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Plenty of dark matter near the Sun

dark matter milky way galaxy

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#1    Waspie_Dwarf

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Posted 10 August 2012 - 01:15 PM

Plenty of dark matter near the Sun


The Royal Astronomical Society said:

Astronomers at the University of Zürich, the ETH Zurich, the University of Leicester and NAOC Beijing have found large amounts of invisible "dark matter" near the Sun. Their results are consistent with the theory that the Milky Way Galaxy is surrounded by a massive "halo" of dark matter, but this is the first study of its kind to use a method rigorously tested against mock data from high quality simulations. The authors also find tantalising hints of a new dark matter component in our Galaxy. The team's results will be published in the journal Monthly Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society.

Dark matter was first proposed by the Swiss astronomer Fritz Zwicky in the 1930s. He found that clusters of galaxies were filled with a mysterious dark matter that kept them from flying apart. At nearly the same time, Jan Oort in the Netherlands discovered that the density of matter near the Sun was nearly twice what could be explained by the presence of stars and gas alone. In the intervening decades, astronomers developed a theory of dark matter and structure formation that explains the properties of clusters and galaxies in the Universe, but the amount of dark matter in the solar neighbourhood has remained more mysterious. For decades after Oort's measurement, studies found 3-6 times more dark matter than expected. Then last year new data and a new method claimed far less than expected. The community was left puzzled, generally believing that the observations and analyses simply weren't sensitive enough to perform a reliable measurement.

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#2    papersamuel

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 02:21 PM

What if Dark Matter was a living entity, a conscious entity?

I saw this video yesterday and found it interesting that this article showed up after I had seen this video.



fast forward to 4:25, in the lower left hand side of the screen you will see what looks like a orb with a tentacle sticking out of it. Now this video is all about UFOS but what if (if this is true footage) this particular scene was actually dark matter either energizing the sun or might be gaining energy from the sun. 52 seconds shows a pretty cool ufo around the sun. Ive also seen videos of stuff flying into the sun, but for the life of me can't find it online anymore.

Though you can't see it, i get an image that if this thing was indeed a living entity it would look something like this (with tentacles).

http://images4.wikia.../Darkmatter.PNG

Food for thought, I really don't think its possible but was an interesting thought I had, that I thought was worth sharing lol.


#3    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 11:14 PM

View Postpapersamuel, on 12 August 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

What if Dark Matter was a living entity, a conscious entity?

I saw this video yesterday and found it interesting that this article showed up after I had seen this video.



fast forward to 4:25, in the lower left hand side of the screen you will see what looks like a orb with a tentacle sticking out of it. Now this video is all about UFOS but what if (if this is true footage) this particular scene was actually dark matter either energizing the sun or might be gaining energy from the sun. 52 seconds shows a pretty cool ufo around the sun. Ive also seen videos of stuff flying into the sun, but for the life of me can't find it online anymore.

Though you can't see it, i get an image that if this thing was indeed a living entity it would look something like this (with tentacles).

http://images4.wikia.../Darkmatter.PNG

Food for thought, I really don't think its possible but was an interesting thought I had, that I thought was worth sharing lol.

That's just a side view of a solar prominence in the video.

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#4    notoverrated

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 11:33 PM

so the only way they know dark matter is there is because there is unaccountable matter in the universe? that's some problem solving right there.


#5    Waspie_Dwarf

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Posted 12 August 2012 - 11:37 PM

View Postnotoverrated, on 12 August 2012 - 11:33 PM, said:

so the only way they know dark matter is there is because there is unaccountable matter in the universe? that's some problem solving right there.

Pretty much. In simplified form (so that I can understand it :)) how matter effects gravity is well understood and measurable. Observing galaxies and other objects in the universe shows that they are effected by more gravity than can be accounted for by normal matter, hence dark matter must exist.

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#6    shaddow134

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Posted 15 August 2012 - 11:41 PM

Again the mythical Dark Matter,but Where's the proof ?

Dark matter versus  Modified Gravity.Where do people stand?


http://www.newstates...rk-matter-exist


http://emsnews.wordp...as-i-predicted/


http://www.telegraph...ists-claim.html

Edited by shaddow134, 15 August 2012 - 11:59 PM.

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#7    sepulchrave

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 05:39 AM

View Postshaddow134, on 15 August 2012 - 11:41 PM, said:

Again the mythical Dark Matter,but Where's the proof ?

Dark matter versus  Modified Gravity.Where do people stand?
There is a lot of evidence for dark matter. It seems to me that most criticisms of dark matter stem from the fact that we haven't found it yet. Of course if it actually is ``dark'' - i.e. doesn't interact with electromagnetic fields - then it really isn't that surprising that we haven't found it yet.

I personally don't like dark matter (and I especially don't like dark energy).

I really don't like modified Newtonian dynamics (MOND); I think the way they have to rewrite the operator in Poisson's formula to balance out the conservation laws is just too... contrived.

I don't mind some of the modifications to general relativity though, like using the Weyl tensor instead of the Einstein tensor.

Having said all that, most scathing critiques of dark matter are poorly written, in my opinion.

Based on what we know, I would say that dark matter is as valid a hypothesis as anything else we have right now.


#8    Pyridium

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 07:46 PM

Matter is defined as an atom.  Dark matter, should be called "dark particles", because it is particles that have not formed into an atom.

All matter, atoms, have a gravitational force...pull.  All dark particles have the opposite force,..push, or as I call it, anti-gravity.

Dark particles do interact with matter, the particles are simply "pushed away" from normal, atom matter.  Dark matter is at rest while dark energy is the particles moving at close to the speed of light.

For a sense of scale, 1 hydrogen atom can contain trillions of trillions of dark particles in the same volume of space.

Again, this is just my opinion and only time will tell if I am right or wrong, or somewhere inbetween.  Dark matter in space will continue to push against other dark matter causing the particles to "spread out" as it tries to seperate from all other dark particles.  This is the only explanation for the "expanding universe theory".  Yes, there is dark particles orbiting the sun, and there are bands of dark particles between the orbits of our planets.  There are dark particles that orbit our solar system.  The vast majority of dark particles were caught between the point of the big bang and the atoms of hydrogen created by the big bang.  This area has been expanding faster and faster, causing all atomic matter to be "pushed" away at increasing speeds.  The "Big Rip" will be the fate of this and every other universe.


#9    sepulchrave

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 09:03 PM

View PostPyridium, on 16 August 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

Matter is defined as an atom.  Dark matter, should be called "dark particles", because it is particles that have not formed into an atom.
Sure.

View PostPyridium, on 16 August 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

All matter, atoms, have a gravitational force...pull.  All dark particles have the opposite force,..push, or as I call it, anti-gravity.
No.
  • Gravity is a mutually attractive monopole force which is proportional to a property we call ``mass''. An object with a positive mass will experience a gravitational attraction towards other objects with positive masses, and gravitational repulsion towards other objects with negative masses (as of yet no negative mass object has been experimentally identified).
  • The entire prediction of dark matter rests on it having (and, often, only having) positive mass. Perhaps you are thinking of ``dark energy''? The two are quite different.

View PostPyridium, on 16 August 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

Dark particles do interact with matter, the particles are simply "pushed away" from normal, atom matter.  Dark matter is at rest while dark energy is the particles moving at close to the speed of light.
No. Dark matter interacts with regular ``hadronic'' and ``leptonic'' matter via gravitational force. This is why dark matter is ``dark''; it does not interact with electromagnetic fields and in some models doesn't interact with strong and weak nuclear fields either.

Since dark matter has gravitational mass (clearly, from what evidence we have), and since so far it seems that gravitational mass is the same as inertial mass, dark matter should also interact with the Higgs field.

But under no circumstances can astronomical observations of the ``dark matter problem'' be reconciled with particles that repel regular matter.

For that matter, under no circumstances can astronomical observations of the ``dark energy problem'' be reconciled with particles moving close to the speed of light. Dark energy should be some sort of omnipresent field, not a particle stream.


#10    shaddow134

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 11:35 PM

View Postsepulchrave, on 16 August 2012 - 09:03 PM, said:

Sure.

No.
  • Gravity is a mutually attractive monopole force which is proportional to a property we call ``mass''. An object with a positive mass will experience a gravitational attraction towards other objects with positive masses, and gravitational repulsion towards other objects with negative masses (as of yet no negative mass object has been experimentally identified).
  • The entire prediction of dark matter rests on it having (and, often, only having) positive mass. Perhaps you are thinking of ``dark energy''? The two are quite different.


No. Dark matter interacts with regular ``hadronic'' and ``leptonic'' matter via gravitational force. This is why dark matter is ``dark''; it does not interact with electromagnetic fields and in some models doesn't interact with strong and weak nuclear fields either.

Since dark matter has gravitational mass (clearly, from what evidence we have), and since so far it seems that gravitational mass is the same as inertial mass, dark matter should also interact with the Higgs field.

But under no circumstances can astronomical observations of the ``dark matter problem'' be reconciled with particles that repel regular matter.

For that matter, under no circumstances can astronomical observations of the ``dark energy problem'' be reconciled with particles moving close to the speed of light. Dark energy should be some sort of omnipresent field, not a particle stream.
How can you say what Dark Matter or Dark Energy does or how it interacts,there is no proof whatsoever that they exist.

You claim that Dark Matter has gravitational mass from what Evidence?

Dark Matter is still theoretical and nobody is certain that it exists..

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#11    sepulchrave

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 02:42 AM

View Postshaddow134, on 16 August 2012 - 11:35 PM, said:

How can you say what Dark Matter or Dark Energy does or how it interacts,there is no proof whatsoever that they exist.

You claim that Dark Matter has gravitational mass from what Evidence?

Dark Matter is still theoretical and nobody is certain that it exists..
Dark matter wasn't hypothesized ``just because''.

It was hypothesized because the rotation and collisions between galaxies indicated that - if gravity according to General Relativity is correct - there should be a significant additional quantity of mass in the outer halo of these galaxies.

Since there is no visible evidence for this mass, it was called ``dark matter''.

If there is some additional component to our Universe that does not exhibit gravitational mass, then it cannot be an explanation for cosmological anomalies (like galactic rotation curves, the bullet cluster, etc.).





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