77 replies to this topic

[Arpee]

Panpsychism originates from the Greek words "Pan" which means "All", and "Psyche" which means "Mind". Panpsychism is the view that all things have mind or that there is a centralized mind for all things that exist. The idea seems bizarre at first, but if we look into the structure of the universe, it doesn't seem so far fetched.

Thoughts arise and pass through the mind. The thoughts may come and go, but the mind is still there. The mind is like a place where thoughts may enter and leave. Even when there are no thoughts, and you are observing the dark emptiness of the mind, the mind is still present. The mind is the observer of all thoughts passing through.

The world that we perceive of, may not be the true reality. The human eyes not see reality in energy or atomic form, rather it puts these atoms into groups and see them as "things". The true reality would be the quantum view. This is the only way to see reality with all of its detail. The truth is, for example, a solid wall is not really solid at all. There is much space in which atoms are flowing around in. Atoms are 99.9% empty space, but what is space?




There is no "void" or "nothingness". Even if you were to take away all of the light, heat, mass, and sound there would still be "something" there that can not go away. This is because all "Space" has a low fluctuation of potential energy which is in inherent called "virtual particles"; therefore, for example, a photon (light particle) can be pulled out from the so-called "void", or "nothingness". For clarity, this so-called "void" or "nothingness" will be referred to as "space" since this "nothingness" can never actually be nothing (since virtual particles will always be there - therefore it is never "empty").



There are many similarities between the universe, and neurons. For example, both the universe and neurons are in the same structure and looks very similar. There are theories that say that there is more than one universe, there are many (the multi-verse), but there are many groupings of neurons but they are all connected, just as this universe is a web-like grouping which may connect to other universes.



Neurons are brain cells. These brain cells are in groupings and yet, they are all connected functioning as one brain. Thoughts are created when one neuron (or group) talks to another neuron (or group). This is done through bio-electricity (energy). Thoughts are actually something existent that we can examine (bio-electricity) and we are even beginning to learn to translate this energy into images so that they can be understood [1]. It is not the mind that is thinking these thoughts. The mind is what is observing these thoughts passing through. The physical brain is working with neurons to produce these thoughts and it is the mind that is observing them. So, what is around these communications but are not apart of it? What is nearby "observing" these thoughts happening through the communication of neurons, without actually "being" a part of it? It could be that the space in between these neuron communications is what is "observing" these thoughts happening. It could be that the "space" itself is the mind (observation) and the physical "brain" - the neurons communicating through bio-electricity is creating these thoughts which the mind is "observing".



This would also explain psychic phenomena such as "Remote Viewing" and why people experience a "Universal Mind" or "Unity (Oneness)" in a Near Death Experience. It would also explain why people would experience a "separation" or "hell" (they did not fully integrate with the infinity of space - the universal mind).

[StarMountainKid]

Quote

Thoughts arise and pass through the mind. The thoughts may come and go, but the mind is still there. The mind is like a place where thoughts may enter and leave. Even when there are no thoughts, and you are observing the dark emptiness of the mind, the mind is still present. The mind is the observer of all thoughts passing through.

First, let me understand this part. You say it is not the mind that is thinking, it is the brain, and the mind is only the observer of thought. Perhaps mind as consciousness. This mind/consciousness is independent of the brain.

Then, what is the function of mind if it has no control of brain activity? For instance, what is happening when one makes a conscious decision, then acts on it? Is this an act of the mind, or of the brain? Is it an illusion that the mind makes these kinds of decisions?

In other words, is there communication between mind and brain?

[Arpee]

StarMountainKid, on 15 August 2012 - 10:07 PM, said:

Then, what is the function of mind if it has no control of brain activity?

The mind is the space that is observing the neuron communications (thoughts) happening with in it. The function of the mind is to observe. Thoughts are things, it is energy that is being transferred through neurons in communication. The brain is thinking, the mind is observing.

[StarMountainKid]

Aarpee said:

The brain is thinking, the mind is observing.

So...whats the point of this configuration? I mean, if mind just sits around listening to the usual random brain chatter...?

Edited by StarMountainKid, 15 August 2012 - 11:31 PM.

[The Id3al Experience]

I agree with Star, The brain delivers what the mind wants.

"One controls his reality when he controls his mind"

[Arpee]

The Id3al Experience, on 15 August 2012 - 11:49 PM, said:

I agree with Star, The brain delivers what the mind wants.

"One controls his reality when he controls his mind"

The mind does not want, the brain wants. Wants - thoughts of "I want this or that" is the brain thinking. The mind is the "space" aware of these thoughts.

StarMountainKid, on 15 August 2012 - 11:28 PM, said:

So...whats the point of this configuration? I mean, if mind just sits around listening to the usual random brain chatter...?

There is no "point" (purpose). Purpose is when the brain is giving meaning to something in order to achieve its goal; for example, the point of water is to keep living beings hydrated so that life can survive. In reality the water just exists, but it is the brain giving "purpose" to things...

With that being said, the mind is not just "listening" to "random brain chatter", it is the awareness that you have now. Your eye are not "seeing" it pulls in light (energy) and sends it to your brain and then you are "aware" of it (mind).

So the mind is not just aware of brain chatter it is aware of all of the energy that you are gathering (sight, audio, taste, sensation, scent) in reality in this present moment or in the imagination.

Also, since mind is space / awareness (observation), that would mean that in reality, there is no difference between "me" and "you", there is only one reality, but it seems like there are "things" because the brain splits the energy (light, audio, whatever...) in order to make sense of it. Also, it is not "your" mind or "my" mind. Just like it isn't "my" space or "your" space, space just is. It only seems to be "your" mind because the "space" is IN your brain and aware of the energy flow (thoughts) within it. But when you die and the brain shut off, this "space" is extended into the infinite of space.

[notoverrated]

sounds interesting i guess.

[StarMountainKid]

Arpee said:

It only seems to be "your" mind because the "space" is IN your brain and aware of the energy flow (thoughts) within it. But when you die and the brain shut off, this "space" is extended into the infinite of space.

Does the brain need mind at all?
Also, is the feeling of 'the me' in the mind? If this is so, my awareness of 'the me' is separate from the brain, but the brain must also have some sense of 'me-ness' also. I don't think the brain could function without some sense of itself, so the brain must have some inner self-consciousness and be conscious of the external world.

Are these two consciousnesses separate from each other? If so, 'the me' of the brain is forever hidden from 'the me' of mind. It's odd to think that within my brain exists a separate person (that is still me) that the 'me' of the mind can never communicate with. It's like a doppeldanger that's in control of me, but I can never be in control of it.

My consciousness of myself is a helpless passenger that is just along for the ride. I hope my brain knows what it's doing.

[The Id3al Experience]

"The mind does not want, the brain wants. Wants - thoughts of "I want this or that" is the brain thinking. The mind is the "space" aware of these thoughts"

Want maybe the wrong word, desire maybe?

The brain doesnt want, it is only a processor of information. The information the brain processes then creates our perceptive in which the mind can experience. Its our iliision of seperation from mind/body/spirit which then courses us to want and need as an individual.

So yes, the mind is observing, but it also chooses what to think about the observations. Your brain processes the information the mind has either observsed, smelt, tasted or heard.

I stand by my statement

Kind Regards,
Me

[Arpee]

StarMountainKid, on 16 August 2012 - 02:36 AM, said:

is the feeling of 'the me' in the mind?

No. The mind just observes the thought of "me" in the brain.

StarMountainKid, on 16 August 2012 - 02:36 AM, said:

If this is so, my awareness of 'the me' is separate from the brain

Correct.

StarMountainKid, on 16 August 2012 - 02:36 AM, said:

but the brain must also have some sense of 'me-ness' also. I don't think the brain could function without some sense of itself, so the brain must have some inner self-consciousness and be conscious of the external world.

No, the "me-ness" itself is from the brain. The mind observes the thoughts, and those thoughts just happen to be "I am this..." or "I am that.." or "I am aware of ME..."

StarMountainKid, on 16 August 2012 - 02:36 AM, said:

Are these two consciousnesses separate from each other?

There is no "two consciousness-es". There is just "consciousness". It isn't "MINE" or "YOURS" it just is. It is the brain that gives this sense of "self" by thinking thoughts of "I am this..." or "I am that..."

StarMountainKid, on 16 August 2012 - 02:36 AM, said:

It's odd to think that within my brain exists a separate person (that is still me) that the 'me' of the mind can never communicate with.

Did you read my original post? There is no separation... between anything. Reality is reality, it is the brain that separates and identifies. Reality is just a fluctuation of energy.

StarMountainKid, on 16 August 2012 - 02:36 AM, said:

It's like a doppeldanger that's in control of me, but I can never be in control of it.

How can the brain (which thinks) be in control of the mind (which observes)? Control implies that something is stop something else from doing what it *wants*. To want is not a function of the mind, the mind observes, the thoughts of "wanting this or that..." comes from the brain (thought).

StarMountainKid, on 16 August 2012 - 02:36 AM, said:

My consciousness of myself is a helpless passenger that is just along for the ride. I hope my brain knows what it's doing.

How can the mind be a helpless passenger? The mind observes, there is no wanting or desire, there is no "thinking" of "wanted" things. The brain is thinking in terms of "I/ME", the brain is thinking of "wanting this or that". The brain thinks. It's doing just what it's supposed to do.

The Id3al Experience, on 16 August 2012 - 02:48 AM, said:

So yes, the mind is observing, but it also chooses what to think about the observations. Your brain processes the information the mind has either observsed, smelt, tasted or heard.

No. The mind does not think. The brain thinks. Thought is created through neuron communications through bio-electricity. That is what thought is. Something physical (the brain). The mind is the SPACE that is aware of these thoughts. It does not think. It only observes these thoughts of "desire" or "self" or "dislike"...

[The Id3al Experience]

Arpee, on 16 August 2012 - 03:11 AM, said:

No. The mind does not think. The brain thinks. Thought is created through neuron communications through bio-electricity. That is what thought is. Something physical (the brain). The mind is the SPACE that is aware of these thoughts. It does not think. It only observes these thoughts of "desire" or "self" or "dislike"...

This is your opinion, and this is fine. But if the brain is the one thinking, what courses the thoughts? what controls these thoughts, and what acts on these thoughts? The brain?

The mind drives the thoughts in my opinion which the brain processes..

If your theory is correct, then YOU choose to do nothing, and everything in your life is running on auto and you are just observing that. This then takes away any free will. And any point to existence.

Mediation can be a very good tool in seeing what the mind is capiable of. Once your mind is still and no thoughts are there you can easily see the brain is not in control. You use your mind to stop the brain from processing thoughts.

Kind Regards,
Me

[Arpee]

The Id3al Experience, on 16 August 2012 - 03:35 AM, said:

This is your opinion, and this is fine.

Sorry, it is a fact that thoughts are just neuron communications in the brain.

The Id3al Experience, on 16 August 2012 - 03:35 AM, said:

what courses the thoughts?

Neuron communications (synapses) causes thoughts [ in other words the brain].

The Id3al Experience, on 16 August 2012 - 03:35 AM, said:

But if the brain is the one thinking, what courses the thoughts? what controls these thoughts, and what acts on these thoughts? The brain?

Impulses to act on desires are also physical.

The Id3al Experience, on 16 August 2012 - 03:35 AM, said:

The mind drives the thoughts in my opinion which the brain processes..

Nope, the brain does. We are even beginning to be able to read thoughts. Thoughts are physical bio-electric energy  from communications of neurons. [http://techland.time...ts-into-movies/]

The Id3al Experience, on 16 August 2012 - 03:35 AM, said:

If your theory is correct, then YOU choose to do nothing, and everything in your life is running on auto and you are just observing that. This then takes away any free will. And any point to existence.

It is not "your" life or "my" life, it is just life. Everything is made of sub-atomic particles which are made up of energy. Life is happening. Life is a fluctuation of energy. This is not theory but fact that we can prove from quantum mechanics.

Like I already explained before, "purpose" is not a concept from the perspective of unity, but one from duality. There is no purpose when you realize that "reality" is one whole, it is only the human BRAIN which sees things as "useful" or "Not-useful" which gives meaning to things.

[Professor T]

Arpee, on 15 August 2012 - 08:25 PM, said:

This would also explain psychic phenomena such as "Remote Viewing" and why people experience a "Universal Mind" or "Unity (Oneness)" in a Near Death Experience. It would also explain why people would experience a "separation" or "hell" (they did not fully integrate with the infinity of space - the universal mind).

Cool Subject...
I totally agree with this ..
I kind of see us       humanity   as small pockets of focused consciousness experiancing small portions of reality. But we all belong to a single consciousness. The way I figure it; Brain=Vehicle, senses & meaty bits, Soul=individual Mind & Ego, Consiousness is the universal self or energy that allows it all to happen. Brain, Soul & Consiousness are seperatet things, not to be mistaken for each other but working together to create & experience reality.
To put it another way,
Brain = Computer system, keyboard, monitor, speekers, mouse.
Soul = Software, a game, a program that is run in the computer.
Consiousness = The electricity that allows it all to work.
Reality = Brain+Soul+Consiousness.

Edited by Professortaylor, 16 August 2012 - 04:23 AM.

[Kazoo]

So the mind just....observes? Sounds terrible useless. But I guess the "Mind" does not have the capability to decide if something is useless. Because it just...observes.

The mind does nothing...But it can't perceive nothing...anyway? So it does not care...But the mind cannot perceive caring...?

So everything is one. And there is no point. Because the mind cannot understand the concept of "point".

This mind sounds terrible stupid. Can you even call it a mind? What does it do with everything it absorbs? Whats the point of observing if it cannot do anything with the information it observes? Why would a mind like this even bother to exist?

I don't understand this at all.

Edited by Kazoo, 16 August 2012 - 08:00 AM.

[Rlyeh]

Arpee, on 15 August 2012 - 08:25 PM, said:

Thoughts arise and pass through the mind. The thoughts may come and go, but the mind is still there. The mind is like a place where thoughts may enter and leave. Even when there are no thoughts, and you are observing the dark emptiness of the mind, the mind is still present. The mind is the observer of all thoughts passing through.

So the mind doesn't actually do anything? How can you tell it exists then?

Quote

The world that we perceive of, may not be the true reality. The human eyes not see reality in energy or atomic form, rather it puts these atoms into groups and see them as "things". The true reality would be the quantum view. This is the only way to see reality with all of its detail. The truth is, for example, a solid wall is not really solid at all. There is much space in which atoms are flowing around in. Atoms are 99.9% empty space, but what is space?

I disagree with your terminology, if a solid wall was not solid then objects would pass through it. Since this doesn't happen, it is by definition solid.

Edited by Rlyeh, 16 August 2012 - 09:12 AM.