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The Incas, explorers of the Pacific


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#241    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 08:10 AM

View PostThe_Spartan, on 03 May 2013 - 07:28 AM, said:

The pyramidal shape of ancient structures in South East Asia is purely based on influence of Indian extent into those areas.

Angkor Wat for one example is the influence of South Indian temple Architecture.So are many temples and religious structures of Indonesia.
As Abe stated, a Pyramid is what you get when you stack large stone blocks/stones on top of each other.
Or may be the Indians had been to Egypt and were aware of the Great Pyramids.
No new evidence is required,It is the interpretation that matters also.

Which brings me to my next question, were the Ancient Egyptians as we know them from Africa? Or had they migrated there?

How old is the GP and the Sphinx? Was it built by a culture out dating the AE?

Was there ever a Global civilization? If yes , then in what point of time did it exist?


#242    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 10:20 AM

View PostHarsh86_Patel, on 03 May 2013 - 07:24 AM, said:

That explanation seems rather simplistic, you even get skyscrapers shaped towers by stacking up bricks/stones, why did they choose pyramids? Almost all of them are associated with Sun worship, even if they stacked stones which naturally looked like pyramids then why did they attribute it to the Sun God?

Irrespective of the Sun god connection, the pyramids are difficult to dismiss as a coincidence, i don't think that all these cultures that were advance enough to construct such huge monumnets would be independently taking inspirations from a pile of stones.

They choose pyramids because a simple experiment proves pyramids to be the most stable structure when you want to build big.

Load a truck with bricks, and then ask the driver to to push a button in his cabin to unload again. Then look what 'structure' you get.

I promise you, it won't look like a skyscraper.

Posted Image

(no bricks, but you'll get the idea)


#243    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 10:34 AM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 May 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

They choose pyramids because a simple experiment proves pyramids to be the most stable structure when you want to build big.

Load a truck with bricks, and then ask the driver to to push a button in his cabin to unload again. Then look what 'structure' you get.

I promise you, it won't look like a skyscraper.

Posted Image

(no bricks, but you'll get the idea)
A better example would be of a Mountain, that looks more like a conical pyramid and is naturally visible almost everywhere. Also the correlation between the Mountain top and heavens where the Gods reside.Have considered many of these possibilities, have been skeptical of most of them, but have not yet found a definitive answer.
Posted Image

The Mountain hypothesis would be better then the pile of stones hypothesis.(above is a picture of the famed mount Kailasa in tibet, revered as the once abode of supreme Godhead).

Were the AE looking to emulate mountains from their actual homeland? Nevermind.We dont yet know whether AE were black,white or brown and were they locals or had migrated from elsewhere (atleast the ruling class) definitively. Neither do we know that the AE had built the GP for sure, maybe some other more ancient peoples built the GP to emulate a sacred mountain in their actual homeland. But who knows right?

But i am not looking for naturalistic explanations for why they build pyramids, i am asking about why did so many who were supposed be to culturally and geographically isolated, built similar structures for similar purposes i.e. religious reverence or housing the Gods? One of them could have taken inspiration from a mountain or a pile of rocks, but all of them independently being inspired by the same thing is a bigger coincidence then i can digest.

Edited by Harsh86_Patel, 03 May 2013 - 10:41 AM.


#244    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 10:42 AM

View PostHarsh86_Patel, on 03 May 2013 - 10:34 AM, said:

A better example would be of a Mountain, that looks more like a conical pyramid and is naturally visible almost everywhere. Also the correlation between the Mountain top and heavens where the Gods reside.Have considered many of these possibilities, have been skeptical of most of them, but have not yet found a definitive answer.
Posted Image

The Mountain hypothesis would be better then the pile of stones hypothesis.(above is a picture of the famed mount Kailasa in tibet, revered as the once abode of supreme Godhead)

But i am not looking for naturalistic explanations for why they build pyramids, i am asking about why did so many who were supposed be to culturally and geographically isolated, built similar structures? One of them could have taken inspiration from a mountain of a pile of rocks, but all of them independently being inspired by the same thing is a bigger coincidence then i can digest.

So you think it's more than a coincidence that people all over the earth have respect for mountains and try to build artificial ones? Why do people need to be in contact to have a similar idea? People look up in awe to a mountain, a place near the gods, and most are scared sh_less when they look into an abyss, the dark deep. So the dark deep is the place of the demons, hell, and the bright blue sky up above is the place of the gods. Maybe you should have asked Carl Jung why people believe in certain things in a similar way all over the world.


#245    Yes_Man

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 10:43 AM

not just Mountains or buildings but burial grounds in England rise up  like a square triangle on some of them


#246    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 10:46 AM

View PostThe New Richard Nixon, on 03 May 2013 - 10:43 AM, said:

not just Mountains or buildings but burial grounds in England rise up  like a square triangle on some of them
Are these mounds contemporary with the Druids?

Yes maybe the shape of the burial mounds may have led the ancients to believe that Mountains were burial mounds of the Gods, that could have inspired the Ancients to build huge mountain like pyramids as tombs for their Pharoahs who were considered living Gods.But who knows right?


#247    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 11:41 AM

View PostHarsh86_Patel, on 03 May 2013 - 10:46 AM, said:

Are these mounds contemporary with the Druids?

Yes maybe the shape of the burial mounds may have led the ancients to believe that Mountains were burial mounds of the Gods, that could have inspired the Ancients to build huge mountain like pyramids as tombs for their Pharoahs who were considered living Gods.But who knows right?

In fact the Incas and many of the present-day natives of Peru, Bolivia and Chile still consider the mountains to be gods.


#248    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:23 PM

View PostHarsh86_Patel, on 03 May 2013 - 10:46 AM, said:

Are these mounds contemporary with the Druids?

Yes maybe the shape of the burial mounds may have led the ancients to believe that Mountains were burial mounds of the Gods, that could have inspired the Ancients to build huge mountain like pyramids as tombs for their Pharoahs who were considered living Gods.But who knows right?

Nothing to do with the Druids, they are much older.

SILBURY HILL

At 40 metres (131 ft) high, Silbury Hill – which is part of the complex of Neolithic monuments around Avebury, which includes the Avebury Ring and West Kennet Long Barrow – is the tallest prehistoric human-made mound in Europe and one of the largest in the world; it is similar in size to some of the smaller Egyptian pyramids of the Giza Necropolis. Its original purpose however, is still highly debated.

Composed mainly of chalk and clay excavated from the surrounding area, the mound stands 40 metres (131 ft) high[4] and covers about 5 acres (2 ha). It is a display of immense technical skill and prolonged control over labour and resources. Archaeologists calculate that Silbury Hill was built about 4,750 years ago and that it took 18 million man-hours, or 500 men working for 15 years (Atkinson 1974:128) to deposit and shape 248,000 cubic metres (324,000 cu yd) of earth and fill on top of a natural hill. Euan W. Mackie asserts that no simple late Neolithic tribal structure as usually imagined could have sustained this and similar projects, and envisages an authoritarian theocratic power elite with broad-ranging control across southern Britain.


http://en.wikipedia....ki/Silbury_Hill


Posted Image

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Edited by Abramelin, 03 May 2013 - 12:24 PM.


#249    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:32 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 May 2013 - 10:42 AM, said:

So you think it's more than a coincidence that people all over the earth have respect for mountains and try to build artificial ones? Why do people need to be in contact to have a similar idea? People look up in awe to a mountain, a place near the gods, and most are scared sh_less when they look into an abyss, the dark deep. So the dark deep is the place of the demons, hell, and the bright blue sky up above is the place of the gods. Maybe you should have asked Carl Jung why people believe in certain things in a similar way all over the world.
Carl Jung and Pyschotherapy the talking cure is still fighting for legitimacy.Though am appreciative of his and freuds attempts.

Regarding your comparison to abyss etc, there is no monument made to represent hell, the egyptians were not shy of diving into tunnels and underground caves,neither were other ancients in different parts of the world. Some of these caves and abysses were revered and connected to Gods.
There was no hell and heaven concept...lol. Though there was a underworld concept.

The ancients would have mastered thier fear of the dark considering that they didn't have electricity. They would have been more pragmatic about dark abysses etc.

Primitive humans would reside in dark caves and consider it home.

Neverthless....like i said, drawing inspiration from natural sources is just the first step,then attaching it to religious reverence and executing huge monuments to commermorate the belief are further steps.All these different ancient cultures following all the three/four steps involved in the building of these pyramids, seems more then coincidence.

But look at the dichotomy of the mainstream view.....diffusionist claim that early HSS travelled the globe and colonized almost the whole globe using primitive means but relatively way more advanced civilization wouldn't have been able to travel around the globe and be aware of other civilizations in different parts of the world.


#250    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:34 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 May 2013 - 11:41 AM, said:

In fact the Incas and many of the present-day natives of Peru, Bolivia and Chile still consider the mountains to be gods.

Am aware of it.Even ancient Hindus and modern day Hindus revere mountains as God since time imemmorial.Hope i am not sounding nationalistic.

Edited by Harsh86_Patel, 03 May 2013 - 12:41 PM.


#251    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:38 PM

Whats your take on this, one more coincidence? Or just a result of universal human psychology?

500 men toiling for 15 years....who was paying them and sustaining them? This would be an awful waste of time for a primitive hunter gatherer culture.


#252    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:48 PM

As you can see, the thing was cone shaped, not a square triangle, and as old or maybe older than the GP.

What do you call a waste of time? Something with no direct benefit for the people involved? How do we know they didn't benefit in any way?


#253    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 07:58 AM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 May 2013 - 12:48 PM, said:

As you can see, the thing was cone shaped, not a square triangle, and as old or maybe older than the GP.

What do you call a waste of time? Something with no direct benefit for the people involved? How do we know they didn't benefit in any way?
Don't tell me that you buy that primitive hunter gatherers did this.That is the perception the mainstream has for these people i.e primitive.....for such a primitive people this would be a waste of time.... they might have enjoyed sex and food more then building such huge structures.


#254    The_Spartan

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 08:37 AM

View PostHarsh86_Patel, on 06 May 2013 - 07:58 AM, said:

Don't tell me that you buy that primitive hunter gatherers did this.That is the perception the mainstream has for these people i.e primitive.....for such a primitive people this would be a waste of time.... they might have enjoyed sex and food more then building such huge structures.

How would you know whether it is the truth or not?
Were you  a Primitive Hunter Gatherer in one of your past incarnations?

Its speculation only.

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#255    Abramelin

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 10:28 AM

View PostHarsh86_Patel, on 06 May 2013 - 07:58 AM, said:

Don't tell me that you buy that primitive hunter gatherers did this.That is the perception the mainstream has for these people i.e primitive.....for such a primitive people this would be a waste of time.... they might have enjoyed sex and food more then building such huge structures.

I didn't say it or even suggest it. As far as I know, they had not been hunter-gatherers for a long time.





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