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Edgar Mitchell says a lot.......


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#91    topsecretresearch

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:35 AM

View PostJimOberg, on 22 March 2013 - 04:33 PM, said:

You don't have to rely on my investigation alone. Why don't you believe James McDonald's detailed report re Edwards 1957.

No landing. No Gordon Cooper. No diisappearance of photos.

How reality-repellant is your intellect on this?

Where NASA messed up is those test pilots turned astronauts live on adrenaline. Problem is there is a long list of UFO landings, UFO Landing feet cases, scambling after UFOs. I do not believe astronauts would be talking about UFOs, details that others report, if there was nothing to it. It's more likely the astronauts are brave enough to go against the monster of a sad system we live in. Astronauts who are brave enough to talk about the truth are still the hero's.

Edited by topsecretresearch, 24 March 2013 - 11:41 AM.


#92    JimOberg

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:37 AM

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 24 March 2013 - 11:35 AM, said:

Where NASA messed up is those test pilots turned astronauts live on adrenaline. Covering up UFOs by defense/war mongering people or pulling the wool over people's eyes like an American citizen is small fry would be considered a challenge.

Problem is there is a long list of UFO landings UFO Landing fee cases. I do not believe astronauts would be talking about UFOs, details that others report, if there was nothing to it. It's more likely the astronauts are brave enough to go against the screwed up system we live in.

I'm sorry but I can't figure out what you are trying to say.

Please address my direct question:

You don't have to rely on my investigation alone. Why don't you believe James McDonald's detailed report re Edwards 1957? You do know who James McDonald was, don't you?

No landing. No Gordon Cooper. No disappearance of photos. Nothing like the story later attributed to Cooper himself.

Edited by JimOberg, 24 March 2013 - 11:40 AM.


#93    topsecretresearch

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:43 AM

Lee Speigel of The Huffington Post was talking about Gordon Cooper on C2C AM several days ago.


#94    topsecretresearch

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:57 AM

View PostJimOberg, on 24 March 2013 - 11:37 AM, said:

I'm sorry but I can't figure out what you are trying to say.

Please address my direct question:

You don't have to rely on my investigation alone. Why don't you believe James McDonald's detailed report re Edwards 1957? You do know who James McDonald was, don't you?

No landing. No Gordon Cooper. No disappearance of photos. Nothing like the story later attributed to Cooper himself.

I vaguely recall the debunker explanation you are referring to. Problem is from reading many UFO landing cases where landing feet are also described, the Edwards landing story seems very plausible.

If Gordon Cooper wasn't really there then he either heard something or saw the footage and was hushed up. I don't not believe Gordon Cooper is lying about UFOs. Why would astronauts go out on a limb like that? It's more like a reaction to something real and that is being covered-up. Gordon Cooper know's he's making people mad by talking. Like I said, these old astronauts live on adrenaline. Trying to hush them up or attack them will only make the Gordon Cooper's mad.

Information about UFO landings from Ted Phillips.

The objects fall into three general groups:

1. Small Hemispherical/Spherical Objects, from 4 feet to 12 feet in diameter, 4 ft to 5f ft thick, glowing brightly
at night & showing a metallic surface in daylight.
They rarely touch the ground but remain stationary 1 feet to 5 feet above ground surface.
External details, such as “vents” or “extensions” are often reported on the base of such objects.
They are reported as silent, whistling, humming, or rumbling.
These objects generally leave behind 4 feet to 12 feet circular areas which are depressed, burnt or dehydrated.
Considerable tree damage is usually found in the immediate area.
Animal & human reaction is often reported.

2. Egg-Shaped Objects, 16 to 20 feet in length with visible landing legs, generally four, on occasion six.
Generally silent, humming or whistling sounds.
These make ground contact, leaving burnt areas & imprints, some tree damage.
Small beings are often reported.

3. Typical Flying Saucer, 30 feet to 40 feet in diameter, three landing legs, touch the ground & leave burnt or depressed areas with an irregular configuration.
Landing imprints are found, in some cases considerable external features are seen on the objects.
Small beings reported.

Source: Ted Phillips (CUFOS) http://www.angelfire...o/cptr/dir.html

All of Gordon Cooper's UFO testmony fits what others have reported.

Edited by topsecretresearch, 24 March 2013 - 12:03 PM.


#95    JimOberg

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 04:00 PM

You don't have to rely on my investigation alone. Why don't you believe James McDonald's detailed report re Edwards 1957? You do know who James McDonald was, don't you?

No landing. No Gordon Cooper. No disappearance of photos. Nothing like the story later attributed to Cooper himself.


#96    Scudbuster

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 05:35 PM

View PostJimOberg, on 24 March 2013 - 04:00 PM, said:

You don't have to rely on my investigation alone. Why don't you believe James McDonald's detailed report re Edwards 1957? You do know who James McDonald was, don't you?

No landing. No Gordon Cooper. No disappearance of photos. Nothing like the story later attributed to Cooper himself.


Jim - here's another military individual - Gen. Nathan Twining -  with specific comments - now you can't overtly reject this now can you?


Lt. Gen. Nathan F. Twining, then-head of Air Material Command's intelligence and engineering divisions at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base (then Wright Field), compiled and analyzed the data. Twining's memorandum to Schulgen, dated 23 September 1947, stated, in part:[8]
  • The phenomenon reported is something real and not visionary or fictitious.
  • There are objects probably approximately the shape of a disc, of such appreciable size as to appear to be as large as a man-made aircraft.
  • There is the possibility that some of the incidents may be caused by natural phenomena, such as meteors.
  • The reported operating characteristics such as extreme rates of climb, maneuverability (particularly in roll), and action which must be considered evasive when sighted or contacted by friendly aircraft and radar, lend belief to the possibility that some of the objects are controlled either manually, automatically or remotely.
  • It is possible within the present U.S. knowledge... to construct a piloted aircraft which has the general description ...
  • Any development in this country along the lines indicated would be extremely expensive...



#97    topsecretresearch

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 09:17 PM

Didn't Oberg also claim one of the Disclosre Project witnesses that worked for NASA (Johnson Space Center) was being teased by co-workers so that's why she made up a story about alien cover-up? Thinks how silly that is. If there was nothing to UFOs or aliens how are you really getting even with NASA? :w00t:

A lot of the stink over astronauts is just damage control PR type stuff IMO.

I recall there was one stupid debunker explanation like Cooper was invloved in a bad investment scheme or business dealing with someone and that's why he had to make up stories. It just goes on and on with these people who need to make a huge fuss over something that they claim isn't real. Then why bother?


#98    badeskov

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 10:43 PM

View PostScudbuster, on 24 March 2013 - 05:35 PM, said:

Jim - here's another military individual - Gen. Nathan Twining -  with specific comments - now you can't overtly reject this now can you?


Lt. Gen. Nathan F. Twining, then-head of Air Material Command's intelligence and engineering divisions at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base (then Wright Field), compiled and analyzed the data. Twining's memorandum to Schulgen, dated 23 September 1947, stated, in part:[8]
  • The phenomenon reported is something real and not visionary or fictitious.
  • There are objects probably approximately the shape of a disc, of such appreciable size as to appear to be as large as a man-made aircraft.
  • There is the possibility that some of the incidents may be caused by natural phenomena, such as meteors.
  • The reported operating characteristics such as extreme rates of climb, maneuverability (particularly in roll), and action which must be considered evasive when sighted or contacted by friendly aircraft and radar, lend belief to the possibility that some of the objects are controlled either manually, automatically or remotely.
  • It is possible within the present U.S. knowledge... to construct a piloted aircraft which has the general description ...
  • Any development in this country along the lines indicated would be extremely expensive...

What Twining stated in said memo is still pertinent, but says nothing about ET. It merely outlines that people have seen something in the sky, which is obvious. As is also stated:

Quote

(2) The lack of physical evidence in the shape of crash recovered exhibits which would undeniably prove the existence of these subjects.

It's a fact that people see things in the sky, but that is all that we have and that is not going to cut it.

Cheers,
Badeskov

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#99    Scudbuster

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:23 PM

View Postbadeskov, on 24 March 2013 - 10:43 PM, said:


It's a fact that people see things in the sky, but that is all that we have and that is not going to cut it.

Cheers,
Badeskov

Right - but given the current state of affairs - secrecy, denial, feigned indifference, etc , this is all we have to go on - testimony from military & NASA folks.


#100    badeskov

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:35 PM

View PostScudbuster, on 24 March 2013 - 11:23 PM, said:

Right - but given the current state of affairs - secrecy, denial, feigned indifference, etc , this is all we have to go on - testimony from military & NASA folks.

That is indeed all that we have, for sure. But if we were really visited, it is my personal opinion that we would have more than that.

Cheers,
Badeskov

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#101    psyche101

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:56 PM

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 24 March 2013 - 11:35 AM, said:

Where NASA messed up is those test pilots turned astronauts live on adrenaline. Problem is there is a long list of UFO landings, UFO Landing feet cases, scambling after UFOs. I do not believe astronauts would be talking about UFOs, details that others report, if there was nothing to it. It's more likely the astronauts are brave enough to go against the monster of a sad system we live in. Astronauts who are brave enough to talk about the truth are still the hero's.

Yes Edgar Mitchell spoke out, he said:


I, nor any crew I was on (I was on three Apollo crews), received any briefing before or after flights on UFO events, saw anything in space suggesting UFOs or structures on the moon, etc. We did it just like we said in official reports. My only claim to knowledge of these events is from the individuals, mostly of yesteryear, who were in government, intelligence, or military; were there, saw what they saw, and now believe it should be made public. But I claim no first hand knowledge, nor have any. Pass it on to the rest of the net, if you will.
--Edgar Mitchell

When a mans words wont do there is always imagination. That is all you have. Is Edgar saying "I am bound by oath"? He is saying "nothing happened".

Cooper is always held up because he likes to put the boot into those who denied him, why not ask Allan Shepherd why Cooper disagrees with the statement provided by Edgar Mitchell above?

You lot make a mockery of these men and their achievements just like Zoser does with the AA nonsense. When you lot are finished Edgar Mitchell will be remembered as the ET kook, not the 6th man to walk on the moon, and that is why ETH'ers do not deserve to be respected.

Edited by psyche101, 24 March 2013 - 11:56 PM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#102    badeskov

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 12:01 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 24 March 2013 - 11:56 PM, said:

<snip>

You lot make a mockery of these men and their achievements just like Zoser does with the AA nonsense. When you lot are finished Edgar Mitchell will be remembered as the ET kook, not the 6th man to walk on the moon, and that is why ETH'ers do not deserve to be respected.

Hey mate,

Frankly, I seriously doubt that. Those with some knowledge (which would be the vast majority) would readily disregard the ET kook nonsense and and respect Cooper for his actual accomplishments and not some cooked up ET stories.

Cheers,
Badeskov

"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention to arrive safely in a pretty and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming: Wow!! What a ride!". Said to to Dean Karnazes by a running buddy.

#103    psyche101

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 12:05 AM

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 24 March 2013 - 11:57 AM, said:

I vaguely recall the debunker explanation you are referring to. Problem is from reading many UFO landing cases where landing feet are also described, the Edwards landing story seems very plausible.

Lousy sidestep there.

And no, it does not seem very plausible.

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 24 March 2013 - 11:57 AM, said:

If Gordon Cooper wasn't really there then he either heard something or saw the footage and was hushed up. I don't not believe Gordon Cooper is lying about UFOs. Why would astronauts go out on a limb like that? It's more like a reaction to something real and that is being covered-up. Gordon Cooper know's he's making people mad by talking. Like I said, these old astronauts live on adrenaline. Trying to hush them up or attack them will only make the Gordon Cooper's mad.

Of course you would believe it. You grasp at every straw left hanging.
"Astronauts" do not go out on a limb, each one has a very different experience and epiphany to share, with Cooper, he has a case of sour grapes to share. I respect what he did, I find it very hard to respect his actions since Shepherd was granted captain of Apollo 13, obviously later relocated to Apollo 14 and 13 reassigned to Lovell.

Ain't it a massive coincidence that the Astronaut with bad blood is the one reporting seeing flying saucers.

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 24 March 2013 - 11:57 AM, said:

All of Gordon Cooper's UFO testmony fits what others have reported.

As a speaker at UFO clubs and the poster boy for UFOlogy, what on earth would you expect?

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#104    psyche101

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 12:14 AM

View Postbadeskov, on 25 March 2013 - 12:01 AM, said:

Hey mate,

Frankly, I seriously doubt that. Those with some knowledge (which would be the vast majority) would readily disregard the ET kook nonsense and and respect Cooper for his actual accomplishments and not some cooked up ET stories.

Cheers,
Badeskov

Gidday Bade

I find though that if one Googles Edgar Mitchell, one gets more results on aliens than one does about his real accomplishments. With people so dependant on the net, I do feel this is the wrong thing to do. I personally know a young man whom I know grew up with e good education tried to tell me recently that man did not land on the moon. I was deeply saddened as I know the young man well, and I told him that I was very disappointed in him as I know he had a better education than that, which he seems to have rejected.
I also noticed that when I watched "When We Left Earth" That Coops and Edgar got almost no mention. Many others were interviewed, and goodness knows Edgar enjoys a camera (did he ever sort that NASA Mess out?) but those two got a wide berth. And I guess one canot blame anyone for the decision consider the controversial nature of the alternate agenda these two developed in the interim, with I am sure, plenty assistance from irresponsible media sources.
With so many on the net these days, and so few reading books, I do fear this is a very real concern. I expose my children to as much as is possible with regards to real history but people like Zoser make out an exciting new alternate exists, when it does not.
I hope your right, but I feel perhaps a tad optimistic.

Cheers.

Edited by psyche101, 25 March 2013 - 12:36 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#105    psyche101

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 12:25 AM

View PostScudbuster, on 24 March 2013 - 05:35 PM, said:

Jim - here's another military individual - Gen. Nathan Twining -  with specific comments - now you can't overtly reject this now can you?


Lt. Gen. Nathan F. Twining, then-head of Air Material Command's intelligence and engineering divisions at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base (then Wright Field), compiled and analyzed the data. Twining's memorandum to Schulgen, dated 23 September 1947, stated, in part:[8]
  • The phenomenon reported is something real and not visionary or fictitious.
  • There are objects probably approximately the shape of a disc, of such appreciable size as to appear to be as large as a man-made aircraft.
  • There is the possibility that some of the incidents may be caused by natural phenomena, such as meteors.
  • The reported operating characteristics such as extreme rates of climb, maneuverability (particularly in roll), and action which must be considered evasive when sighted or contacted by friendly aircraft and radar, lend belief to the possibility that some of the objects are controlled either manually, automatically or remotely.
  • It is possible within the present U.S. knowledge... to construct a piloted aircraft which has the general description ...
  • Any development in this country along the lines indicated would be extremely expensive...



If you read the entire memo, it is rather demystified.


Quote



(This is a transcription from the original memo.  As much as possible, the original format has been preserved.)
SUBJECT: AMC Opinion Concerning "Flying Discs

TO: Commanding General


Army Air Force
Washington 25, D.C.
ATTENTION: Brig. General George Schulgen
AC/AS-2
1. As requested by AC/AS-2 there is presented below the considered opinion of this command concerning the so-called "Flying Discs." This opinion is based on interrogation report data furnished by AC/AS-2 and preliminary studies by personnel of T-2 and Aircraft Laboratory, Engineering Division T-3. This opinion was arrived at in a conference between personnel from the Air Institute of Technology, Intelligence T-2, Office, Chief of Engineering Division, and the Aircraft, Power Plant and Propeller Laboratories of Engineering Division T-3.
2. It is the opinion that:


a. The phenomenon is something real and not visionary or fictitious.
b. There are objects probably approximating the shape of a disc, of such appreciable size as to appear to be as large as man-made aircraft.
c. There is a possibility that some of the incidents may be caused by natural phenomena, such as meteors.
d. The reported operating characteristics such as extreme rates of climb, maneuverability (particularly in roll), and motion which must be considered evasive when sighted or contacted by friendly aircraft and radar, lend belief to the possibility that some of the objects are controlled either manually, automatically or remotely.
e. The apparent common description is as follows:-



(1) Metallic or light reflecting surface.
(2) Absence of trail, except in a few instances where the object apparently was operating under high performance conditions.
(3) Circular or elliptical in shape, flat on bottom and domed on top.
(4) Several reports of well kept formation flights varying from three to nine objects.
(5) Normally no associated sound, except in three instances a substantial rumbling roar was noted.
(6) Level flight speeds normally above 300 knots are estimated.


f. It is possible within the present U.S. knowledge -- provided extensive detailed development is undertaken -- to construct a piloted aircraft which has the general description of the object in sub- paragraph (e) above which would be capable of an approximate range of 7000 miles at subsonic speeds.
g. Any development in this country along the lines indicated would be extremely expensive, time consuming and at the considerable expense of current projects and therefore, if directed, should be set up independently of existing projects.
h. Due consideration must be given the following:-


(1) The possibility that these objects are of domestic origin - the product of some high security project not known to AC/AS-2 or this Command.
(2) The lack of physical evidence in the shape of crash recovered exhibits which would undeniably prove the existence of these subjects.
(3) The possibility that some foreign nation has a form of propulsion possibly nuclear, which is outside of our domestic knowledge.



3. It is recommended that:-


a. Headquarters, Army Air Forces issue a directive assigning a priority, security classification and Code name for a detailed study of this matter to include the preparation of complete sets of all available and pertinent data which will then be made available to the Army, Navy, Atomic Energy Commission, JRDB, the Air Force Scientific Advisory Group, NACA, and the RAND and NEPA projects for comments and recommendations, with a preliminary report to be forwarded within 15 days of receipt of the data and a detailed report thereafter every 30 days as the investigation develops. A complete interchange of data should be affected.


4. Awaiting a specific directive AMC will continue the investigation within its current resources in order to more closely define the nature of the phenomenon. Detailed Essential Elements of Information will be formulated immediately for transmittal thru channels.



LINK


I do believe the Lost Shamans Intel Ops Roswell Hypothesis relies heavily on this memo, which indicates that the UFO Phenomena is something the military is interested in learning more about, and an operation to divert the attention of the public is recommended to allow an unbiased investigation.

Rather than indicate this is proof of ET, I feel it is strong evidence to suggest that the famous Roswell Incident was staged. This seems corroborated by the recovery of several RAWIN's in the area during the incident's time frame. That drew the attention of the public whilst the USAF was left to study the UFO phenomena unhindered. I bolded the last line, which seems to pretty much say exactly this.


UFO's are agreeably real, and not at all fictitious, only the connection to ET is fictitious.

Edited by psyche101, 25 March 2013 - 12:27 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who




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