151 replies to this topic

[RavenHawk]

I suppose that the following article should go in the Europe forum but I’m not posting it because of what is happening in Iceland.  I’m posting this to “collect” Traits of Socialism and ask: would people here in America be OK with more and more government infringement?  I am appalled with this story and how Icelanders are “OK” with it.

http://news.uk.msn.c...-for-own-name-2

What are some of the other Socialist traits which steal personal Liberty and Freedom, including higher taxes (France), gun control (England) and National Healthcare (England).  Is this what we really really really want here?  What is in place to check the ever growing power of the government over the people?

[Br Cornelius]

RavenHawk, on 03 January 2013 - 05:28 PM, said:

I suppose that the following article should go in the Europe forum but I’m not posting it because of what is happening in Iceland.  I’m posting this to “collect” Traits of Socialism and ask: would people here in America be OK with more and more government infringement?  I am appalled with this story and how Icelanders are “OK” with it.

http://news.uk.msn.c...-for-own-name-2

What are some of the other Socialist traits which steal personal Liberty and Freedom, including higher taxes (France), gun control (England) and National Healthcare (England).  Is this what we really really really want here?  What is in place to check the ever growing power of the government over the people?

Your premise is entirely wrong - the article has absolutely nothing to do with socialism and it shows profound ignorance on your part to confuse the two. If anything this shows a deep social conservatism on the part of the Iceland government.
It really pays to understand the basics before commenting on them.

Br Cornelius

Edited by Br Cornelius, 03 January 2013 - 05:35 PM.

[questionmark]

I still think you should learn what words mean before posting a joke.

[Corp]

Is this a massively stupid law? Yes.
Is this a common trait of socialist governments? No.
Should this be in the US forum so you can again trying to scare people about the "evils" of socialism? No.

[Br Cornelius]

Dumb ass.

Br Cornelius

[RavenHawk]

Br Cornelius, on 03 January 2013 - 05:32 PM, said:

Your premise is entirely wrong - the article has absolutely nothing to do with socialism and it shows profound ignorance on your part to confuse the two. It really pays to understand the basics before commenting on them.

Br Cornelius

The name does not appear on the government approved list.  What part of that do you not understand?

[Kasey2601]

You're right. Let's get rid of all law and taxes and everything and just live however you want.

[Br Cornelius]

RavenHawk, on 03 January 2013 - 05:39 PM, said:

The name does not appear on the government approved list.  What part of that do you not understand?

I understand the meaning of socialism
You appear not to.

Br Cornelius

[RavenHawk]

Corp, on 03 January 2013 - 05:36 PM, said:

Is this a massively stupid law? Yes.

It is as with all things Socialist.

Quote

Is this a common trait of socialist governments? No.

It is very typical of a controlling government gone amok.

Quote

Should this be in the US forum so you can again trying to scare people about the "evils" of socialism? No.

Absolutely!!!  I am trying to scare the Hell out of the sheeple and make them wake up.

[RavenHawk]

Lady Kasey, on 03 January 2013 - 05:43 PM, said:

You're right. Let's get rid of all law and taxes and everything and just live however you want.

That’s not it.  Without law, there can be no freedom.  But there is a difference between a government in its proper role of leaving the people alone and a government gradually grabbing more and more power away from the people and infringing on their lives.

[Rlyeh]

http://www.britannic...51569/socialism

"socialism, social and economic doctrine that calls for public rather than private ownership or control of property and natural resources. According to the socialist view, individuals do not live or work in isolation but live in cooperation with one another. Furthermore, everything that people produce is in some sense a social product, and everyone who contributes to the production of a good is entitled to a share in it. Society as a whole, therefore, should own or at least control property for the benefit of all its members."

Now, what the **** has Socialism got to do with the news article?

[RavenHawk]

Br Cornelius, on 03 January 2013 - 05:44 PM, said:

I understand the meaning of socialism
You appear not to.

Br Cornelius

We’ll see.  Ok, fine.  Then would you please in a few sentences in your own words, tell us what Socialism is to you?  Please don’t cut and paste definitions.

[Br Cornelius]

RavenHawk, on 03 January 2013 - 05:52 PM, said:

We’ll see.  Ok, fine.  Then would you please in a few sentences in your own words, tell us what Socialism is to you?  Please don’t cut and paste definitions.

Ryleh gave a very concise definition - I agree.

Some of the most socially oppressive governments in history have been right-wing in orientation. There is no correlation between the law quoted in Iceland and the political makeup of that nation.

Br Cornelius

[Tutankhaten-pasheri]

Perhaps some confusion here between socialism and totalitarianism. These prescriptive laws are on a road to totalitarianism, a road trod by left and right. Socialism does not have to end in totalitarianism. Peter Kropotkin understood that he and Marx wanted a similar outcome to their dreams, but Kropotkin saw that ideas of Marx would lead through a period of totalitarianism and violently disagreed with Marx. Marxism led to Marxism-Leninism and dictatorship. I think Bolsheviks under Lenin knew in their hearts that Kropotkin was correct with his ideas about anarchism, though it was too late as Stalin was now hovering like a black cloud. Socialism is not that simple to define when it includes Marxism-Leninism and many types of anarchy. Some would say that anarchism is real socialism, and what is usually called socialism is actually state capitalism.

[RavenHawk]

Br Cornelius, on 03 January 2013 - 05:57 PM, said:

Ryleh gave a very concise definition - I agree.

Well, I had asked that you didn’t pull out a canned definition, but that’s ok.  That’s the definition I was looking for.  In that definition, who decides on what portion of the share each individual gets?  Who decides which members benefit more?

Quote

Some of the most socially oppressive governments in history have been right-wing in orientation. There is no correlation between the law quoted in Iceland and the political makeup of that nation.

Br Cornelius

It has nothing to do with Right-wing or Left-wing.  I had made an extensive post earlier that went into explaining that.  The key is how much control does the government have?  Our Constitution was designed to limit government and keep it in its proper place.  Socialist governments and Democracies do everything they can to grab more and more power and infringe on people’s lives even in the least aspects.