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#76    aztek

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 06:49 PM

View PostHasina, on 01 May 2013 - 06:21 PM, said:

I agree with Gromdor, make abortion unnecessary by ACTUALLY teaching sexual education, not -shrug- 'accidents happen, ohs wells :3, get cleaned up and back out there'.


I agree too, but unfortunately reality doesn't. Condoms, and others birth control devices\pills have been around for decades, some even for thousands years, yet it does not have as much effect as you would think for a market flooded with these means. If it did we would not be having this conversation. Human factor makes all the difference, and ppl this day and age know perfectly well, what is what. There is no lack of education.
we could talk, vote, protest, about how things should be, and what not, but it does not fix situation, you want to ban abortions, for all, or just in some cases, go ahead, you will just see many more illegal practices, medical mistakes due to such practices will skyrocket, more women will have permanent damage and unable to have a child ever, more kids will be dumped on someone else (us), and more newborns will be throw in garbage, or left at the beach. But unwanted pregnancies will continue.


Knowing human nature, I’m pretty sure if you allow abortions, or even encourage it, you will see less of them.

Edited by aztek, 01 May 2013 - 06:53 PM.

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#77    Hasina

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 07:53 PM

View Postaztek, on 01 May 2013 - 06:49 PM, said:




I agree too, but unfortunately reality doesn't. Condoms, and others birth control devices\pills have been around for decades, some even for thousands years, yet it does not have as much effect as you would think for a market flooded with these means. If it did we would not be having this conversation. Human factor makes all the difference, and ppl this day and age know perfectly well, what is what. There is no lack of education.
we could talk, vote, protest, about how things should be, and what not, but it does not fix situation, you want to ban abortions, for all, or just in some cases, go ahead, you will just see many more illegal practices, medical mistakes due to such practices will skyrocket, more women will have permanent damage and unable to have a child ever, more kids will be dumped on someone else (us), and more newborns will be throw in garbage, or left at the beach. But unwanted pregnancies will continue.


Knowing human nature, Iím pretty sure if you allow abortions, or even encourage it, you will see less of them.
Encourage women to get abortions? Yes, I can see how that'll lead to less abortions. Wait...

Is abortion the only answer though? No, I don't think it is. I'd never want to take it away, any advance in science or medicine should be looked into but treated with maturity, not a 'Plan B' if all else fails, especially if 'Plan B' is aborting a human being. I think abortion will never go away, that's for true because you're point is clear, we'll always be stuck with the idiots and the monsters but we'll decrease their numbers by making it a point to avoid the potential of an accident, if that fails, it'll be up to them.

I simply just don't get how a person can go 'let's bump uglies' with or without protection and think that it's just for good fun! It's reproduction, multiplication, most animals do it in seconds, we've just become so self-absorbed that we want all the fun with none of the consequences and making abortion a 'logical end to a pregnancy' removes all of the need for 'safe sex'. Heck, we could save a lot of latex if we just push abortions instead of condoms.

Edited by Hasina, 01 May 2013 - 07:56 PM.

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#78    danielost

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Posted 10 May 2013 - 02:04 PM

you pro-choicers can not be upset with this kidnapper in ohio for causing the five abortions.  After all he didn't kill anything.

The punishment of this case may end up going to the supreme court.  Ohio, wants death.  But, this is a federal case.  They don't have death.

I am a Mormon.  If I don't use Mormons believe, those my beliefs only.
I do not go to church haven't for thirty years.
There are other Mormons on this site. So if I have misspoken about the beliefs. I welcome their input.
I am not perfect and never will be. I do strive to be true to myself. I do my best to stay true to the Mormon faith. Thanks for caring and if you don't peace be with you.

#79    Dark_Grey

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Posted 10 May 2013 - 02:28 PM

View PostHasina, on 01 May 2013 - 07:53 PM, said:

I simply just don't get how a person can go 'let's bump uglies' with or without protection and think that it's just for good fun! It's reproduction, multiplication, most animals do it in seconds, we've just become so self-absorbed that we want all the fun with none of the consequences and making abortion a 'logical end to a pregnancy' removes all of the need for 'safe sex'. Heck, we could save a lot of latex if we just push abortions instead of condoms.

The difference between us and animals is that we have the luxury of "bumping uglies" without the consequences. We created birth control for that very reason - I see nothing wrong with enjoying the fruits of our labour.

However, as has been stated ad nauseum, "if you agree to intercourse, you accept all the risks that come along with that". Ergo, RESPONSIBILITY

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#80    MissMelsWell

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Posted 13 May 2013 - 02:01 PM

View Postdanielost, on 10 May 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

you pro-choicers can not be upset with this kidnapper in ohio for causing the five abortions.  After all he didn't kill anything.

The punishment of this case may end up going to the supreme court.  Ohio, wants death.  But, this is a federal case.  They don't have death.

Ok, wow. Are you just trolling now? Or do you just hate women?

1. Did she want to starved?
2. Did she want to be repeatedly punched in the stomach?
3. Did she want to terminate the pregnancy?
4. Did she ask to be raped?

Wow. I'm going to guess the answer to all those questions is NO. So hell yes a pro choice person can be angry at what happened there. Daniel, you need to think before you type. That was an idiotic thing for you to say. Gross.

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#81    danielost

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Posted 13 May 2013 - 02:22 PM

View PostMissMelsWell, on 13 May 2013 - 02:01 PM, said:



Ok, wow. Are you just trolling now? Or do you just hate women?

1. Did she want to starved?
2. Did she want to be repeatedly punched in the stomach?
3. Did she want to terminate the pregnancy?
4. Did she ask to be raped?

Wow. I'm going to guess the answer to all those questions is NO. So hell yes a pro choice person can be angry at what happened there. Daniel, you need to think before you type. That was an idiotic thing for you to say. Gross.

1.  No
2.  No
3.  I don't know.  But, according to you pro-choocers she should had an abortion because she was raped.  Also, she should have ad abortions when she was under 18.  That is your play book not mine.  My play book is since she was raped she should choose for herself , with parental input while she was under 18.  Sfo, don't get mad at me when I point out the flaws in your play book.
4.  No.

I am a Mormon.  If I don't use Mormons believe, those my beliefs only.
I do not go to church haven't for thirty years.
There are other Mormons on this site. So if I have misspoken about the beliefs. I welcome their input.
I am not perfect and never will be. I do strive to be true to myself. I do my best to stay true to the Mormon faith. Thanks for caring and if you don't peace be with you.

#82    MissMelsWell

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 12:50 AM

View Postdanielost, on 13 May 2013 - 02:22 PM, said:

1.  No
2.  No
3.  I don't know.  But, according to you pro-choocers she should had an abortion because she was raped.  Also, she should have ad abortions when she was under 18.  That is your play book not mine.  My play book is since she was raped she should choose for herself , with parental input while she was under 18.  Sfo, don't get mad at me when I point out the flaws in your play book.
4.  No.

Good god Daniel... now you're just trolling, seriously. NO Pro-choice advocate says that a raped woman should have an abortion. No Pro-choice advocate thinks every pregnant woman under the age of 18 should have an abortion. In fact NO pro-choice advocate believes anyone should have an abortion... a pro-choice advocate advocates CHOICE. You're trolling and I'm about to report you.

AND you have NO idea what my stance is on abortion. You're making a complete ass of yourself you know.

"It's time for the American people to stand up and shrug off the shackles of our government at TSA at the airport"  Ron Paul

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

#83    Odin11

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 05:28 AM

View Postdanielost, on 10 May 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

you pro-choicers can not be upset with this kidnapper in ohio for causing the five abortions.  After all he didn't kill anything.

The fact that you could even think this just shows what kind of person you really are. This is just disgusting.

"If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities." -Voltaire

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#84    danielost

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 05:33 AM

I am giving it back to you exactly the way I got it from you and others.  

As I said in earlier post.  When solders go to war they come up with names to dehumanize the enemy.  This makes it easier to kill them.

Pro-choosers are  at war against the unborn.  To make it easier to kill the unborn, you say they are not alive, they are parasites, or the are a sexually transmitted diesease.

The gentleman in penn. That was just found guilty of three counts of murder.  Wasn't just anybody.  He was the father of the abortion industery that we have today.  He is he male behind roe vs wade. He championed abortion.  He is a serial killer.

Today we have fast food, fast serve gas, and abortions on demand.  A thirteen year old girl in penn. Can get an abortion without perantail permission.  But, must get permission to have her nails done.  Some libral judge  just told the government to allow any female thirteen and over to buy the morning after pill over the counter.  They cut it off at fifteen.  Pro-chooce woman want any  female who wants them to be able to get them.

Planned parenthood the killer above. In being able to kill the babies he failed to kill before they were born..

I am a Mormon.  If I don't use Mormons believe, those my beliefs only.
I do not go to church haven't for thirty years.
There are other Mormons on this site. So if I have misspoken about the beliefs. I welcome their input.
I am not perfect and never will be. I do strive to be true to myself. I do my best to stay true to the Mormon faith. Thanks for caring and if you don't peace be with you.

#85    Arbenol

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 09:15 AM

View Postdanielost, on 14 May 2013 - 05:33 AM, said:

I am giving it back to you exactly the way I got it from you and others.  

As I said in earlier post.  When solders go to war they come up with names to dehumanize the enemy.  This makes it easier to kill them.

Pro-choosers are  at war against the unborn.  To make it easier to kill the unborn, you say they are not alive, they are parasites, or the are a sexually transmitted diesease.

The gentleman in penn. That was just found guilty of three counts of murder.  Wasn't just anybody.  He was the father of the abortion industery that we have today.  He is he male behind roe vs wade. He championed abortion.  He is a serial killer.

Today we have fast food, fast serve gas, and abortions on demand.  A thirteen year old girl in penn. Can get an abortion without perantail permission.  But, must get permission to have her nails done.  Some libral judge  just told the government to allow any female thirteen and over to buy the morning after pill over the counter.  They cut it off at fifteen.  Pro-chooce woman want any  female who wants them to be able to get them.

Planned parenthood the killer above. In being able to kill the babies he failed to kill before they were born..

The issue of abortion is anything but straightforward. Both sides have valid points and the pro- life stance has some strong arguments.

Unfortunately, you don't appear to be familiar with any of them. You're resorting to strawmen to try to make your point and you're making a jackass of yourself.



#86    danielost

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 01:37 PM

View PostOdin11, on 14 May 2013 - 05:28 AM, said:



The fact that you could even think this just shows what kind of person you really are. This is just disgusting.

You need to reread it a couple more times, and the read my opening post.

I am a Mormon.  If I don't use Mormons believe, those my beliefs only.
I do not go to church haven't for thirty years.
There are other Mormons on this site. So if I have misspoken about the beliefs. I welcome their input.
I am not perfect and never will be. I do strive to be true to myself. I do my best to stay true to the Mormon faith. Thanks for caring and if you don't peace be with you.

#87    danielost

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 01:43 PM

View PostArbenol68, on 14 May 2013 - 09:15 AM, said:



The issue of abortion is anything but straightforward. Both sides have valid points and the pro- life stance has some strong arguments.

Unfortunately, you don't appear to be familiar with any of them. You're resorting to strawmen to try to make your point and you're making a jackass of yourself.

May be you should reread the whole thread.  It is all there in black and white.

My vtrue opinion is the only reason for an abortion is health of the mother or if the child won't survive.  But, my church adds rape and incest to that list.  If justin beaver's mom had listened to the prochoicers in her life there wouldn't be a justin beaver.

I am a Mormon.  If I don't use Mormons believe, those my beliefs only.
I do not go to church haven't for thirty years.
There are other Mormons on this site. So if I have misspoken about the beliefs. I welcome their input.
I am not perfect and never will be. I do strive to be true to myself. I do my best to stay true to the Mormon faith. Thanks for caring and if you don't peace be with you.

#88    Arbenol

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 10:59 PM

View Postdanielost, on 14 May 2013 - 01:43 PM, said:

May be you should reread the whole thread.  It is all there in black and white.

I have. I can't remember anyone saying anything like the following (except you):

View Postdanielost, on 14 May 2013 - 05:33 AM, said:

Pro-choosers are  at war against the unborn.  To make it easier to kill the unborn, you say they are not alive, they are parasites, or the are a sexually transmitted diesease.

Now, that's a strawman


#89    green_dude777

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 11:06 PM

Obviously, as men, we should definitely have a say in what women can or can't do pertaining to a woman only issue.


#90    Gromdor

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 11:35 PM

View Postdanielost, on 10 May 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

you pro-choicers can not be upset with this kidnapper in ohio for causing the five abortions.  After all he didn't kill anything.

The punishment of this case may end up going to the supreme court.  Ohio, wants death.  But, this is a federal case.  They don't have death.

How can a pro-choicer not be upset if the woman had no choice?  No-one really wants an abortion.  But pro-choicers don't want the government or kidnappers in this case forcing women to do things with their bodies they don't want to.
You, like many "pro-life" people I meet, seem to assume that "pro-choice" means pro-abortion.  Most pro-choice people I know are against abortion, but what they are really against is the government or someone else telling them what they can and cannot do to their own bodies and all the other implications that go with it.  This guy is the ultimate pro-choicer nightmare.

If you really want to end abortions and don't mind government interference, here is an idea:  All men must get a vasectomy at age 13.  If they want to have a kid, they must have a signed permit with the woman they want the kid with, proof of health insurance for the kid, and proof of employment.  If they do this then the vasectomy gets reversed.  Do this and I bet the abortion rate goes to near 0.





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