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Are alien probes scouring the galaxy ?


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#121    Slave2Fate

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 07:55 AM

View Postseeder, on 09 August 2013 - 10:13 PM, said:

:tu:   BOOM! The Million Dollar question even I have problems understanding. Thats the nail on the head right there.

So you build a self replicating probe, (TIP: YOU BUILT IT,  with hands and screws and glue and plugs and stuff that fingers do) a probe that is intricate and smart.

Right. So put that probe in a shed with no materials available and command it to replicate!!  What will happen? How can it replicate? HOW?  Perhaps Im having a brain fart - but Id like to know?

Someone?

Anyone?

Now, some of you will know MIT have already built a so called self replicating machine, except it doesn't really self replicate, but...it can replicate the form of something else.

But so can a jelly mold, to an extent

Heres a quote from the MIT 'machine' page


MIT Builds Self-Replicating Machines

Eventually, engineers want to scale the cubes down to the size of sand grains, enabling the precise replication of 3D objects. Practical applications of the technology, however, will not have to wait that long.

To repair a broken fan belt, for example, the owner could tape the split ends together and place the belt into a box containing the robotic cubes. The cubes would imitate the form and serve as a belt until the owner reached an auto parts store. Afterwards, the cubes could be deconstructed and used to duplicate another shape when the need arises. Follow the jump for a video that shows the cubes at work!

http://bigthink.com/...cating-machines


Now that was just a paragraph from that page, the whole (but short) page is worth a read!


.


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A nanofactory, or some other application of nanotechnology would be my guess.

Quote

A nanofactory is a proposed system in which nanomachines (resembling molecular assemblers, or industrial robot arms) would combine reactive molecules via mechanosynthesis to build larger atomically precise parts. These, in turn, would be assembled by positioning mechanisms of assorted sizes to build macroscopic (visible) but still atomically-precise products.

http://en.wikipedia....cular_assembler

Edited by Slave2Fate, 10 August 2013 - 07:57 AM.

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#122    seeder

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 10:34 AM

View PostSlave2Fate, on 10 August 2013 - 07:55 AM, said:

A nanofactory, or some other application of nanotechnology would be my guess.



http://en.wikipedia....cular_assembler

Ah so really then, we are not to consider an alien probe in space just duplicating itself, but rather, a swarm pre made in a nano factory, and that I could understand, sort of. I mean our own robots build cars right? Well, to a point anyway, the fiddly stuff is finished by humans. So going back to the OP then we couldn't really have self replicating probes in space then, not unless they also tagged along a nano factory. In which case the OP is misleading saying probes could replicate themselves

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#123    DieChecker

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 03:02 PM

View PostSlave2Fate, on 10 August 2013 - 07:55 AM, said:

A nanofactory, or some other application of nanotechnology would be my guess.



http://en.wikipedia....cular_assembler
My guess would be that the probe would have a minature factory built into it. And that would allow it to build a larger facility to process materials and build parts, which would allow for the condtruction of another probe, which would aid in the construction of a larger facility.

This all requires a amazingly complex machine however which can find the raw materials, process them and fabricate them. And we're talking about dozens of different materials and thousands of parts. Can you imagine if such a probe has to re-produce a computer processor? Since I work at Intel, I understand the hundreds of processes and the machines and testing needed to produce a single chip. It is simply astounding. And something can go wrong at any step and ruin the chip.

A replicating probe could do that, but I think it would have to build a city sized facility to do so and have to build thousands of machines, and process all the testing itself, since it would have the only computer processor. To do all this by itself would be possible, but might take millions of hours of work.

Maybe the best idea would be for the probe to bring dozens of processors with it. Then it could build a copy, or build machines to build more copys much quicker. and then not send out any other probes till the factory they built was produciing processors. Maybe.... That would be a lot faster....

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

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#124    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 03:31 PM

We're assuming that these probes would be like nanobots; I'm envisaging, well, typical Flying saucer sized craft, operating from a convenient, reasonably central base somewhere (e.g. for the Solar system, the Asteroid belt, for example), which they set up as they spread out in a kind of colonisation principle.

Edited by Colonel Rhuairidh, 10 August 2013 - 03:31 PM.

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#125    Frank Merton

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 04:37 PM

I don't think any of this is at all realistic.  Just my opinion.

Speculation is a good thing sometimes, but I like it  best when there is something concrete to start with; all this seems completely out of  deep  space.


#126    seeder

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 06:41 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 10 August 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:

I don't think any of this is at all realistic.  Just my opinion.

Speculation is a good thing sometimes, but I like it  best when there is something concrete to start with; all this seems completely out of  deep  space.

I tend to agree

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#127    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 06:59 PM

Why be hard nosed and worry about having to stick to what we know all the time? When it comes to extraterrestrial life, we don't know anything. All we can do it throw around entirely hypothetical to the point of being frankly made up stuff like, what was his name, Drake's equation and Fermi's theorem and what have you. We'd never make any progress in discovering anything new at all if we stuck to what we know. The whole point of discovering new things is that they're things we didn't know.

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#128    seeder

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 08:02 PM

View PostColonel Rhuairidh, on 10 August 2013 - 06:59 PM, said:

Why be hard nosed and worry about having to stick to what we know all the time? When it comes to extraterrestrial life, we don't know anything. All we can do it throw around entirely hypothetical to the point of being frankly made up stuff like, what was his name, Drake's equation and Fermi's theorem and what have you. We'd never make any progress in discovering anything new at all if we stuck to what we know. The whole point of discovering new things is that they're things we didn't know.

Ok you make a fair point Colonel, but, haven't we also been led to believe the law of physics was the same throughout the universe?

Of course we dont know that entirely for a fact. Buts its not a bad place to start is it?

The England team visited an orphanage in Brazil today. “It’s heartbreaking to see their sad little faces with no hope” .....said Jose, age 6.
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#129    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 08:10 PM

View Postseeder, on 10 August 2013 - 08:02 PM, said:

Ok you make a fair point Colonel, but, haven't we also been led to believe the law of physics was the same throughout the universe?

Of course we dont know that entirely for a fact. Buts its not a bad place to start is it?
Who was talking about changing the laws of Physics? The idea behind this proposal is that no laws of Physics have to be harmed, isn't it?

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#130    Tau Ceti Xeta

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 08:16 PM

View PostColonel Rhuairidh, on 10 August 2013 - 08:10 PM, said:

Who was talking about changing the laws of Physics? The idea behind this proposal is that no laws of Physics have to be harmed, isn't it?

ETs don't break the laws of physics.  They just find a way around them. :tu:


#131    seeder

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 08:20 PM

View PostTau Ceti Xeta, on 10 August 2013 - 08:16 PM, said:

ETs don't break the laws of physics.  They just find a way around them. :tu:

How? Exactly?

The England team visited an orphanage in Brazil today. “It’s heartbreaking to see their sad little faces with no hope” .....said Jose, age 6.
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#132    seeder

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 08:26 PM

View PostColonel Rhuairidh, on 10 August 2013 - 08:10 PM, said:

Who was talking about changing the laws of Physics? The idea behind this proposal is that no laws of Physics have to be harmed, isn't it?

OK. But however you look at it, how, as in the OP, can something replicate itself from...itself? With no nano factory in tow?  Thats my head scratcher...

Or do we just assume that alien tech has solved that problem? Job done, so to speak?

The England team visited an orphanage in Brazil today. “It’s heartbreaking to see their sad little faces with no hope” .....said Jose, age 6.
It's not the depth of the rabbit hole that bugs me... It's all the rabbit poop you stumble over on your way down...
“It's easier to fool people - than to convince them that they have been fooled.”  Mark Twain

#133    DONTEATUS

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 08:27 PM

The real  question is,"WHat If all matter I.E. atoms and sub-atomic particles are the nano-bots already?

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#134    seeder

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 08:30 PM

View PostDONTEATUS, on 10 August 2013 - 08:27 PM, said:

The real  question is,"WHat If all matter I.E. atoms and sub-atomic particles are the nano-bots already?

And thats a damned good point to make.

The England team visited an orphanage in Brazil today. “It’s heartbreaking to see their sad little faces with no hope” .....said Jose, age 6.
It's not the depth of the rabbit hole that bugs me... It's all the rabbit poop you stumble over on your way down...
“It's easier to fool people - than to convince them that they have been fooled.”  Mark Twain

#135    egesagin

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 08:40 PM

View PostDONTEATUS, on 10 August 2013 - 08:27 PM, said:

The real  question is,"WHat If all matter I.E. atoms and sub-atomic particles are the nano-bots already?

mind=blown. This reminds me of the brain in a vat concept. Not necessarily similar, but equally thought provoking, regarding our perception of reality.

Edited by egesagin, 10 August 2013 - 08:41 PM.





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