95 replies to this topic

[TheMcGuffin]

MID, on 02 September 2011 - 12:35 AM, said:

I'm just curious where you come off putting out declarative statements without any support?

You forgot who I am, and that I always know what I'm talking about.  If I don't, I say nothing.

There are even people who place Bush in Dallas the night before the assassination, at a party in the home of oil baron Clint Murchison, also attended by Nixon, Hoover and LBJ.  For that matter, there is even a picture that places Bush in Dealy Plaza at the time of the shooting, but I don't know if that's true.


http://tomflocco.com...LinkBushJfk.htm


Is this George H.W. Bush? I don't know. It's just a question, but I do think that he was affiliated with the CIA long before he became its boss.

http://tomflocco.com...JfkBookDepo.htm

Edited by TheMcGuffin, 02 September 2011 - 02:34 AM.

[MID]

TheMcGuffin, on 02 September 2011 - 02:14 AM, said:

You forgot who I am, and that I always know what I'm talking about.  If I don't, I say nothing.

Oh...
Forgive me for not remembering "who you are" (someone can help me remember who you are?), and that you always know what you'retalking about.



i think we all know what you're inferring via your interpretations.  Official bodies do this all the time when investigating such matters.  They are led to believe, they draw inference from circumstances, etc., etc...

None of it proves anything.
It's just a matter of interest...something to discuss over a beer.

I should perhaps know better than to think you understood that, and that the appropriate response to me asking for proof was to say that you had none, because there is none.

Thanks.

Next time, I'll remember who you are!

Edited by MID, 02 September 2011 - 08:57 PM.

[TheMcGuffin]

MID, on 02 September 2011 - 08:53 PM, said:

Oh...
Forgive me for not remembering "who you are" (someone can help me remember who you are?), and that you always know what you're talking about.

I forgive you.  Forgiveness comes with the press of a button, after all.

[MID]

TheMcGuffin, on 02 September 2011 - 08:56 PM, said:

I forgive you.  Forgiveness comes with the press of a button, after all.

Well, that's one way of avoiding addressing my post.
But it doesn't matter either.

[The Silver Thong]

MID, on 02 September 2011 - 08:59 PM, said:

Well, that's one way of avoiding addressing my post.
But it doesn't matter either.

However there seems to be evidience from both sides. One just has the backing of the official case to back it. Kinda makes it easy for those that go with the official story.  The JFK assasination by no means went down the way we have been told. Of course it`s just my opinion and the conflicting story to make me think such a thing.

[TheMcGuffin]

MID, on 02 September 2011 - 08:59 PM, said:

Well, that's one way of avoiding addressing my post.
But it doesn't matter either.

Even you think it was a conspiracy, judging by your past posts.  I have good reason to think it was as well.  We certainly have two documents here that associate Bush with the assassination and with the CIA.  I don't know why that seems to bother you so much, since Bush has always been the insider's insider.  It was the CIA who said that the man mentioned in the document must have been George William Bush, but he denied it under oath in federal court.


"When the document first surfaced no one paid much attention to it. When the presidential campaigns began for the 1980 election then the name George Bush caught researchers' eyes. When asked about the memo, Bush denied working for the CIA at the time. As evidence built that it was indeed him, the CIA claimed it was a different George Bush although their policy had always been to neither confirm nor deny a person's employment. The other George Bush was tracked down by reporters and said that although he did work for the CIA at the time, he was never involved in that sort of work. The interesting point is that the CIA did not bother to contact the other George Bush and inform him that reporters might soon be calling. Other evidence surfaced that showed the George Bush mentioned in the document was actually George H. W. Bush and had the same address as the famous George Bush.

Another Bush connection involved George de Mohrenschildt, a rich Russian oil man who lived in Texas when Lee Harvey Oswald settled there after his trip to the Soviet Union. De Mohrenschildt was a long-time CIA agent and quite possibly served as a CIA control officer for Oswald. The Warren Commission described him and his wife as being the two people friendliest to Oswald at the time of the assassination. De Mohrenschildt's son-in-law told the Warren Commission that if any- one had helped with the assassination it was most likely de Mohrenschildt. De Mohrenschildt was also the man who moved Oswald to Dallas.

Shortly before the House Select Committee on Assassinations started meeting in the late 1970's a new doctor appeared in de Mohrenschildt's town. De Mohrenschildt started seeing him and quickly became mentally unstable. His wife convinced him to stop seeing the doctor. The doctor then moved away and left a false forwarding address. The very day the Committee tried to contact de Mohrenschildt about testifying, he was found dead of a gun shot wound. His personal address book was found and it contained the entry "Bush, George H. W. (Poppy) 1412 W. Ohio also Zapata Petroleum Midland." Bush's full name is George Herbert Walker Bush which matches the initials given and his earlier oil company was named Zapata Petroleum Corp. Why was his name in de Mohrenschildt's book? Is "Poppy" his CIA code name?

It is known that in the early 1960's de Mohrenschildt made frequent trips to Houston, which was the location of Bush's home. He told friends he was visiting the Brown brothers, who were close friends and financial supporters of Lyndon Johnson. CIA documents reveal that during the planning phase of Operation Zapata, de Mohrenschildt made frequent trips to Mexico and Panama and gave reports to the CIA. His son-in-law told the Warren Commission that he believed de Mohrenschildt was spying for the planned Cuban invasion."


http://www.angelfire...ohwhy/Bush.html




George de Mohrenschildt, a Right-wing, anti-Communist Russian and CIA agent becomes friends with Lee Harvey Oswald in Dallas?  How does that make sense at all if Oswald is a pro-Castro Communist who defected to the Soviet Union, divulged classified information, and then was allowed to return to the US without any great fuss?

Does any of that make sense at all? De Mohrenschildt "committed suicide" before testifying to the House Assassinations Committee but was probably murdered.  I think he was a CIA guy in the same way as his friend Bush was.

Edited by TheMcGuffin, 02 September 2011 - 10:11 PM.

[TheMcGuffin]

And Bush's Zapata Oil Company was involved in the covert war against Cuba:


"In 1953, Bush got money from Brown Brothers Harriman and, with partners Hugh and Bill Liedtke, formed Zapata Petroleum. By the late 1950s they were millionaires. Bush bought subsidiary Zapata Off-Shore from his partners and went into business on his own in 1954. By 1958, the new company was drilling on the Cay Sal Bank in the Eastern Gulf of Mexico. These islands had been leased to Nixon supporter and CIA contractor Howard Hughes the previous year and were later used as a base for CIA raids on Cuba. The CIA was using companies like Zapata to stage and supply secret missions attacking Fidel Castro’s Cuban government in advance of the Bay of Pigs invasion. The CIA’s codename for that invasion was “Operation Zapata.” In 1981, all Securities and Exchange Commission filings for Zapata Off-Shore between 1960 and 1966 were destroyed. In other words, the year Bush became vice president, important records detailing his years at his drilling company disappeared. In 1969, Zapata bought the United Fruit Company of Boston, another company with strong CIA connections."


http://www.famoustex.../georgebush.htm

[TheMcGuffin]

More evidence that Zapata Oil had CIA connections was the fact that one of Bush's partners, Thomas J, Devine, was also a career CIA officer.  Phil Graham had also worked for the OSS and later the CIA, although this wasn't known until many years after his death:


"Later he joined forces with Thomas J. Devine, a former CIA officer, to create Zapata Oil. Other major investors included Prescott Bush and Bill Liedtke.

In 1954, Zapata Off-Shore Company was formed as a subsidiary of Zapata Oil, with George H. W. Bush as president of the new company. According to Bush's autobiography, Eugene Meyer, the publisher of the Washington Post, and his son-in-law, Philip Graham, were major investors in the new company.

Zapata Corporation split in 1959 into independent companies Zapata Petroleum and Zapata Off-Shore, headed by Bush, who moved his offices from Midland to Houston. In 1960, Bush created a new company, Perforaciones Marinas del Golfo (Permargo) with Edwin Pauley of Pan American Petroleum. Pauley is alleged to have had close ties to Allen Dulles. During the Second World War Pauley aided the Dulles brothers former clients in shifting Nazi assets out of Europe.

In 1963, Zapata Petroleum merged with South Penn Oil and other companies to become Pennzoil. In his book Family of Secrets: The Bush Dynasty (2009) Russ Baker argues: "For Devine, who would have been about twenty-seven years old at the time, to resign at such a young age, so soon after the CIA had spent a great deal of time and money training him, was, at minimum, highly unusual. It would turn out, however, that Devine had a special relationship allowing him to come and go from the agency, enabling him to do other things without really leaving its employ."

Thomas J. Devine later rejoined the CIA under non-official cover (NOC) status on 12th June 1963, as a covert commercial asset for Project WUBRINY/LPDICTUM. Joan Mellen points out that: "This CIA document reveals that Thomas Devine had informed George Bush of a CIA project with the cryptonym WUBRINY/LPDICTUM. It involved CIA proprietary commercial operations in foreign countries."

Mellen goes onto argue that this links George Bush to George de Mohrenschildt and Lee Harvey Oswald. "WUBRINY involved Haitian operations, in which, the documents reveal, a participant was George de Mohrenschildt, the Dallas CIA handler of – Lee Oswald." Russ Baker interviewed Devine in 2008 and he refused to say whether he was involved with WUBRINY. However, another CIA officer, Gale Allen, confirmed in another interview that Devine did take part in the project.

There is strong evidence that Bush was working for the CIA during this period. Bush also provided information to the Federal Bureau of Investigation on a proposed assassination attempt by James Parrott of John F. Kennedy. On 29th November, 1963, Bush informed J. Edgar Hoover about a conspiracy involving a group of pro-Castro Cubans in Miami."


http://www.spartacus...uk/JFKbushG.htm

Edited by TheMcGuffin, 02 September 2011 - 09:28 PM.

[WoIverine]

McGuffin, since Bush was Reagan's VP and successor, how privy to this information would Reagan have been? Do you believe he was also "in the know" as well?

Edited by Spid3rCyd3, 02 September 2011 - 09:38 PM.

[TheMcGuffin]

Oh, "Poppy" was not George H.W. Bush's codename.  It was a nickname his friends of the Yale baseball team gave him because he was a World War II veteran and therefore slightly older than many of the other boys.

Among the anti-Castro Cubans in Miami, he may have been known as "Don Eduardo".  The head of the CIA station in Miami (JM/Wave), Theodore Shackley, was an old friend of Poppy, and later worked on his presidential campaign.  

In foreign policy at the time, Bush advocated escalation in Vietnam and an invasion of Cuba, while JFK appeared to be backing off from both of these.


http://modernhistory...=BushBook&C=8.2




The young man in Houston who Bush named as threatening to shoot JFK was a member of the Young Republicans and John Birch Society who had been discharged from the military in 1959 on psychiatric grounds.

[TheMcGuffin]

Spid3rCyd3, on 02 September 2011 - 09:37 PM, said:

McGuffin, since Bush was Reagan's VP and successor, how privy to this information would Reagan have been? Do you believe he was also "in the know" as well?

I know for sure that Bush and his CIA friends kept popping up again and again in later years, such as E. Howard and and the Miami Cubans who broke into the DNC offices in 1972.  Later, when Bush was supervising the covert wars in Central America as Reagan's vice president, some of these people turned up again, like Felix Rodriguez, a Bay of Pigs veteran and old friend of Poppy Bush.

Certainly this Cuban connection is a constant with Bush Senior, although he always brushed it off and the media never really pressed him on any of these points.  What's new?


http://modernhistory...=BushBook&C=8.2


Reagan believed the assassination of JFK was a conspiracy and said so in a radio address.  He denied that the CIA did it and stated that the Soviets and Cubans did it.  Of course, that was the exact same version of the assassination that the conspirators intended to publicize, and they had gone to great lengths to make Oswald look like a Soviet agent.  He even wanted a new investigation, which was the last thing in the world that any of the conspirators would have desired, not unless they could totally guarantee that it came out with the conclusions they preferred:

Edited by TheMcGuffin, 02 September 2011 - 10:13 PM.

[The Silver Thong]

Spid3rCyd3, on 02 September 2011 - 09:37 PM, said:

McGuffin, since Bush was Reagan's VP and successor, how privy to this information would Reagan have been? Do you believe he was also "in the know" as well?

I would say Bush was very much in the know and Regan was fed tid bits.

Former President George Bush was Director of Central Intelligence and head of the Central Intelligence Agency from 30 January 1976 to 20 January 1977.

[TheMcGuffin]

The Silver Thong, on 02 September 2011 - 10:17 PM, said:

I would say Bush was very much in the know and Regan was fed tid bits.

Former President George Bush was Director of Central Intelligence and head of the Central Intelligence Agency from 30 January 1976 to 20 January 1977.

Poppy Bush knows plenty about all kinds of things, but good luck finding out anything from him.  He'll just talk like a golfer doing an orange juice commercial and end up saying not much of anything.  Training.  He is a very courteous and polite man--so I've been told--a gentleman in the old-fashioned sense, but also as tough as nails.

[The Silver Thong]

TheMcGuffin, on 02 September 2011 - 10:25 PM, said:

Poppy Bush knows plenty about all kinds of things, but good luck finding out anything from him.  He'll just talk like a golfer doing an orange juice commercial and end up saying not much of anything.  Training.  He is a very courteous and polite man--so I've been told--a gentleman in the old-fashioned sense, but also as tough as nails.

You put it so polite. I would call him a traitor.

[TheMcGuffin]

This video has all the usual questions.  How many shots were fired and from which directions?  Where was the police and Secret Service protection?  Why did the driver slow down as the president and Gov. Connally were being shot instead of speeding up and getting out of there?