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Melba Ketchum Bigfoot DNA claims revisited


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#31    Q-C

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 10:51 PM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 26 July 2013 - 10:43 PM, said:

Agreed. I had it pegged pretty much that way from the start. Sadly at this point I think she's turned her reputation into a joke as well. That she won't be able to turn around easily, if ever.

cormac

It's the Lazarus Complex...in true Bigfoot fashion...she will be back...like the others....with more evidence and claims.
I don't think she is through milking her current study for all it's worth yet, no matter how much of an incompetent bigfoot researcher she's proven herself to be.

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#32    scowl

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 11:15 PM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 26 July 2013 - 08:39 PM, said:

If this were her argument for not acquiring adequate DNA samples I'd say it's a convenient cop-out. She wouldn't have to use a tranquilizer dart but could just as easily put something in a food offering to knock one or more out or, in the least, make them groggy enough to be manageable.

She talks about them as if they were nearly human, so that would be like giving them a date rape drug without their permission. I might be exaggerating a little but these people who she claims regularly interact with the local Bigfoot population are like astronauts to her and these supposed interactions they have are clearly precious to her. She has even given these people a special name: habituators. Is it any surprise this DNA experiment was a complete failure with her in charge?

The article also showed me that there's a lot about genetics that I don't know about. I didn't know what mitochondrial DNA was (we have two kinds of DNA?) or that our cells have a second genome or anything about the probability of recombination (I thought that happened every time!). I tried to learn about where mitochondria come from but still haven't figured out if they multiply independently after a cell divides or whether they are part of normal cell division.


#33    Q-C

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 11:35 PM

http://www.amazon.co...bituation sites

Here's another habituator. Unusual cat, imo. He had audio of his interactions with bigfoot, I listened to some years back. He has a lot to say about habituation and his interactions with Bf. Just Google his name

Edited by QuiteContrary, 26 July 2013 - 11:43 PM.

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#34    Insanity

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 11:53 PM

You could say our cells have two types of DNA, or really two sources of DNA.  Our cells have a nucleus which contains our genome DNA or nuclear DNA, the DNA that codes for you, and then mitochondria have their own DNA (usually called mtDNA).  Mitochondria can reproduce independently from the mother cell and often do so to meet the energy requirements of the cell, as that is their function, the production of ATP, our cellular energy currency.  During the normal cell cycle, there is a regulation that ensures each daughter cell gets at least one mitochondrion, and that one can reproduce independently as needed.  As the energy requirements of the cell fluctuates, so does the number of mitochondria.

If you are wondering as to the origin of mitochondria in your cells, there are two hypotheses, one is that they were bacterial like organisms that become symbiotic with our ancestral cells, the other is that they somehow budded off from our nuclear genome.

Most species inherit their mitochondria from only their mother, and so mtDNA is useful for determining maternal ancestry.  Your mitochondria are from your mother, hers from her mother, and so forth.  Your nuclear DNA is a combination of your father's and mother's.

"We see things only as we are constructed to see them, and can gain no idea of their absolute nature. With five feeble senses we pretend to comprehend the boundlessly complex cosmos, yet other beings with wider, stronger, or different range of senses might not only see very differently the things we see, but might see and study whole worlds of matter, energy, and life which lie close at hand yet can never be detected with the senses we have." - H.P. Lovecraft, "From Beyond" Published 1934

#35    cormac mac airt

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 12:20 AM

View PostInsanity, on 26 July 2013 - 11:53 PM, said:

You could say our cells have two types of DNA, or really two sources of DNA.  Our cells have a nucleus which contains our genome DNA or nuclear DNA, the DNA that codes for you, and then mitochondria have their own DNA (usually called mtDNA).  Mitochondria can reproduce independently from the mother cell and often do so to meet the energy requirements of the cell, as that is their function, the production of ATP, our cellular energy currency.  During the normal cell cycle, there is a regulation that ensures each daughter cell gets at least one mitochondrion, and that one can reproduce independently as needed.  As the energy requirements of the cell fluctuates, so does the number of mitochondria.

If you are wondering as to the origin of mitochondria in your cells, there are two hypotheses, one is that they were bacterial like organisms that become symbiotic with our ancestral cells, the other is that they somehow budded off from our nuclear genome.

Most species inherit their mitochondria from only their mother, and so mtDNA is useful for determining maternal ancestry.  Your mitochondria are from your mother, hers from her mother, and so forth.  Your nuclear DNA is a combination of your father's and mother's.

Better make that three since you're leaving out Y Chromosome DNA which, as opposed to mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA), passes down the paternal line from father to son.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#36    ShadowSot

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 01:07 AM

I don't know if this would greatly affect her reputation in the bigfoot community. I have a couple of bigfoot hunters in my Freethinker group and they just see this as part of a conspiracy against her. The sheeple word has been used. Believers will believe regardless, and stuff like this will simply enforce their idea that they are fighting forbthe Truth.

It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.
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#37    Insanity

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 01:18 AM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 27 July 2013 - 12:20 AM, said:

Better make that three since you're leaving out Y Chromosome DNA which, as opposed to mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA), passes down the paternal line from father to son.

cormac

The sex chromosomes are nuclear DNA as they are within the cell nucleus, which as I said is a combination of mother's and father's DNA.  The Y chromosome can determine paternal ancestry, as could the X chromosome.

"We see things only as we are constructed to see them, and can gain no idea of their absolute nature. With five feeble senses we pretend to comprehend the boundlessly complex cosmos, yet other beings with wider, stronger, or different range of senses might not only see very differently the things we see, but might see and study whole worlds of matter, energy, and life which lie close at hand yet can never be detected with the senses we have." - H.P. Lovecraft, "From Beyond" Published 1934

#38    cormac mac airt

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 01:21 AM

View PostShadowSot, on 27 July 2013 - 01:07 AM, said:

I don't know if this would greatly affect her reputation in the bigfoot community. I have a couple of bigfoot hunters in my Freethinker group and they just see this as part of a conspiracy against her. The sheeple word has been used. Believers will believe regardless, and stuff like this will simply enforce their idea that they are fighting forbthe Truth.

You're probably right concerning the bigfoot community. In the science fields however she might as well have been playing russian roulette with all chambers loaded.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#39    ShadowSot

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 01:23 AM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 27 July 2013 - 01:21 AM, said:



You're probably right concerning the bigfoot community. In the science fields however she might as well have been playing russian roulette with all chambers loaded.

cormac
True, but it isn't like she had much cred there to begin with. She is sold to the people who already believe her.

It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.
-Terry Pratchett

#40    cormac mac airt

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 01:52 AM

View PostInsanity, on 27 July 2013 - 01:18 AM, said:

The sex chromosomes are nuclear DNA as they are within the cell nucleus, which as I said is a combination of mother's and father's DNA.  The Y chromosome can determine paternal ancestry, as could the X chromosome.

Nuclear DNA (actually Autosomal DNA) is not the same thing as Y Chromosome DNA nor mitochondrial DNA nor even X Chromosome DNA. So really there are 4 types but for the purposes of genetics testing the first three are the ones used for testing.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#41    Insanity

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 01:58 AM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 27 July 2013 - 01:52 AM, said:



Nuclear DNA (actually Autosomal DNA) is not the same thing as Y Chromosome DNA nor mitochondrial DNA nor even X Chromosome DNA. So really there are 4 types but for the purposes of genetics testing the first three are the ones used for testing.

cormac

Sure, we could differentiate by the autosomes and the two sex chromosomes and the mtDNA.  Each can have gene markers that could be used to trace parental lineage.

"We see things only as we are constructed to see them, and can gain no idea of their absolute nature. With five feeble senses we pretend to comprehend the boundlessly complex cosmos, yet other beings with wider, stronger, or different range of senses might not only see very differently the things we see, but might see and study whole worlds of matter, energy, and life which lie close at hand yet can never be detected with the senses we have." - H.P. Lovecraft, "From Beyond" Published 1934

#42    cormac mac airt

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 02:47 AM

View PostInsanity, on 27 July 2013 - 01:58 AM, said:

Sure, we could differentiate by the autosomes and the two sex chromosomes and the mtDNA.  Each can have gene markers that could be used to trace parental lineage.

We don't have to differentiate between the above since businesses such as FamilyTreeDNA.com already do and, to date AFAIK, X Chromosome DNA results are insufficient on their own to be used for genealogical purposes as opposed to the other types.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#43    Earl.Of.Trumps

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 06:02 PM

Who cares if it's a possum! Ketchum is hothothot! :tu:

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#44    keninsc

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 06:17 PM

I have to say, Melba seems like a deeply disturbed woman in search of her proverbial fifteen minutes of fame.


#45    scowl

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 07:21 PM

View PostInsanity, on 26 July 2013 - 11:53 PM, said:

You could say our cells have two types of DNA, or really two sources of DNA.  Our cells have a nucleus which contains our genome DNA or nuclear DNA, the DNA that codes for you, and then mitochondria have their own DNA (usually called mtDNA).  Mitochondria can reproduce independently from the mother cell and often do so to meet the energy requirements of the cell, as that is their function, the production of ATP, our cellular energy currency.  During the normal cell cycle, there is a regulation that ensures each daughter cell gets at least one mitochondrion, and that one can reproduce independently as needed.  As the energy requirements of the cell fluctuates, so does the number of mitochondria.

So I have things reproducing semi-independently in my cells kind of like viruses except they help the cells instead of wrecking them. And they can't be called life because they couldn't survive outside the cells.

That's amazing.





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