popular animals.  How often do you here about unknown animals in France, Germany, or Italy?  Anyone agree or disagree; or know of current mystery animals in those countries?

Edited by 3.0, 06 August 2012 - 05:03 AM.


#2    notoverrated

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:10 AM

is nessie in England or Scotland ?

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#3    St. Jimmy

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:17 AM

Well, it's not from Europe, but I've read that kongamato is pretty scary and dangerous creature. It is supposed to live somewhere around Zambia, Angola or Congo. As far as I know the natives say it looks like some kind of pterosaur.

And since you've asked for some European creatures, I've found two - the first one is wolpertinger, which is really a weird animal. It may looks like this: http://www.bits-n-ar...lpertinger2.jpg

The second one I've found is called Beast of Gévaudan (sorry if I got the spelling wrong) and it's similar to big wolf.

View Postnotoverrated, on 06 August 2012 - 05:10 AM, said:

is nessie in England or Scotland ?

Scotland.


#4    FLOMBIE

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:47 AM

View Post3.0, on 06 August 2012 - 05:02 AM, said:

It is my observation that interest in cryptozoology tends to be local,  to the home of the monster.  And that the interest in the subject  appears to be mostly in English speaking counries USA (Bigfoot), Canada (Ogopogo), England (Loch Ness Monster). I am wondering what cryptpzoology animals might be in other countires. For example, continental Europe doesn't seem to have many popular animals.  How often do you here about unknown animals in France, Germany, or Italy?  Anyone agree or disagree; or know of current mystery animals in those countries?
I'd say that is because mainland Europe is, unlike the US, a very densely populated area with very few remote locations where unknown animals could hide. But we do have many mythical creatures, which is pretty much the same thing under a different name. And stories about big cats in Germany do pop up once in a while as well.
From more recent history, the story of the Beast of Gévaudan in France comes to mind (18th century).

But to say that cryptozoology is a mainly English speaking phenomenon is not accurate, in my eyes. I would rather say that your sources or media are mainly anglocentric.


#5    Junior Chubb

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 11:00 AM

View PostFLOMBIE, on 06 August 2012 - 05:47 AM, said:

But to say that cryptozoology is a mainly English speaking phenomenon is not accurate, in my eyes. I would rather say that your sources or media are mainly anglocentric.

You took the words out of my mouth, or away from my fingertips...

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#6    Helen of Annoy

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 12:28 PM

There are many mysterious beings that are still believed to exist and that were seen or heard by locals. The trouble is that most of them are not strictly cryptids, they are usually a mixture of mythical creatures and cryptids as you’d define them today.
I’ll try to give very condensed background and modern status of few of them here, apologies for it’s inseparable mixture of the old belief and what you’d call actual cryptids (as in real rare animals). Just skip directly to man-eating catfish if you are after strict cryptids :D


Vukodlak (Werewolf)
According to the old belief, dishonest, cowardly and otherwise bad people would have their souls transferred into animals after the death of their human body, to atone and purify themselves before they can join decent deceased of their kin. Those animals would posses further shapeshifting abilities and were hard to kill. Later it evolved into werewolf myth, where werewolves were bloodthirsty crossbreeds of wolf and man with demonic characteristics.
But there are many separate werewolf myths (or testimonies) where werewolves are simply one not fully human tribe, that shapeshifts but does not attack if not provoked, then where werewolves are a kind of embodied nature controlling spirits, then the vampire-werewolf spin off and so on.
In modern times it watered down into a legend about a cryptid, an especially large and deformed wolf-like beast that likes to slaughter sheep, scare horses and lonely travellers, or even run through smaller towns at night. Some say it’s not large especially ugly wolf, it’s just occasional wild boar seen by shortsighted people.
One of last publicized testimonies (2007) say it was huge, had very strong, muscular upper body, sticking out harsh hairs, big grinning toothy snout, glowing red eyes. Was aggressive and produced grunting and growling sounds.
Hunters agree such descriptions might fit a boar but also a bear with fur issues too. Witnesses say you wouldn’t be so dismissive if you saw that thing yourself.


Divovi (Giants)
Tribes of giant men used to live here long ago. Few giant skeletons were excavated, but the real proof of their existence are the crossbreeds, men of unusually large stature and strength and the foundations of the oldest fortresses, built out of stones so large no man could ever lift them. According to some, there are still some pure giants deep in the woods or even underground and they will return one day.
Not cryptids in the sense used here, since they are not animals, they are cryptid people. They can make you go mad if you encounter them, but also help you if you are worth of their assistance, or, if you stumble upon that particular tribe, they can also eat you.
http://www.leluya.or...logy/Strahe.php


Zmaj (Dragon)
Essentially, just giant snakes.
Zmaj, the dragon, used to be intelligent reptile or reptile-like creature but it had showy details added on with time, like fire-spitting or flying abilities.
It typically guards something, a treasure that doesn’t have to be a treasure in the physical sense. Likes dark and humid places, from damp caves to dark lake bottoms.  
Reports of giant snakes are not that rare, though known large snakes cannot survive in our climate. Rational explanation is usually that the witness was scared so a large but still normal snake appeared to them much bigger.


Som ljudožder (Man-eating catfish)
Every larger pond has its mysterious oversized fish everyone is trying to catch but no one ever succeeds. Man-eating catfish is something reserved for the largest lakes and the murkiest rivers.  
They are just catfish, only as old as hundred or more years, that sometimes emerge, grab a swimmer and swallow him alive.  
Sceptics laugh that idea off, but my grandmother saw one of them dead on the river Sava bank. It was back in WWII, when heavy bombing of the bridge managed to accidentally kill one of those man-eaters and its body was found with still undigested human remains inside.  
Yuck, I know.
She never ate catfish again and I can tell you I’m not too keen of them either.
To be fair, I don’t think they catch live swimmers, they probably simply swallow anything protein-like that floats by their large mouths. Human remains included, apparently.
The lake in which I used to swim as a kid had its own legend of the enormous man-eating catfish and I saw its outline in the deep, murky water. Armies of anglers would sit there each weekend and no one ever caught anything so big as the shadow I saw, and I bet they are still hoping to catch it.  


Drekavac
Unknow beast with particularly horrifying call. Used to be a demonic being, mostly angry spirit of murdered child, with or without actual body, today an animal that produces sounds so disturbing for too long periods to ignore it or explain it as mating calls or cries of an injured, common animal.
The most recent scare was last year, in town of Drvar, Bosnia and Herzegovina. They didn't find out what exactly happened, it simply stopped at one point.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drekavac

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#7    Podo

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:22 PM

Sasquatch was originally reported in Canada. It is a word from a tribe of Natives that lived in southern British Columbia in the Vancouver/Vancouver Island region. We have that, and thunderbirds, and the Cadborosaurus. Nobody takes Ogopogo seriously.

::Edit::
Some people think we have these things, rather. They aren't accepted as fact by most people. That being said, I've spoken to many Natives who consider the Thunderbird to be entirely factual. Personally, I chalk this up to religious beliefs considering the sheer absurdity of a whale-eating bird that nobody has noticed until now. Cadborosaurs and Sasquatch could theoretically exist, it just isn't likely.

Edited by Podo, 06 August 2012 - 08:23 PM.

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#8    3.0

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 08:15 PM

View PostHelen of Annoy, on 06 August 2012 - 12:28 PM, said:

There are many mysterious beings that are still believed to exist and that were seen or heard by locals. The trouble is that most of them are not strictly cryptids, they are usually a mixture of mythical creatures and cryptids as you’d define them today.
I’ll try to give very condensed background and modern status of few of them here, apologies for it’s inseparable mixture of the old belief and what you’d call actual cryptids (as in real rare animals). Just skip directly to man-eating catfish if you are after strict cryptids :D


Vukodlak (Werewolf)
According to the old belief, dishonest, cowardly and otherwise bad people would have their souls transferred into animals after the death of their human body, to atone and purify themselves before they can join decent deceased of their kin. Those animals would posses further shapeshifting abilities and were hard to kill. Later it evolved into werewolf myth, where werewolves were bloodthirsty crossbreeds of wolf and man with demonic characteristics.
But there are many separate werewolf myths (or testimonies) where werewolves are simply one not fully human tribe, that shapeshifts but does not attack if not provoked, then where werewolves are a kind of embodied nature controlling spirits, then the vampire-werewolf spin off and so on.
In modern times it watered down into a legend about a cryptid, an especially large and deformed wolf-like beast that likes to slaughter sheep, scare horses and lonely travellers, or even run through smaller towns at night. Some say it’s not large especially ugly wolf, it’s just occasional wild boar seen by shortsighted people.
One of last publicized testimonies (2007) say it was huge, had very strong, muscular upper body, sticking out harsh hairs, big grinning toothy snout, glowing red eyes. Was aggressive and produced grunting and growling sounds.
Hunters agree such descriptions might fit a boar but also a bear with fur issues too. Witnesses say you wouldn’t be so dismissive if you saw that thing yourself.


Divovi (Giants)
Tribes of giant men used to live here long ago. Few giant skeletons were excavated, but the real proof of their existence are the crossbreeds, men of unusually large stature and strength and the foundations of the oldest fortresses, built out of stones so large no man could ever lift them. According to some, there are still some pure giants deep in the woods or even underground and they will return one day.
Not cryptids in the sense used here, since they are not animals, they are cryptid people. They can make you go mad if you encounter them, but also help you if you are worth of their assistance, or, if you stumble upon that particular tribe, they can also eat you.
http://www.leluya.or...logy/Strahe.php


Zmaj (Dragon)
Essentially, just giant snakes.
Zmaj, the dragon, used to be intelligent reptile or reptile-like creature but it had showy details added on with time, like fire-spitting or flying abilities.
It typically guards something, a treasure that doesn’t have to be a treasure in the physical sense. Likes dark and humid places, from damp caves to dark lake bottoms.  
Reports of giant snakes are not that rare, though known large snakes cannot survive in our climate. Rational explanation is usually that the witness was scared so a large but still normal snake appeared to them much bigger.


Som ljudožder (Man-eating catfish)
Every larger pond has its mysterious oversized fish everyone is trying to catch but no one ever succeeds. Man-eating catfish is something reserved for the largest lakes and the murkiest rivers.  
They are just catfish, only as old as hundred or more years, that sometimes emerge, grab a swimmer and swallow him alive.  
Sceptics laugh that idea off, but my grandmother saw one of them dead on the river Sava bank. It was back in WWII, when heavy bombing of the bridge managed to accidentally kill one of those man-eaters and its body was found with still undigested human remains inside.  
Yuck, I know.
She never ate catfish again and I can tell you I’m not too keen of them either.
To be fair, I don’t think they catch live swimmers, they probably simply swallow anything protein-like that floats by their large mouths. Human remains included, apparently.
The lake in which I used to swim as a kid had its own legend of the enormous man-eating catfish and I saw its outline in the deep, murky water. Armies of anglers would sit there each weekend and no one ever caught anything so big as the shadow I saw, and I bet they are still hoping to catch it.  


Drekavac
Unknow beast with particularly horrifying call. Used to be a demonic being, mostly angry spirit of murdered child, with or without actual body, today an animal that produces sounds so disturbing for too long periods to ignore it or explain it as mating calls or cries of an injured, common animal.
The most recent scare was last year, in town of Drvar, Bosnia and Herzegovina. They didn't find out what exactly happened, it simply stopped at one point.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drekavac

View PostHelen of Annoy, on 06 August 2012 - 12:28 PM, said:

There are many mysterious beings that are still believed to exist and that were seen or heard by locals. The trouble is that most of them are not strictly cryptids, they are usually a mixture of mythical creatures and cryptids as you’d define them today.
I’ll try to give very condensed background and modern status of few of them here, apologies for it’s inseparable mixture of the old belief and what you’d call actual cryptids (as in real rare animals). Just skip directly to man-eating catfish if you are after strict cryptids :D


Vukodlak (Werewolf)
According to the old belief, dishonest, cowardly and otherwise bad people would have their souls transferred into animals after the death of their human body, to atone and purify themselves before they can join decent deceased of their kin. Those animals would posses further shapeshifting abilities and were hard to kill. Later it evolved into werewolf myth, where werewolves were bloodthirsty crossbreeds of wolf and man with demonic characteristics.
But there are many separate werewolf myths (or testimonies) where werewolves are simply one not fully human tribe, that shapeshifts but does not attack if not provoked, then where werewolves are a kind of embodied nature controlling spirits, then the vampire-werewolf spin off and so on.
In modern times it watered down into a legend about a cryptid, an especially large and deformed wolf-like beast that likes to slaughter sheep, scare horses and lonely travellers, or even run through smaller towns at night. Some say it’s not large especially ugly wolf, it’s just occasional wild boar seen by shortsighted people.
One of last publicized testimonies (2007) say it was huge, had very strong, muscular upper body, sticking out harsh hairs, big grinning toothy snout, glowing red eyes. Was aggressive and produced grunting and growling sounds.
Hunters agree such descriptions might fit a boar but also a bear with fur issues too. Witnesses say you wouldn’t be so dismissive if you saw that thing yourself.


Divovi (Giants)
Tribes of giant men used to live here long ago. Few giant skeletons were excavated, but the real proof of their existence are the crossbreeds, men of unusually large stature and strength and the foundations of the oldest fortresses, built out of stones so large no man could ever lift them. According to some, there are still some pure giants deep in the woods or even underground and they will return one day.
Not cryptids in the sense used here, since they are not animals, they are cryptid people. They can make you go mad if you encounter them, but also help you if you are worth of their assistance, or, if you stumble upon that particular tribe, they can also eat you.
http://www.leluya.or...logy/Strahe.php


Zmaj (Dragon)
Essentially, just giant snakes.
Zmaj, the dragon, used to be intelligent reptile or reptile-like creature but it had showy details added on with time, like fire-spitting or flying abilities.
It typically guards something, a treasure that doesn’t have to be a treasure in the physical sense. Likes dark and humid places, from damp caves to dark lake bottoms.  
Reports of giant snakes are not that rare, though known large snakes cannot survive in our climate. Rational explanation is usually that the witness was scared so a large but still normal snake appeared to them much bigger.


Som ljudožder (Man-eating catfish)
Every larger pond has its mysterious oversized fish everyone is trying to catch but no one ever succeeds. Man-eating catfish is something reserved for the largest lakes and the murkiest rivers.  
They are just catfish, only as old as hundred or more years, that sometimes emerge, grab a swimmer and swallow him alive.  
Sceptics laugh that idea off, but my grandmother saw one of them dead on the river Sava bank. It was back in WWII, when heavy bombing of the bridge managed to accidentally kill one of those man-eaters and its body was found with still undigested human remains inside.  
Yuck, I know.
She never ate catfish again and I can tell you I’m not too keen of them either.
To be fair, I don’t think they catch live swimmers, they probably simply swallow anything protein-like that floats by their large mouths. Human remains included, apparently.
The lake in which I used to swim as a kid had its own legend of the enormous man-eating catfish and I saw its outline in the deep, murky water. Armies of anglers would sit there each weekend and no one ever caught anything so big as the shadow I saw, and I bet they are still hoping to catch it.  


Drekavac
Unknow beast with particularly horrifying call. Used to be a demonic being, mostly angry spirit of murdered child, with or without actual body, today an animal that produces sounds so disturbing for too long periods to ignore it or explain it as mating calls or cries of an injured, common animal.
The most recent scare was last year, in town of Drvar, Bosnia and Herzegovina. They didn't find out what exactly happened, it simply stopped at one point.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drekavac


Very interesting stories, Thanks!


#9    Rafterman

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 08:45 PM

Ever watch Destination Truth?  They're all over the world - in fact very few of their investigations are in the US - looking for such creatures.

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#10    Helen of Annoy

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 09:03 PM

View Post3.0, on 08 August 2012 - 08:15 PM, said:

Very interesting stories, Thanks!

You're welcome :)

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#11    Domina Lucis

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 02:29 AM

I have a small book that has some information on cryptids. Here some:
  • Lake Tiachi Monster (China)
  • Mokele-mbembe (Africa)
  • Yeti (Asia, in the Himalayan Mountain)
  • Nguoi Rung (Vietnam)
  • Hibagon (Japan)
  • Emela-ntouka (Africa)
  • Onza (Mexico)
  • Kongamato (Africa)
  • Ropen (Papua New Guinea)
  • Orang Bati (Indonesia)
  • Not sure if this one counts, but Giant Man-eating Catfish (Thailand)


Edited by MisstreeDove, 12 August 2012 - 02:29 AM.

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#12    Helen of Annoy

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 09:12 AM

View PostMisstreeDove, on 12 August 2012 - 02:29 AM, said:

I have a small book that has some information on cryptids. Here some:
  • Lake Tiachi Monster (China)
  • Mokele-mbembe (Africa)
  • Yeti (Asia, in the Himalayan Mountain)
  • Nguoi Rung (Vietnam)
  • Hibagon (Japan)
  • Emela-ntouka (Africa)
  • Onza (Mexico)
  • Kongamato (Africa)
  • Ropen (Papua New Guinea)
  • Orang Bati (Indonesia)
  • Not sure if this one counts, but Giant Man-eating Catfish (Thailand)

Aha! See? Maybe we are crazy, but at least we're not alone :D

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#13    BradVaughn

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 09:22 AM

In my hometown of Southend we have the Ratman. Whilst the main belief is that he's a ghost, others say he's a literal 'Rat-Man' as in a human/rodent hybrid.
Anyone ever hear about it?

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#14    Helen of Annoy

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 10:01 AM

View PostBradVaughn, on 12 August 2012 - 09:22 AM, said:

In my hometown of Southend we have the Ratman. Whilst the main belief is that he's a ghost, others say he's a literal 'Rat-Man' as in a human/rodent hybrid.
Anyone ever hear about it?


Do you know more about him? Maybe how that story begins, when it started, is he only seen or leaves any traces?  
  

I just remembered one more.
Very local, it’s the white dwarf creature of Grobnik.
http://igor-kostelac.com/2010/04/950/

I think I’ll be back with summary in English, the article on the link has English translation but it’s… Google translator. Glory to people who made said translator, but it's not just yet what we expect after seeing Star Treks.

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#15    Helen of Annoy

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 11:31 AM

So, the last encounter (that was written about) was in 2000 (source article Novi List, December 12th 2000), and up to today no sane explanation was found.

A group of kids from Kukuljani, a village in Grobnik area, decided to take a walk. They were surprised with their own decision because that was not a part of their usual late afternoon routine. It was like they felt the urge to walk.
So they walked down the road when they saw light in the woods. They started walking towards it and then something white, slimy, half metre tall, with eyes that changed colours from red to green and white appeared. It had hands with claws so big it seemed that the creature has no fingers, only claws.
Kids got scared, started to run away screaming but the creature run after them, making horrible squealing and huffing noises, clawing and hitting around as it moved. And it moved only sideways, but still so fast it appeared to kids it slides over the ground.
Finally the creature stopped chasing kids. They saw it one more time, as it slid across the bridge and back into the woods from which it came.

At first children didn’t want to tell anyone what happened, because they were certain no one will believe them. But parents saw their kids are really scared, they noticed village dogs were barking like mad that evening, and there was that weird atmosphere in the air, when you know something’s not right but you don’t know what.
So each kid told the identical story to their parents, and they didn’t want to sleep alone in their rooms that night, which is definitely not ordinary for 11 to 17 year olds.

The story started spreading, a reporter from the local newpapers came and kids also told him that the creature had no nose or mouth, its eyes were changing colours and were huge, its feet were strange and round. They show him clear claw marks on a tree and there really was some strange slime dried on its bark, as well as strange, deep, straight track leading away from the tree, like someone dragged a big log on the ground.

Other people witnessed the strange creature too. A woman went into stable at night, heard hard to describe, very unusual and horrible noise, but didn’t wait there to see what’s producing it.
Local bus driver saw something white that zoomed across the road. Intrigued, he stopped the bus, turned all lights off, but the creature didn’t reappear.  
Because dogs were still barking more than usual and because strange noise and squealing still could be heard from the woods, police officially investigated and - - found nothing.


Personally, I’ve heard the same creature was seen on few more occasions in the same area, and that it appears there from time to time since very long ago, but there were no witnesses willing to tell their stories with their full identity revealed, so I have no link, it’s just what I’ve heard.
It’s usually thought to be: synchronous lying, synchronous hallucinating, possible alien encounter, possible mythological being, possible cryptid.
I’d go with aliens, but on the other hand, it could be some extremely rare and extremely weird species of... something.

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