109 replies to this topic

[Ecto76]

I second that Only!  

[CakeOrDeath]

So Ecto you aren't going to share anything about the overwhelming evidence you've collected over the years that made you a beleiver?  

[Ecto76]

Sent you a PM CakeorDeath... I'm all ears to hear any alternatives if you have any.  

[Chrlzs]

Ecto76, on 27 April 2012 - 11:31 PM, said:

Sent you a PM CakeorDeath... I'm all ears to hear any alternatives if you have any.  

Yes, that's how a discussion forum should work...  

[Englishgent]

Ecto. Not want to share them with all of us?

[Ecto76]

Chriz does that mean I get a little respect? lol...  

[coldethyl]

_Only, you're so welcome.  I hope I can predict something else for you!

For those of you who say advising someone to visit a psychiatrist is insulting, you are wrong.  I refer to a thread or two that was closed recently by the board owner Saru who suggested just that to the OP as it was obvious the OP was mentally unstable.  Also there is no shame in mental illness and it doesn't mean that you see ghosts.  It's no different than having cancer or diabetes.  It's a disease.  OCD or bi-polar illness (I have both) shouldn't come into play unless someone recognizes the symptoms and suggests psychiatry and it shouldn't offend anyone.

And I agree with everything the sensible ppl have said so far that if you want a board full of believers, just go start one somewhere and QYB.  Not everyone makes things up, they truly believe what they experienced was paranormal.  What is frustrating is when a 'skeptic' (don't really like that label) presents logical explanations and the person refuses to consider what is said.

Pic time to lighten mood:



Above is for CakeorDeath

This is for Jgirl:

[Ecto76]

To be honest... I would prefer someone with a PHD or is in the medical profession tell me I am nuts then someone I don't know from a hole in the wall!?  

[Englishgent]

coldethyl, on 28 April 2012 - 02:57 AM, said:

_Only, you're so welcome.  I hope I can predict something else for you!

For those of you who say advising someone to visit a psychiatrist is insulting, you are wrong.  I refer to a thread or two that was closed recently by the board owner Saru who suggested just that to the OP as it was obvious the OP was mentally unstable.  Also there is no shame in mental illness and it doesn't mean that you see ghosts.  It's no different than having cancer or diabetes.  It's a disease.  OCD or bi-polar illness (I have both) shouldn't come into play unless someone recognizes the symptoms and suggests psychiatry and it shouldn't offend anyone.

And I agree with everything the sensible ppl have said so far that if you want a board full of believers, just go start one somewhere and QYB.  Not everyone makes things up, they truly believe what they experienced was paranormal.  What is frustrating is when a 'skeptic' (don't really like that label) presents logical explanations and the person refuses to consider what is said.

Pic time to lighten mood:



Above is for CakeorDeath

This is for Jgirl:

I think you have take into account the context of the post to see whether or not the suggestions of a psychiatrist is meant as an insult or not.  

[Beany]

Besides sceptics, cynics, and believers, there are also people like me who are interested in talking with those who have had a similar experiences. If in the course of having this conversation, someone demands proof or evidence, are we obligated to provide it or change the intent of the conversation from sharing experiences to providing validation for it? I think not.  We're not here to convince anyone of the truth of our experiences, nor are we stupid, as other posters have suggested, nor gullible, nor crazy, nor suffer from lack of discernment. While we trust our own experiences, what our senses tell us, we don't believe every story that's posted. If it's similar to ours, we're interested enough to have a conversation, an exchange of information. By doing so, we gain information that helps us determine the believability factor.

If we limit the conversation to just believers and sceptics, are we not excluding the vast ground between the two where most of us dwell?

Edited by Beany, 28 April 2012 - 05:14 AM.

[coldethyl]

Ecto76, on 28 April 2012 - 03:28 AM, said:

To be honest... I would prefer someone with a PHD or is in the medical profession tell me I am nuts then someone I don't know from a hole in the wall!?  

Suggesting someone be checked by a medical  professional does not constitute calling you nuts.  Once again I refer to Saru closing a couple of threads recently based on his opinion of that and Saru isn't a Phd or in the medical profession.

Englishgent, on 28 April 2012 - 03:28 AM, said:

I think you have take into account the context of the post to see whether or not the suggestions of a psychiatrist is meant as an insult or not.  

I agree totally.

[Sakari]

Ecto76, on 28 April 2012 - 03:28 AM, said:

To be honest... I would prefer someone with a PHD or is in the medical profession tell me I am nuts then someone I don't know from a hole in the wall!?  

Touche'

I would prefer people without PHD's not tell people that they have spooks or demons running around, when they very well could have a medical issue.

And / Or replace " PHD's " with " contractor / electrical / etc. "........and " medical issue " with " structural / electrical / pest / etc. "



Complete amateurs ( calling themselves paranormal experts ) telling people they have a " haunting " ( a completeley un -proven myth ) when they could and do have a problem that could be fixed by a " expert " is ignorant, and could also be very dangerous.

Edited by Sakari, 29 April 2012 - 03:26 AM.

[Sakari]

Ecto76, on 27 April 2012 - 04:13 AM, said:

You can take this any way you want... but. My question to "skeptics" is if you do not believe in the Paranormal or Ghosts why do you reply to posts that discuss the subject? I hope the intention is for good intentions and not to mess with people's heads because that's just plain wrong. People are entitled to their opinions and beliefs. Not everyone lies or makes up stories. Not everyone is perfect and not everyone is right. I'd like to think when it comes to the Paranormal that the possibilities are unlimited. I think its a good topic!?

For one ( I used to be a believer ) to help educate people with REAL infromation......I.E.




Ok, I am tired of people learning about EMF's from paranormal teams, and TAPS.....

The " EMF's can make you sick, hallucinate, etc. ".........

Please take the time to read these links.....This is factual information on EMF's, what they are, why they are here, etc,etc,etc.........People used to think they caused cancer.

Anyway, talk to electricians about EMF's, not ghost hunters.......We are all exposed to it in various amounts 24/7.

Here is the information, please read it so that next time you read claims, and reports, you will have knowledge about them, and will not be fooled.The National Institue of Environmental Health Sciences is your source, and is also the place who studies things that can effect our health.....I believe their studies, and research, and explanations should be sufficient, don't you?

http://www.unexplain...opic=222978&hl=



And to answer the rest, try these : ( this question is  and has been answered 100's of time here )


I want to thank all of the " skeptics " out there....For without you:


I would be sleeping with my light on.
I would be sleeping with a 9 MM under my pillow.
I would never sleep.
I would be spending my hard earned money at the Tarot Card reader.
I would be buying haunted items on ebay.
I would think the footage I saw from my dad's video was mothman and not from a movie.
I would think every thing in the sky was a alien attack.
I would think meteor's were a sign of the apocolypse.
I would believe Tom Biscardi.
I would believe Sylvia Brown.
I would believe Sylvanic exists.
I would believe the world is flat.
I would believe Doctors and Surgery are bad.
I would have cases on cases of bottled water left over from y2k.
I would be a bird hoarder.
I would never go in the forest.
I would never replace light bulbs.( waiting for the ghost to turn lights back on )
I would still think the michigan dogman footage is real.
I would think 9/11 was caused by the US Government.
I would have died from the brain tumor that was removed from my head by getting numerous exorcisms.

Ya , ya .....Some sarcasm.....My point is , if everyone believed everything they read and heard ,and were taught , we would be pretty ignorant wouldn't we?

If people did not question things , we would never know what they are , or how they work.we would be taken advantage of with :"snake oils ".


What a boring and sad world this would be if everyone agreed on these things...

Of course there are things out there that are " un-explained " , and without " skeptics " we would never get to the bottom of them.

Believe it or not , I have seen many topics on here where people were actually concerned about things , and with the help of healthy debate , and healthy education from people here , they actually thanked " skeptics " for finding out the cause.


So , Thank You Skeptics for helping to get answers on any given topic......



And this topic as a reference also to your question :

A lot of people still think "skeptics" are this group of people standing in corners shaking their heads no , and waving their index fingers in the air.Some people think skeptics have not experienced things, and just refuse to believe anything because of this.In reality, I believe a lot of skeptics have experienced things, but do not jump to conclusions on it.

I am asking the skeptics here to share anything they may have experienced, and not asking for a debate on what they could have seen, nor a debate on skeptics vs believers.Maybe a way to show we also experience things, but we look at them in a different way, and find explanations.( not all of the time ).....................  

http://www.unexplain...pic=203763&st=0

[Ecto76]

Skeptics are entitled to their own opinion and beliefs. Believers are entitled to their own opinion and beliefs. It does not make us crazy or irrational. I just ask if you plan to reply to a believer's post... do it to help them.

I have to admit there are not enough amateurs doing the right thing. This is because they are not being properly educated. I have learned from years of practice. I have learned the do's and don'ts. Sometimes I have learned the hard way. It takes hard work and dedication. You must research and research as much as you can.

Sakari... you are absolutely right when you talk about how we approach our clients with our analysis. You have to be extremely careful. A person's psychology can come into play. If you do not diagnose your case properly, you may scare them more. Therefore, you defeated the purpose of the initial investigation. I have dealt with hundreds of clients. Due to the many years I have been investigating, I know the differences to those who are reaching out, scared or just want to know about it etc; My main focus is always to help the mindset of the client. Not to prove or disprove their claims. Even though my methods are by disproving first. I think that should be the most important thing.

But my topic is not about what we should or not do. My topic is building the mutual respect between both skeptics and believers. There are different types of skeptics and believers. Be here to help someone, don't insult them. It is a touchy subject, kill it with kindness.

[HerNibs]

Ecto76, on 30 April 2012 - 02:38 PM, said:

Skeptics are entitled to their own opinion and beliefs. Believers are entitled to their own opinion and beliefs. It does not make us crazy or irrational. I just ask if you plan to reply to a believer's post... do it to help them.

I have to admit there are not enough amateurs doing the right thing. This is because they are not being properly educated. I have learned from years of practice. I have learned the do's and don'ts. Sometimes I have learned the hard way. It takes hard work and dedication. You must research and research as much as you can.

Sakari... you are absolutely right when you talk about how we approach our clients with our analysis. You have to be extremely careful. A person's psychology can come into play. If you do not diagnose your case properly, you may scare them more. Therefore, you defeated the purpose of the initial investigation. I have dealt with hundreds of clients. Due to the many years I have been investigating, I know the differences to those who are reaching out, scared or just want to know about it etc; My main focus is always to help the mindset of the client. Not to prove or disprove their claims. Even though my methods are by disproving first. I think that should be the most important thing.

But my topic is not about what we should or not do. My topic is building the mutual respect between both skeptics and believers. There are different types of skeptics and believers. Be here to help someone, don't insult them. It is a touchy subject, kill it with kindness.

*shrug*

I follow the evidence.  Actual, testable and verifiable evidence. While stories are interesting, I cannot accept them as evidence.

I also have to say that I will pop into interesting threads to discuss the "experience" and sometimes that discussion includes telling some one that they are not correct or that there is a simple explanation or that they misunderstand science.

I find that blindly believing is dangerous.  Especially if this blind belief is held onto despite evidence to the contrary.

I cannot control how a person reacts to my statements.  I do not intentionally bait but rising to "bait" or perceived bate is the responsibility of the person doing the rising.

It's easier to ignore trolls than having to respond.  (yes, I have and probably will respond to some trolls but I only hold myself responsible).

Nibs