277 replies to this topic

[The New Richard Nixon]

Zara Im not American lol

[Czero 101]

Myles, on 22 July 2012 - 02:41 AM, said:

More people die from cars than guns.  

Let's address this point.

(Not meaning to pick on you, Myles... you just had the right quote)

While the above quote is true, it is only just barely true.

In 2010 in the U.S. there were 32,885 motor vehicle deaths.[SOURCE]

Also in the U.S. in 2010 there were 31,513 deaths by firearms.[SOURCE]

Not quite the wide gap that people tend to assume when they state that "more people die from cars than from guns", is it...?

It is also interesting to note that the number of motor vehicle fatalities has been trending downward, while the number of firearms fatalities has been trending upward.





Cz

Edited by Czero 101, 22 July 2012 - 09:30 AM.

[protostar]

I'm glad that here in the UK there is strict firearms control.Doesn't mean that I can't get a shotgun or a .22 rimfire as long as I have a legitimate reason and suitable land to use one, and as long as I pass background checks.
I currently have a 12ft/lb .177 air rifle that I go out stalking cute little bunnies (much to my childrens dismay) and use it just to fire at targets, and I think it's good fun.
Now maybe you Americans will roll over on your backs laughing at me and my pea shooter, but I'm hoping to maybe get a licence for a .22 rimfire with landowners permission.......tell me, why would I need anything else?Why does anyone think that they need to own a semi or fully automatic assault rifle and not only that , but build up an armory of them with god knows what else!

Yeah any firearm, even my peashooter has the potential to kill, but the difference between a nutjob running amok with a bolt action rifle with small rounds and the same nutjob with an AK47 should be obvious.

During my teenage years I was in the army cadets and did get the opportunity to fire machine guns, and yeah it was good fun, so I can understand the fun factor in it, but the thought of my next door neghbour owning an Uzi scares the bejeezus out of me.

My opinion is that anyone who wants to have fun and aquire skill at fireing militaria should join the army and put it to good use protecting the state/nation.

[The New Richard Nixon]

Or by doing shooting events or joining a club

[Toadie]

Gosh America is not very good
Australian stats
2.23 Selected Underlying Causes, Assault (X85-Y09, Y87.1) - 2006
Assault by rifle, shotgun and larger firearm discharge (X94)  males 5 females 6
Assault by sharp object (X99)  males 44 females 17

2.19 Selected Underlying Causes, External Causes (V01-Y98) - 2006
Transport accidents (V01-V99, Y85)(a)  males 1262 females 406

Massive difference in our country between car and gun deaths

Edited by Toadie, 22 July 2012 - 10:52 AM.

[FLOMBIE]

Myles, on 22 July 2012 - 02:41 AM, said:

A dog must sleep.  A dog costs money and is another animal reliant on me.   i have a small dog that can travel with us.   But he's inside at night. The animals get my chickens at night.

It's OK to own guns.   There are uses for them.   More people die from cars than guns.   it doesn't matter what they are used for.   It matters how they are misused.
No matter how hard you try, Zarakitty, you cannot see the future.  You do not no when a gun may be needed for personal protection.  Mostly i speak of a collaps of the power in the USA.

Guns are given away for free now in the States? I didn't know about that...

You can get other things for protection. You don't really need a gun. Things like pepper spray might actually be much more effective in a lot of scenarios.

@psychoticmike:
If you argue like that, private households should be able to obtain nukes. You don't get the point. We do ont want to stop people from killing each other (you are right, that's impossible), but we want to minimise gun related accidents, gun crime, and the possibility for a criminal to obtain a gun, and most important gun safety, and strict regulations for private gun ownership.

[Daughter of the Nine Moons]

Toadie, on 22 July 2012 - 10:51 AM, said:

Gosh America is not very good
Australian stats
2.23 Selected Underlying Causes, Assault (X85-Y09, Y87.1) - 2006
Assault by rifle, shotgun and larger firearm discharge (X94)  males 5 females 6
Assault by sharp object (X99)  males 44 females 17

2.19 Selected Underlying Causes, External Causes (V01-Y98) - 2006
Transport accidents (V01-V99, Y85)(a)  males 1262 females 406

Massive difference in our country between car and gun deaths

Toadie, There's a massive difference in population.

Australian population 22,620,600  in 2011
US population 311,591,917 in 2011

[Toadie]

I know that I'm making a point of how close your car / gun deaths are compare to how close are gun / car deaths are.

[Daughter of the Nine Moons]

Toadie, on 22 July 2012 - 11:41 AM, said:

I know that I'm making a point of how close your car / gun deaths are compare to how close are gun / car deaths are.

Actually...I'm Canadian.

And my apologies, I misunderstood your post.

[preacherman76]

FLOMBIE, on 22 July 2012 - 11:30 AM, said:

Guns are given away for free now in the States? I didn't know about that...

You can get other things for protection. You don't really need a gun. Things like pepper spray might actually be much more effective in a lot of scenarios.

@psychoticmike:
If you argue like that, private households should be able to obtain nukes. You don't get the point. We do ont want to stop people from killing each other (you are right, that's impossible), but we want to minimise gun related accidents, gun crime, and the possibility for a criminal to obtain a gun, and most important gun safety, and strict regulations for private gun ownership.

Doesnt your country already have those things? Why do you think its your responcibility to make sure we follow the same rules as you? Why would you burdon yourself with a subject you have no say over?

According to our constitution, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. Not even by our government. It certainly wont be infringed by a foreign influance.

[FLOMBIE]

Again, I am not here to change your laws, I might have spelled that out wrong in your quote. I am discussing if a constitutional right to bear arms is good or bad for a society.  I meant to show what postive outcome a strict gun control might have. And I don't have to live in the States to be interested in that topic.

Edited by FLOMBIE, 22 July 2012 - 02:00 PM.

[preacherman76]

Toadie, on 22 July 2012 - 03:13 AM, said:

What a crying shame you can't go out and hunt wild innocent animals for fun. Maybe you want to stick their head up in your house and use their fur for mat in your house. Its disgusting killing animals for sport

Not if you eat them.

[preacherman76]

FLOMBIE, on 22 July 2012 - 01:54 PM, said:

Again, I am not here to change your laws, I might have spelled that out wrong in your quote. I am discussing if a constitutional right to bear arms is good or bad for a society.  I meant to show what postive outcome a strict gun control might have. And I don't have to live in the States to be interested in that topic.

Freedom will always have consequences. Lack of freedom will always have worse consequences.

[FLOMBIE]

Please explain. I don't see it. Your statement sounds nice, but is not always true.

Edited by FLOMBIE, 22 July 2012 - 02:10 PM.

[preacherman76]

FLOMBIE, on 22 July 2012 - 02:10 PM, said:

Please explain. I don't see it. Your statement sounds nice, but is not always true.

But it is always true. Especialy when it comes to the second amendment. Sure you will have situations where people prove themselfs not responcible enough to handle such freedoms. And for such people those freedoms are removed. But we dont have to look to far back to see how a lack of such freedoms could be far worse. Just take Americans from Japan during WW2 who were hauled off to consentration camps, right here on American soil. Elect the wrong leader, and homosexuals might find them selfs in the same situation. Or Christians, or muslims, ect ect ect. To have a means to protect yourself from a potencialy tyrannical government is the very foundation to a trully free and open society. Especialy today. We have a government who has litteraly created a war on terror. Told us we were all in danger cause of men on the other side of the world in caves that want us all dead cause we are free. Then over the course of 11 years, we watched as it went from men in caves on the other side of the world, to them telling us to watch our neighbors. If we see something say something. We are all now subjected to molestation just to get on a plane. Somehow, suddenly WE became the terrorists. In thier own documents every single person in this country is a potencial terrorist. So much so that our government, directly against the constitution, is somehow allowed to kidnap a American, on American soil, lock them up and throw away the key, with no due process at all.