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The Office of Naval Intelligence and UFOs.


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#1    karl 12

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Posted 13 March 2011 - 08:18 PM

There's some very interesting reading in the article below about the role of the Office of Naval Intelligence in the UFO subject - it also makes mention of Donald Menzel's association with the organization, speculates about UFO origin and states that the U.S. Government was aware of the 'marine aspect' of the phenomenon all along.



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Air Intelligence Division Study No. 203 with the help of the Office of Naval Intelligence presents the first important clue that the Pentagon was well aware of the phenomenon's marine nature. This document is one of the rarest documents in the national archives linking the Office of Naval Intelligence to any association with the investigation of the phenomenon and offers an early clue that the study of the UFO phenomenon did not fall totally within the realm of the Air Force. Could the naval UFO experience be more involved than the air force..?

Recent reports by UFO researchers suggest there is an on going Navy effort to destroy any evidence linking the navy to the UFO phenomenon. The reports of UFO sightings being edited out of ship's logs, by UFO researchers, confirms a considerable naval sensitivity to the phenomenon. Researchers have also reported the naval archives in Seacaus, New Jersey appear to have been purposely sabotaged. Documents are missing and files have purposely been mixed chronologically thwarting researchers attempts to do meaningful research at this facility relating to the UFO phenomenon.

Article




Missing Naval Log Books:


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Brand New Log Books / Do not Discuss:


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Feb 1963 Royal Navy North Atlantic Fleet:

After Tom witnessed the senior officer enter the UFO observations in the radar log book, their shift ended. Radar room personnel on the early morning watch ate breakfast and then turned in. Probably sometime between 1200 and 1300, Tom said he was awakened and ordered to report to the ward room, along with the five radar and sonar operators on his shift that morning.
The senior officer proceeded to go over the events of that morning, asking questions about the radar-sonar observations.He told the six men that their conversations were being taped and explained that until more was known about the unknown target, they were to remain silent about what they had seen. "Gentlemen," the officer said, "we will remember that we have all signed the Official Secrets Act (or words to that effect)." Although there were no threats, the implication was clear that to divulge anything to anyone concerning the tracking of the UFO would be considered a breach of security.
I asked Tom if the meeting might have been part of a general order carried out on other ships in the fleet as well in connection with the UFO incident. He responded that he didn't know if it was or not.
The witness recollected that he was in the ward room about 10 minutes. He said he never heard anything further about the unknown target.
When Preston came on duty once again at 2400 hours, he said he was surprised to discover that a "spanking new book" had replaced the radar log used the previous morning.




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USS Reeves:

All of a sudden I lost Sonar Contact like it was never there, but CIC still had it at last bearing with an abrupt positive altitude change. The chatter was look at the size of that thing. I went outside through the sonar door on the Port Side and visually saw a large moonlike shape that flew upward over the ship at a 60 degree angle and disappeared into the sky in seconds. I heard no noise from the object when it went over us. I saw a full moon that night on the other side of the ship, but it remained fairly constant give or take a few ship rolls.

When we pulled into port a few weeks later, all records in the Bridge, CIC, and Sonar logs about that time were torn out. Whoever tore them out made one error, the pen imprint on the next page was still there. No one spoke of the incident again




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USS Reclaimer:

The F-14 went to full afterburner right off the deck, pulling a rooster-tail7 behind it. It rattled the ship severely as it went by. This USO thing pulled easily ahead of the jet, crossed the horizon in seconds while underwater... no visible wake. It just... I mean this thing was FAST. Well, we just stood there. Wow, you know... what do ya say. We speculated about what it was. Guam told us it was a classified matter not to be reported or discussed.




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Carrier USS Kearsarge:

The cameraman was able to get some photos, not sure how many, before they all took off almost straight up and out of sight.
The cameraman turned the film into to his superior officer and was told to not ever mention it. My dad said he and his friend were asked about the incident by their NCO and also told not to ever talk about it.




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Sonar operator Account -British Destroyer Warship:

One of Sanderson's sources stated that no less than 13 craft recorded in their logs that their sonars had tracked this object. Allegedly, the unknown target continued to be tracked for four days as it maneuvered down to depths of 27,000 feet! (This must have been in the vicinity of the Atlantic's deepest point -- 28,374 feet below sea level -- in the Puerto Rico Trench.)
If the above story is true, nothing of known earthly origin can travel underwater at such speeds or maneuver at such depths. The fastest nuclear subs can attain 45 knots (52 miles per hour) and dive to around 3,000 feet. The bathyscaphe Trieste, with a specially constructed pressure-resistant hull, descended to a record 35,820 feet in 1960. However, it was incapable of maneuvering about.
It is unfortunate that more than 21 years elapsed before the Preston case reached the attention of a UFO investigator. We have here yet another example of government UFO secrecy at work--this time a foreign nation, Great Britain. Largely due to his apprehension over potential repercussions if he revealed his experience,Tom felt compelled to keep his knowledge of the event to himself. Since it hadn't occurred to him at the time that the radar log notes would be removed,he had only his memory to rely upon during our interviews.




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USS John F. Kennedy

So we exited the Communications Center and went to the catwalk on the port side of the ship on the edge of the flight deck and we observed a large glowing sphere over the ship. It was hard to decide what size this thing was because there was no perspective. It was late in the evening. The sun had gone down, it was twilight, but it looked huge…

After that, I talked to a few shipmate friends that I had on the ship. One in particular worked in the radar department and he was on watch during the incident. He told me that all the radar screens were glowing- and then nothing. They couldn’t detect anything on radar. We stayed up most of the night talking about it.

We heard that the compasses were not working on the bridge and that the radar navigational system had gone offline…

A few days later the Commanding Officer and the Executive Officer came on the closed circuit television system that we had on board. It was the only way that they could address the crew of 5,000. He [the Commanding Officer] looked at the camera - and I will never forget this - and he said, "I would like to remind the crew that certain events that take place on board a major naval combative vessel are considered classified and should not be discussed with anyone without a need to know." And that was all he said.




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USS Edenton

During one of my scans of the night sky, out of know where, four red circular lights appeared. The lights where hundreds of yards apart from each other and formed a square.
After relaying the contact information a second time, the four lights, in a flash, darted towards the horizon amazingly fast. The lower two lights in the square went first, with the top two lights following directly behind them in a curved swooshing motion and there was no sound.
Next, after a half hour had passed since the sighting, the radiation detection system (gamma roentgen meter) on the bridge started making a loud clicking sound. At first, no one seemed to know what was making this sound then a very loud bell went off notifying us as to what was going on, we were being radiated.
The captain stated not to log the instance concerning the radiation exposure and left the bridge. During the rest of my watch duty that night, no officer or enlisted person spoke of what happened, and also acted liked nothing happened.




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Submarine repair ship 'The Volga' ,October 7, 1977.


"Were such reports made public?"

Azhazha shook his head no. "At the time, naturally, they were classified top secret. Now we have a more open attitude in this country. We are able to talk about such things. On a few rare occasions I did publish some UFO information, but I paid for it under Leonid Brezhnev.The official reaction was very harsh, very negative. My career suffered as a result, and the directorship of a scientific group was taken away from me."





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Captain of Navy R5D aircraft,February 8,1951:

Crew members and passengers witnessed UFO emerging from the Atlantic ocean:

When we landed at Argentia (Newfoundland), we were met by intelligence officers. The types of questions they asked us were like Henry Ford asking about the Model T.
You got the feeling that they were putting words in your mouth.
It was obvious that there had been many sightings in the same area, and most of the observers did not let the cat out of the bag openly. When we arrived in the United States, we had to make a full report to Navy Intelligence.
.
I found out a few months later that Gander radar did track the object in excess of 1800 mph".




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USS Waldron,1968-Near Puerto Rico:

They were tracking two bright lights, that didn't answer up to IFF – they weren't enemy, friend, foe or commercial aircraft. And were flying at speeds in excess of 400 knots and making turns at right angles. Nothing we knew of could do this but they did.

We were on an operation called Racer Run near Puerto Rico. Ship officials supposedly logged a report to Washington but we never heard anymore about it.

I've told several people about this and many acted as if I had 3 heads, but I have witnesses and evidence: there were about 20 in the 2 bridge watch sections, the combat watch sections (CIC), the ships log and the report sent to Washington.

link




Related Threads:

Unidentified Submerged Objects ~ USOs

Forgotten UFO Researcher Ivan T. Sanderson


#2    TheMcGuffin

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Posted 13 March 2011 - 08:36 PM

There is a discussion here about the mysterious Donald Menzel, who was the original UFO debunker with strong government connections:

http://redstarfilms....t-or-money.html


Edward Ruppelt, William Garland and the rest of the military group who were investigating UFOs thought Menzel was pushing his natural explanations for the phenomena too hard, and also that he seemed eager to make a buck on all of it.

We now know that Menzel has very high level security clearances that even his closest colleagues were never aware of, and that he was heavily tied in the the CIA, NSA and other intelligence agencies.

I think he probably was part of the secret UFO investigation, but was also on the payroll working to mislead, discredit and debunk other researchers.

In fact, he was the classic case of the government skeptic and debunker who had a political agenda in the Cold War.

"The stuff that dreams are made of"

#3    karl 12

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 01:05 PM

Mcguffin, thanks for the reply and that certainly was some interesting reading and speculation about the UFO cynic Donald Menzel - there's a good article here which also makes some intriguing comments about the U.S. Navy and, as it suggests in the first article, perhaps we should start referring to these objects as UMVs.  :)


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The name assigned to the frequently occurring phenomenon by the Air Technological Intelligence Center, Unidentified flying object, is woefully incorrect as a name to define the reported phenomenon.

Fifty-percent of all UFO reports describe a phenomenon that is flying to the sea, flying from the sea, flying over the sea, diving into the water, coming out of the water, or operating with submarine like characteristics under the sea. An amphibious designation also falls short of accurately portraying the unique marine capability displayed by the phenomenon.

A more comprehensive and definitive name for the phenomenon would have to recognize the multiphibious characteristics inherent to the phenomenon from a numerous collection of land, and marine sightings. The term unconventional multiphibious vehicle (UMV) certainly describes succinctly the reported phenomenon.

link

Cheers.


#4    quillius

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 01:23 PM

View Postkarl 12, on 01 April 2011 - 01:05 PM, said:

Mcguffin, thanks for the reply and that certainly was some interesting reading and speculation about the UFO cynic Donald Menzel - there's a good article here which also makes some intriguing comments about the U.S. Navy and, as it suggests in the first article, perhaps we should start referring to these objects as UMVs.  :)




Cheers.

Hey Karl, more great info cheers.

I am shocked at the statistic of : 'Fifty-percent of all UFO reports describe a phenomenon that is flying to the sea, flying from the sea, flying over the sea, diving into the water, coming out of the water, or operating with submarine like characteristics '

wow.


#5    karl 12

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 01:58 PM

Hey Quillius, thanks for the reply mate and there's more information about statistics found in the Ivan Sanderson thread linked in the O.P. - considering the sheer number of Naval reports found at sites like WaterUFO.net it looks like official Naval UFO/USO documents are a bit thin on the ground - the only one I could find was this one from the archives of the Naval Security Group Command (COMNAVSECGRU) which describes a strange object emitting a bluish green beam of light - the site it was taken from (Ufologie.net) has now been removed from the internet so unfortunately there's no link.


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COMNAVSECGRU

APRIL 30, 1979

AT 220032 AUG 15 OBSVD BRIGHT WHITE LIGHT APPEARING AT BEARING 02E (TRUE NORTH), ELEVATION APPROX 15 DEGREES POSIT 6F MULLER 23 17 82 19[?]. DURING THE FIRST MIN OF OBSERVATION THE LIGHT WAS PULSATING OR FLUCTUATING IN BRIGHTNESS AT APPROX ONE SECOND INTERVALS. FOR THE NEXT TWO MINS OF OBSERVATION THE LIGHT BEGAN PULSATING CONCENTRIC RINGS OF LIGHT WHICH FLOWED FROM THE CENTRAL (S) SOURCE IN A RIPPLING, SHIMMERING FASHION DIMINISHING IN BRIGHTNESS AS THEY DREW FURTHER AND FURTHER AWAY FROM THE ORIGINATING SOURCE. DURING THE FOURTH MINS OF OBSERVATION A BLUISH GREEN BEAM OF LIGHT APPEARED FROM THE CENTRAL CORE OF THE CONFIGURATION, EXTENDING OUTWARD AND DOWNWARD TO THE LEFT AT AN ANGLE OF APPROX 45 DEGREES, AND REACHING TO THE FADE OUT POINT OF THE RADIATING RINGS OF LIGHT. APPROX FIVE MINUTES AFTER THE APPEARANCE OF THE BLUISH-GREEN BEAM (SIMILAR IN APPEARANCE TO A SEARCHLIGHT BEAM), THE RADIATIVE CIRCLES OF LIGHT DISAPPEARED, LEAVING ONLY THE CORE OF LIGHT AND THE COLORED BEAM. FOLLOWING THE DISAPEARANCE OF THE CIRCLES, THE BEAM SEEMED TO RETRACT TOWARDS THE CENTRAL CORE, GROWING BROADER AND STOUTER AS IT RETRACTED. FINALLY, THE BEAM AND CORE SEEMED TO FORM INTO A NEBULOUS CLOUD-SHAPED MASS, WHICH DRIFTED SOUTH ON THE WIND, FADING FROM VIEW AFTER APPROX 14 MINS. DURING THE EVENT, THE FOLLOWING ATMOSPHERIC DATA WAS ACCUMULATED: BAROMETER 29.95, TEMPERATURE - 83 DEGREES DRY 178 DEGREES WET. VISIBILITY EXCELLENT, FOUR TENTHS CLOUD COVER (STRATUS AND CUMULUS) WIND E X N.S. AT 12 KTS, ELECTRICAL STORM FORMING OVER IMMEDIATE AREA OF CITY OF HAVA

Cheers.


#6    karl 12

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 02:07 PM

More testimony for the logbook files:


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"We had contact with an unidentified flying object that had entered our air space. The order was given by Admiral Trane to get this object forced down out of the sky if at all possible, by whatever means possible….Two gentlemen began to question me about this event. They were being pretty rough. I remember literally putting my hands up and saying, “Wait a minute fellows. I’m on your side.” My logbook, I never did see that again."

US Navy Atlantic Command, Merle Shane McDow

link



#7    quillius

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 02:08 PM

View Postkarl 12, on 01 April 2011 - 01:58 PM, said:

Hey Quillius, thanks for the reply mate and there's more information about statistics found in the Ivan Sanderson thread linked in the O.P. - considering the sheer number of Naval reports found at sites like WaterUFO.net it looks like official Naval UFO/USO documents are a bit thin on the ground - the only one I could find was this one from the archives of the Naval Security Group Command (COMNAVSECGRU) which describes a strange object emitting a bluish green beam of light - the site it was taken from (Ufologie.net) has now been removed from the internet so unfortunately there's no link.

  

Cheers.


Thanks fella. I think the info you post could keep one busy for many years :)

do keep up the good work, all the best.


#8    karl 12

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 02:22 PM

No probs matey - it's certainly an interesting subject and the official Naval connection to the UFO subject does seem to be a bit of a slippery one - ONI documentation appears to be a bit scarce but there is this report from 1949 which mentions some interesting UFO incidents near the end:


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Directorate of Intelligence and Office of Naval Intelligence (pdf).

100-203-79 - April 28, 1949, Top Secret "Evaluation of Flying Object Incidents"



There's also this document taken from the CIA archives regarding an unknown object over White Sands Proving Ground base in the same year and, although the case is quite a controversial one, I did find it interesting who the official report was addressed to.


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From: Commanding Officer and Director  

To: The Chief of Naval Operations  

Attn: Office of Naval Intelligence  

Via: The Chief of Naval Research  

Subj: Sighting of Unidentified Object -- Report of  

Encl: (A) Statement of C.B. Moore, General Mills
Aeronautical Research, Minneapolis  


1. Encl (A) is a statement submitted to this activity by Mr. C. B. Moore (General Mills Aeronautical Research) who sighted and tracked an unidentified object on 24 April 1949 while engaged on Special Devices Center Project P-U-J-1 in the vicinity of White Sands Proving Ground.

2. Mr. Moore's statement is forwarded as significant because of the detailed theodolite tracking data it contains and because the object's variation of azimuth and elevation might indicate some degree of controlled flight.

3. The observer is known to the Special Device Center as a graduate mechanical engineer with an Air Force Reserve captaincy in meteorology. Mr. Moore, prior to his employment by General Mills, headed the New York University constant level balloon research program for the Air Force [i.e., Mogul], and can be considered to be a competent, mature, and highly experienced observer.

R. Ruhsenberger

cc:
(with encl)
Director
Central Intelligence Agency

Link

Cheers.


#9    quillius

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 02:40 PM

View Postkarl 12, on 01 April 2011 - 02:22 PM, said:

No probs matey - it's certainly an interesting subject and the official Naval connection to the UFO subject does seem to be a bit of a slippery one - ONI documentation appears to be a bit scarce but there is this report from 1949 which mentions some interesting UFO incidents near the end:


There's also this document taken from the CIA archives regarding an unknown object over White Sands Proving Ground base in the same year and, although the case is quite a controversial one, I did find it interesting who the official report was addressed to.




Cheers.

I skimmed thought the first report and will look at it more closely tonight. It seems very interesting, especially as the people they have documenting many of the sightings are experts in observations. They seem to be quite sure that the objects seen convey an element of intelligent control and I see their plee to the airforce to provide once and for all an answer to the question 'are these domestic aircraft', they say if not then its a matter of high national security as they will be deemed foreign and a threat.

Also the CIA doc is intersting and the case in question should be looked at more thoroughly. I would love to go into more depth with some of your cases. I may have asked you before but what in your opinion is a case where we have quite a bit of data and witnesses etc that leaves very little other possibilities other than that of 'ETH'? Ideally I want one case so I can really get stuck into researching it and taking it across to the BE thread for discussion.  :tu:


#10    DONTEATUS

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 03:02 PM

You have to think,We dont build anything that Can Leap outta the Ocean then back under at the Speeds described in some of these reports.
Over the years too many have had way too many wittnesses !most know whats in our inventory.
Most have nothing to gain by telling what they saw.
Lets just cut to the chase for once ! USO`s and the Like need more Looking into !
Now I have to start Looking under too  !justDONTEATUS :wacko:

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#11    quillius

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 03:21 PM

View PostDONTEATUS, on 01 April 2011 - 03:02 PM, said:

You have to think,We dont build anything that Can Leap outta the Ocean then back under at the Speeds described in some of these reports.
Over the years too many have had way too many wittnesses !most know whats in our inventory.
Most have nothing to gain by telling what they saw.
Lets just cut to the chase for once ! USO`s and the Like need more Looking into !
Now I have to start Looking under too  !justDONTEATUS :wacko:

I agree Donteatus, however it is always possible that these investigations are taking place but away from the public domain.


#12    DoubtingJessi

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 07:15 PM

Quote

There's also this document taken from the CIA archives regarding an unknown object over White Sands Proving Ground base in the same year and, although the case is quite a controversial one, I did find it interesting who the official report was addressed to.


Charles Moore is also the one who was associated with Project Mogul.  It was one of his service flights that may have been responsible for the famous Roswell "flying disk" incident of 1947, or the controversial Flight #4 which some claim never took place.

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#13    scheming_dreaming

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Posted 02 April 2011 - 12:58 AM

weird stuff... nobodys going to debunk the water saucers?


#14    doesnt_matter

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Posted 02 April 2011 - 06:06 AM

NRO NSA ONI. but like all human affairs, the best cuts of meat are saved for the top of the hierarchal food chain, and it is for them alone. one has to ask onself, if the ONI was that interested in this subject, and even the NSA,is there something to this? satellites are important, expensive assets orbiting in a far away and strange ocean of infinite black. wouldnt want these assets being damaged or even...tampered with? assets, some of great destructive power, that we have no means to defend ... makes one wonder what the NSA and NRO may say about..."UFOS"


#15    DONTEATUS

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Posted 02 April 2011 - 08:10 PM

View Postdoesnt_matter, on 02 April 2011 - 06:06 AM, said:

NRO NSA ONI. but like all human affairs, the best cuts of meat are saved for the top of the hierarchal food chain, and it is for them alone. one has to ask onself, if the ONI was that interested in this subject, and even the NSA,is there something to this? satellites are important, expensive assets orbiting in a far away and strange ocean of infinite black. wouldnt want these assets being damaged or even...tampered with? assets, some of great destructive power, that we have no means to defend ... makes one wonder what the NSA and NRO may say about..."UFOS"

Auh !! Yes Kobe steak  Yummy funny you should mention the Top grade`s of Alien meat ! Soak it in some saki and were off to Heaven!
as for the non-believers in E.T`s and ETH, and USO`s ,UFO`s  the entire gammit of" DAMMIT  Janet " sorry for the slight Rocky Horror refference! but THe Gov`s around the world know what were talking about in here ! And Frankly  my freinds they dont Give a rats @@#$ in @#$$.

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