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Test of manhood ritual


The Gremlin

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Sometimes i think that our society misses these tests of manhood, tribal rituals that make a boy a man...initiations into manhood and becoming a part of society.

Much of our lives folk run around trying to prove themselves...is it because we are missing this ritual?

Tribal communities seem to have it sussed, there are various tests that abound (some are like frat initiations) once completed the new man is secure in his manhood and mutual respect seems to be a given thing. outsiders when they come in can take these tests, once performed they are accepted as one of the tribe.

I think it speaks to us on a very deep and intuative level.

check this guy out, cow jumping with the hamar in the buff.....you may have seen the series Tribe...great stuff. :D

The story is, he ingratiates himself into a tribe for a month, becomming one of them...in a great anthropologist way.

each episode he spends it with a different tribe, and has travelled from borneo, africa, amazon.

He is a tidy guy i seen on various programs, genuine and has none of that Great White Anthropologist baggage.

In various shaman rituals, under various influences he has some real and touching self revelations.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjPTNvM595A

:D

Edited by lil gremlin
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Let me guess, you just watched 300?

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Let me guess, you just watched 300?

not at all, (although i did watch it recently)...it is a view that ive entertained for years, also i loved the series Tribe on the bbc when it was on....think the second series has just been aired but ive been at work when its on so ive got to wait till it comes on sky.

i found this clip whilst browsing u-tube and it made me laugh. its a shame there arent many more of them on there.

:)

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Sometimes i think that our society misses these tests of manhood, tribal rituals that make a boy a man

We still have them, they are called "Basic Military Training" and every military recruit undergoes the tests of manhood there. LOL...But yes, I agree we need these rituals and trials for all, not just military and not just Men... :yes:

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The show was called something else over here int he US, I think, but I did like it. A lot better than your standard "here are some tribal people" next frame, type of documentary.

I also think that having all 18 year old guys (or whatever age) jump over cows in the nude would really be great for society. :blink:

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We still have them, they are called "Basic Military Training" and every military recruit undergoes the tests of manhood there. LOL...But yes, I agree we need these rituals and trials for all, not just military and not just Men... :yes:

I agree, it was remiss of me to neglect the better sex. but i wouldnt want to make them climb trees in the nud and fetch honey from a bees' nest or hornets nest.....the nudie bit could stay tho....maybe mud wrestle the current champ or something?

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perhaps all 18 year old should have to move out on their own, hold down a job, pay their own bills and not mooch off their parents anymore? That would be good to show manhood/womanhood.

I joined the Army when I was 17 and for me that was a good ritual for manhood, but I know that it isn't for everyone...

I agree though, our culture has no real deliniation of childhood and adulthood...at one point you can graduate from school, vote, drive, or drink, but those don't really qualify in my opinion...something more official needs to happen that gives that person a greater responsibility and official status as moving into adulthood.

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A couple of folks have mentioned that women should have their "ritual" into adulthood to... I think we as women already have that, it's a biological function that happens in our pre-to early teens.

I'd be willing to bet this is how and why men started "manhood" rituals, it wasn't clear when they were adults. With women, it's instantly clear.

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A couple of folks have mentioned that women should have their "ritual" into adulthood to... I think we as women already have that, it's a biological function that happens in our pre-to early teens.

I'd be willing to bet this is how and why men started "manhood" rituals, it wasn't clear when they were adults. With women, it's instantly clear.

good point, hadnt thought of that....can they do the noody thing anyway?

seriously tho, the state has taken that away though, and for good reason...age of consent.

some folk celebrate 16 as a big milestone, some 18 and some 21....we need more than a big birthday party.

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Dont we need a "tribe" or "society" before we have any sort of initiation ritual?

Sure I'm sorrounded by people everyday but I dont know their names or give a **** about them. Personally I dont think our concept of society truly exists as a society, more like a bunch of people that for some reason they cant put their finger on need to be around people but curse every long line up and traffic jam that they find themselves in.

A fine place to observe the behaviour of our "society" is in the food court of a mall, theres like a hundred people getting their lunch feeling the need to be close to other people but at the same time not too close. Subconciously their brain is telling them that eating in a group is correct behaviour for humans but at the same time many people are just plain uncomfortable being there, looking around to see who's looking at them while they eat, grabbing a seat with at least one, preferably two seats, between them and the next person. Its really amusing, I like to sit right beside someone when there is lots of empty spots around, you can feel the vibe coming off of them, they kind of look around wondering why you had to take that seat when there are clearly other seats around with a comfortable buffer zone between you and the next person. They think maybe you are trying to hit on them or you have some sinister motive, perhaps you are a criminal and will try and snatch their purse/wallet, they pull their belongings in closer to them.... then you ask "are you going to eat those fries?" and they hurredly pick up their food tray and find another seat lol.

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sage observation catch22. it is true that our culture may be beyond saving. It often seems an unfriendly society, within it though you do get subcultures formed...and smaller societies.

Here's another link to the Tribe series, its my favourate episode....the mamongo are from the bobongo, and they live near the congo. :D

Bruce has a particularly clensing introspective shamanistic experience.....beware, here be pigmies.

http://www.dailygrail.com/node/4399

here's the google video source, in a larger format than the above link

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...q=babongo+iboga

:D

Edited by lil gremlin
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Indeed subcultures/smaller societies are formed and are normally quite close knit groups but they are usually demonized by the voice of the larger society. Its usually "questionable" beliefs, "illegal" activity or contempt for the larger "society" that bonds these groups together. The larger society has a few techniques to erase the threat that these smaller groups pose to them, the easiest being demonizing their activities/beliefs which makes them appear to be criminals of sorts, the more difficult but more effective technique, in my opinion, is to infiltrate these groups in a way, take their activities/beliefs and mass market them as a watered down de-fanged version that becomes a fad and fades away in a few years.

I agree with your point that tribes/societies need an initiation of sorts and our society lacks this, and I believe lacks the society part as well lol.

Thanks for the vids too the first one was hilarious, "Help him before the cattle kill him!!", and I'll watch the second when I get the chance.

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Oh ya do you have any thoughts on how tribes interact with one another? Such as one tribe will be very a very close knit community but just down the jungle will be another tribe that is viewed as hostile to this tribe. Is it just human nature to find reasons/ways/beliefs that bond a few together and in turn create enemies out of other bonded groups? I believe so.

It may just be that that is the way we are, no amount of "if everyone could only..." or "if differences were set aside...." would change the fact that it is in our nature to be hostile to "outsiders". And if it is our nature does that mean that the only way that all humans could bond together as a global tribe of sorts is if we have a global enemy to be hostile to? If tribe against tribe becomes country against country, is planet against planet/humans vs aliens the only way that we could see ourselves as one global tribe?

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Oh ya do you have any thoughts on how tribes interact with one another? Such as one tribe will be very a very close knit community but just down the jungle will be another tribe that is viewed as hostile to this tribe. Is it just human nature to find reasons/ways/beliefs that bond a few together and in turn create enemies out of other bonded groups? I believe so.

It may just be that that is the way we are, no amount of "if everyone could only..." or "if differences were set aside...." would change the fact that it is in our nature to be hostile to "outsiders". And if it is our nature does that mean that the only way that all humans could bond together as a global tribe of sorts is if we have a global enemy to be hostile to? If tribe against tribe becomes country against country, is planet against planet/humans vs aliens the only way that we could see ourselves as one global tribe?

I think that you are right, some tribes are friendly to each other, but may be hostile to others. As individuals can become reconciled so can groups. Uniting in the face of a common enemy or problem is something that we have seen even on a national level, you may be right in that the only way all humans can bond in this way is to have big nasty aliens to fight against....i think it has to do with identity, very much an us and them situation... turning them into us seems to be how it is achieved. just a shift in perspective, or a broadening. your right it does seem to be human/animal nature, even within groups you find an us and them mindset. cliques and hierarchies in group relations cannot seem to be avoided.

perhaps the utopian ideal is a pipe dream which can never be realized in perpetuum, achieving some form of concord seems to be a desire of all groups and often is, at least for a while.

once the most dire pressing need is passed, even when there is need to retain some unity dissent always creeps in.

relationships are fluid, and change constantly, to try to artificially maintain a status quo of concord has never worked at any level.

hmmm, perhaps an infatuation with permanence and achieving an end goal is where we fall short.

anyhoo, check out the veejo fella, I know u gonna like it. ;)

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A few years ago my daughter actually briefly lived with a South Pacfic tribe in the country of Vanuatu (she lived and visted a few different tribes, all had wildly different customs). Their rights of passage for men on the Island of Pentacoste are really well known... they're the "Landdiving" tribe. They build 60-70ft towers, then the young men tie vines to their ankels and dive headfirst into the ground. This tribes manhood rituals were the origins and inspiration for modern day bungie jumping.

There was a documentary series called "Going Tribal" that featured 8 episodes in the lives of the Pentacoste tribe. My daughter said it was very accurately done, and she got a huge kick out of seeing people she knew in person on that show.

She felt by-in-large that the social troubles of what we would call a primitive and 3rd world place aren't terribly different, on a conceptual level, than they are in the western world. She said the one thing that REALLY stood out to her as being much different was the fact that the tribal people she lived with had a TON more respect for the old people in the tribe. Beyond, that, she found that while the lifestyle was a lot different, the basic needs of all people are the same regardless of culture.

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I completely agree with you, LilGremlin. I've been thinking/observing this for a while. I think that it is a natural part of the stages we go through in our life cycle. And we instinctively used to know that, but Western society has lost this knowledge somehow.

When anthropologists began to study aboriginal tribes, western society was horrified at the seemingly cruel & barbaric practices tribes exposed their offspring to. If I remember correctly, in some Ausralian tribes, teenagers are dumped alone in the desert for several days, in Africa, many tribes perform painful ritual scarring, in some polynesian tribes (I think...), the front teeth get filed down (OUTCH!!!); or the famous native American sundance is another example. In Central Europe all through medieval times to the 18-hundreds, it was standard practice for trade apprentices to spend "Wanderjahre", wandering-years, where they would travel through the country & "temp" for Masters in different towns. Then later of course, compulsory army service replaced the ritual.

I think kids instinctively know this though, or rather, feel the undefined urge to undergo "coming of age" rituals, usually in the form of "proofs of courage"...I think that most of us that are +30 were still allowed to roam around with friends & do all sorts of stupid things & remember stuff they had to "dare" to be accepted by a clique (and about which our mothers would have fainted if they had known...)...These days kids are so ridiculously nannied & overprotected.

I often think that a lot of youth crime can actually be boiled down to this. Teenagers spray-painting railway carriages, etc, car theft, vandalism, shop-lifting....They are lost, unguided & alienated & replace these coming-of-age rituals with the next best thing they can find....often with destructive & devastating results.

Edited by SeaMare
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Sometimes i think that our society misses these tests of manhood, tribal rituals that make a boy a man...initiations into manhood and becoming a part of society.

Much of our lives folk run around trying to prove themselves...is it because we are missing this ritual?

That's a very interesting question. Technically speaking, when Jewish people have a bar/bat mitzvah they become adults. That's why they stand up in front of the temple and read scripture... they've become a member of the community that lives by the Torah. I haven't noticed that my bar mitzvahed Jewish friends have less of a compulsion to prove themselves than other people. So this makes me think that coming-of-age ceremonies aren't the only thing missing in our society.

Edited by Harmon-E Cherry
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A few years ago my daughter actually briefly lived with a South Pacfic tribe in the country of Vanuatu (she lived and visted a few different tribes, all had wildly different customs). Their rights of passage for men on the Island of Pentacoste are really well known... they're the "Landdiving" tribe. They build 60-70ft towers, then the young men tie vines to their ankels and dive headfirst into the ground. This tribes manhood rituals were the origins and inspiration for modern day bungie jumping.

There was a documentary series called "Going Tribal" that featured 8 episodes in the lives of the Pentacoste tribe. My daughter said it was very accurately done, and she got a huge kick out of seeing people she knew in person on that show.

She felt by-in-large that the social troubles of what we would call a primitive and 3rd world place aren't terribly different, on a conceptual level, than they are in the western world. She said the one thing that REALLY stood out to her as being much different was the fact that the tribal people she lived with had a TON more respect for the old people in the tribe. Beyond, that, she found that while the lifestyle was a lot different, the basic needs of all people are the same regardless of culture.

here u go...

my girlfriend's sister spent her medical elective on vanuatu, 9 weeks of bliss she says. She makes similar observations about the respect paid to elders. And all the trappings of the 1st world seem superfluous. A very simple and fulfilling experience.

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I completely agree with you, LilGremlin. I've been thinking/observing this for a while. I think that it is a natural part of the stages we go through in our life cycle. And we instinctively used to know that, but Western society has lost this knowledge somehow.

When anthropologists began to study aboriginal tribes, western society was horrified at the seemingly cruel & barbaric practices tribes exposed their offspring to. If I remember correctly, in some Ausralian tribes, teenagers are dumped alone in the desert for several days, in Africa, many tribes perform painful ritual scarring, in some polynesian tribes (I think...), the front teeth get filed down (OUTCH!!!); or the famous native American sundance is another example. In Central Europe all through medieval times to the 18-hundreds, it was standard practice for trade apprentices to spend "Wanderjahre", wandering-years, where they would travel through the country & "temp" for Masters in different towns. Then later of course, compulsory army service replaced the ritual.

I think kids instinctively know this though, or rather, feel the undefined urge to undergo "coming of age" rituals, usually in the form of "proofs of courage"...I think that most of us that are +30 were still allowed to roam around with friends & do all sorts of stupid things & remember stuff they had to "dare" to be accepted by a clique (and about which our mothers would have fainted if they had known...)...These days kids are so ridiculously nannied & overprotected.

I often think that a lot of youth crime can actually be boiled down to this. Teenagers spray-painting railway carriages, etc, car theft, vandalism, shop-lifting....They are lost, unguided & alienated & replace these coming-of-age rituals with the next best thing they can find....often with destructive & devastating results.

i agree completely, though some smaller societies can be as benign as book clubs and knitting circles, its the subcultures of adolesence that seem to satisfy a need that the loss of these rituals has on us.

Ive done a few things that were blinkin daft in retrospect, and sometimes at family parties we youngsters let slip our outragous antics to the old-folk in drunken nostalgia....my mom was absolutely shocked at first to hear of the sort of things me and my bro got upto right under her nose....but im too big to be spanked now, and i think that though another new one gets an airing from time to time she isnt so surprised any more. :innocent:

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Oh very cool Lil Gremlin! Your girlfriends sister was probably on the island of Efate or Tana, those are the centers of social activity and have most doctors and hospitals (although still scarce and primitive).

My daughter was living there with her step grandparents who were in the Peace Corp. They had all gone back to the islands to so some peace corp support work and also do some work for habitat for humanity.

Here are a couple of pictures of my girl in Vanuatu. The taro cleaning picture is on Efate, the natives picture was on Pentacoste, the last photo is of the capital city of Port Vila... what you see is what you get, that's the capital--the big white building you see down the shoreline is actually empty, it was suppose to be a hotel.

post-50202-1178920512_thumb.jpg

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Oh very cool Lil Gremlin! Your girlfriends sister was probably on the island of Efate or Tana, those are the centers of social activity and have most doctors and hospitals (although still scarce and primitive).

My daughter was living there with her step grandparents who were in the Peace Corp. They had all gone back to the islands to so some peace corp support work and also do some work for habitat for humanity.

Here are a couple of pictures of my girl in Vanuatu. The taro cleaning picture is on Efate, the natives picture was on Pentacoste, the last photo is of the capital city of Port Vila... what you see is what you get, that's the capital--the big white building you see down the shoreline is actually empty, it was suppose to be a hotel.

wicked pics, ta muchly for sharing...it looks lovely there. something really great about having fish cooked in big leaves, its so practical and no washing up. :lol:

I think allie spent most working days on tana but she did do work on the others, and a fair amount of r&r. its definately on my list of places to spend some time.

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wicked pics, ta muchly for sharing...it looks lovely there. something really great about having fish cooked in big leaves, its so practical and no washing up. :lol:

I think allie spent most working days on tana but she did do work on the others, and a fair amount of r&r. its definately on my list of places to spend some time.

Oh that's really funny, Allie is my daughter's name too. :D

Tanna is actually quite volitile, they have some restless natives there who have a tendency to engage in some pretty wild stick fight wars between tribes... last I heard, things were pretty peaceful there though. The other islands have been voted the worlds most stress free place to live by I believe it was Forbes Magazine. Low (to no) crime, high life expectency, access to healthy food for everyone, by-in-large, it IS a tropical paradise, even if its little villages do suffer to a degree from typical social trappings. Their lives are just so much simpler than ours, therefore, more stress-free.

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Oh that's really funny, Allie is my daughter's name too. :D

Tanna is actually quite volitile, they have some restless natives there who have a tendency to engage in some pretty wild stick fight wars between tribes... last I heard, things were pretty peaceful there though. The other islands have been voted the worlds most stress free place to live by I believe it was Forbes Magazine. Low (to no) crime, high life expectency, access to healthy food for everyone, by-in-large, it IS a tropical paradise, even if its little villages do suffer to a degree from typical social trappings. Their lives are just so much simpler than ours, therefore, more stress-free.

somehow a tropical paradise never seems complete without restless natives :lol:

PS i cant quite remember, but is it Vanuatu that has a tribe that worships/honours an american GI from ww2 or Nam or something? and that some day he will return?

Edited by lil gremlin
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somehow a tropical paradise never seems complete without restless natives :lol:

PS i cant quite remember, but is it Vanuatu that has a tribe that worships/honours an american GI from ww2 or Nam or something? and that some day he will return?

Ya, it is, that's on the island of Santos, I forget the tribe name now, it's a really long name that starts with a P. They have this obsession with a WWII fighter pilot... I don't know that they quite "worship" him, but they see him as a saint of sorts. I'll see if my daughter remembers the full story, I'm sure she does.

By in large, the ni-Vanuatu love Americans.

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"Separate the boys from the men", as they used to say.

How does one go about this? In most of the "coming-of-age movies" I've seen, the boy became a man once he lost his virginity. This was a great test of manhood at one time, but as I understand things today, the young women today are far too 'easy' to pose any real challenge to any but the nerdiest of nerds.

There's a good movie called "A Man Called Horse", about this white man who gets capured by Indians and assimilated into their society; he has to undergo a particularly grueling crucible as part of his initiation.

:blink::wacko::unsure2::alien::rofl:

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