Rudolf Posted October 23, 2006 #1 Share Posted October 23, 2006 'If a metaphysical theory feels good, especially if that theory tells us that we are all, potentially or not, children or priests of God, and equal before Him, you can rest assure that theory is bogus.'[spitzer] Taken from http://www.world-mysteries.com/PhilipGardi..._letters_12.htm Rudolf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. President Posted October 24, 2006 #2 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Taken from http://www.world-mysteries.com/PhilipGardi..._letters_12.htm Rudolf. Well now that's not accurate is it. Maybe a faith (like Christianity) should be disproved first before he makes bold statements like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiggs Posted October 24, 2006 #3 Share Posted October 24, 2006 It's as impossible to disprove a Faith as it is to prove it. That's why it's called Faith and not Fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. President Posted October 24, 2006 #4 Share Posted October 24, 2006 It's as impossible to disprove a Faith as it is to prove it. That's why it's called Faith and not Fact. True it is impossible to prove but that doesn't mean that people don't know if what they believe is true. I happen to know without a doubt what I believe is True, however knowing this does not provide me with evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadMachine Posted October 24, 2006 #5 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Of course, Prez, many people are just as sure in their non-belief (or other belief) as you are in your belief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Preacherbill Posted October 24, 2006 #6 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Of course, Prez, many people are just as sure in their non-belief (or other belief) as you are in your belief. The answer to this question depends greatly on each individuals personal belief. There is no way to know for sure. I mean maybe South Park got it right and only the Mormons go to heaven with a large purple looking thing and that would be hell to Saddam Hussein. We can only believe what we feel is true and have faith. God is not something that requires proof only faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Posted October 24, 2006 Author #7 Share Posted October 24, 2006 We can only believe what we feel is true. I wonder what Nietzsche would have answered on that one. Probbaly that Intuition is mainly wishfull thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bella-Angelique Posted October 24, 2006 #8 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Probbaly that Maybe when you take a break from attempting to screw your way into heaven you should try editing also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zandore Posted October 24, 2006 #9 Share Posted October 24, 2006 (edited) The answer to this question depends greatly on each individuals personal belief. There is no way to know for sure. I mean maybe South Park got it right and only the Mormons go to heaven with a large purple looking thing and that would be hell to Saddam Hussein. We can only believe what we feel is true and have faith. God is not something that requires proof only faith. Faith: not wanting to know what is true. Friedrich Nietzsche A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything. Friedrich Nietzsche Edited October 24, 2006 by zandore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Posted October 24, 2006 Author #10 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Maybe when you take a break from attempting to screw your way into heaven you should try editing also. Bella-Angelique, I don't think I care for the tone in your posts. And I wonder what you are doing in Spirituality, Religion and Beliefs? Rudolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. President Posted October 24, 2006 #11 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Of course, Prez, many people are just as sure in their non-belief (or other belief) as you are in your belief. But you see I know for sure that what I believe is true, i know it like fact. I know it like I know everything else I know. Can I prove I know? No. Can I prove it? No. Knowing it does not provide evidence for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bella-Angelique Posted October 24, 2006 #12 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Bella-Angelique, I don't think I care for the tone in your posts. If you did not want an answer about my editing then you should have used your words in the form of a statement and not as a question. Do not whine now because I did answer. Whining is so unbecoming in a god you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitco Posted October 24, 2006 #13 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Maybe when you take a break from attempting to screw your way into heaven you should try editing also. Bella i love your posts will you be my girl so we can get ito hevon, AS IN HELL I MEAN.... muhahahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Posted October 24, 2006 Author #14 Share Posted October 24, 2006 If you did not want an answer about my editing then you should have used your words in the form of a statement and not as a question. Do not whine now because I did answer. Whining is so unbecoming in a god you know. O.k., I will ignore your posts from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Posted October 24, 2006 #15 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Maybe when you take a break from attempting to screw your way into heaven you should try editing also. Bella; perhaps you should choose your words more carefully. There is no need to stoop to insult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solitarytraveler Posted October 24, 2006 #16 Share Posted October 24, 2006 But you see I know for sure that what I believe is true, i know it like fact. I know it like I know everything else I know. Can I prove I know? No. Can I prove it? No. Knowing it does not provide evidence for it. That sounds just like something you would say, Mr. Bush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampGator Posted October 24, 2006 #17 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Everything that I know and believe as fact and true I can prove. Maybe my brain works differentely but I can't believe a myth that is unproven and not factual. It seems to me that "faith" is used because truth cannot be obtained on the subject. If it were factual and actual, faith would not be required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. President Posted October 24, 2006 #18 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Bella; perhaps you should choose your words more carefully. There is no need to stoop to insult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. President Posted October 24, 2006 #19 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Everything that I know and believe as fact and true I can prove. Maybe my brain works differentely but I can't believe a myth that is unproven and not factual. It seems to me that "faith" is used because truth cannot be obtained on the subject. If it were factual and actual, faith would not be required. I am the same way. I can prove everything I know is true, with the exception of this one instance. Many people, even on UM (BZRK), have ignored my evidence when I have presented it a good ten times. People will not see evidence they don't want to, or are skeptical to. And only in a few cases do people truly see the what is true. Like I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx_Barracuda Posted October 24, 2006 #20 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Many people, even on UM (BZRK), have ignored my evidence when I have presented it a good ten times. Oh, really? And what evidence would this be? Cause I have yet to see you post anything that has been proven true. I can prove everything I know is true Can you? Oh, but wait. This is what you posted EARLIER: True it is impossible to prove but that doesn't mean that people don't know if what they believe is true. I happen to know without a doubt what I believe is True, however knowing this does not provide me with evidence. Hmm....so when ARE you going to post this glorious evidence of yours, hmm? You've mentioned it several times, but have yet to present it to anyone. Do you expect us to actually believe everything your saying, just because YOU say it's true? No, I don't buy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamsSon Posted October 24, 2006 #21 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Can everybody be saved? The answer appears to be no. predestination In Christianity, the doctrine that God has long ago determined who will be saved and who will be damned. Three types of predestination doctrine have developed. One doctrine holds that God singled out the saved because he foresaw their future merits. A second doctrine (often identified with John Calvin) states that from eternity God has determined the saved and the damned, regardless of their merit or lack thereof. A third doctrine, set forth by Thomas Aquinas and Martin Luther, ascribes salvation to the unmerited grace of God but links the lack of grace to sin. SOURCE In several places in the Bible, God speaks about having chosen His children before the beginning of the world. However, He doesn't provide a list of names, and as far as I can tell, everyone can choose to believe or not to believe. So, maybe your question should be more personal, Can you be saved? I would say, yes, since I have yet to meet a person who wanted to be saved and was unable to be saved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohio tsunami Posted October 24, 2006 #22 Share Posted October 24, 2006 Can everybody be saved? The answer appears to be no. SOURCE In several places in the Bible, God speaks about having chosen His children before the beginning of the world. However, He doesn't provide a list of names, and as far as I can tell, everyone can choose to believe or not to believe. So, maybe your question should be more personal, Can you be saved? I would say, yes, since I have yet to meet a person who wanted to be saved and was unable to be saved. I thought according to Christian faith, everyone who comes to the Father through Christ would be saved. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if God has already chosen his children long ago then what is the point of Christianity? Please explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fleur-de-lis Posted October 24, 2006 #23 Share Posted October 24, 2006 I always was under the belief that it was only certain Catholics in the 1500s who believed that God already had chosen who he saved. That what I've always been told and I've never heard the idea of God already choosing his children.... Its complete nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Preacherbill Posted October 24, 2006 #24 Share Posted October 24, 2006 I thought according to Christian faith, everyone who comes to the Father through Christ would be saved. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if God has already chosen his children long ago then what is the point of Christianity? Please explain. It depends largely on the theology of the specific flavor of Christianity. It is frustrating when people lump all Christian thought and theology into one category. Personally I can give you the theology of the Lutheran church. That’s what I am a part of. Everyone else need give there own answer. In our teachings we believe that all humanity is fallen from the grace of God and that no act by any human could put us back into our proper relationship with God. It took Jesus, whom we believe was both completely human and completely divine, taking on the sacrifice of death which was meant for all of humanity, ie a eternal death of the soul after the death of our body, and then returning to life. This divine act then put all humanity back into the proper relationship with God. It frees us from the bondage of sin to live out our lives with Christ as an example. Lutherans see this as the fulfillment of the covenant made between God and man in the old testament and the making of a new covenant, which Jesus talks about in the last supper account and Lutherans honor with the sacrament of holy communion. Hope this helps clarify one theological view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Posted October 25, 2006 Author #25 Share Posted October 25, 2006 I have yet to meet a person who wanted to be saved and was unable to be saved. So, how do you know those persons are saved? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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