52 replies to this topic

[and then]

acidhead, on 05 December 2012 - 07:13 AM, said:

It does the world no good to hold it hostage.

The people of the current State of Israel must go home.  If I were Israeli I would go to my sister country now.

Creating a 20th century version of Israel has been a failed experiment.

With the exception of some persistently insane neighbors I'd say it's been a rousing success so far.  Darned near er..miraculous, you might say   
What was that old saw Bill Clinton's crowd liked to use?  We're in it til the last dog dies?

[and then]

Raptor Witness, on 05 December 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

These are the wisest words I've heard spoken here on this subject in a long time.

There is no political solution to a religious argument that invites supernatural intervention.

If we wait for this self-fulfilling prophecy to unfold, then I guess it will end in flames, especially if those are the expectations on both sides, including the Christian supporters of Israel in the U.S.

I wonder how many of these so called Christians realize the pain and suffering a third world war will bring to mankind? My guess is zero for those who conveniently believe they'll all be raptured away!

To help start a war, for which you expect to have no price to pay for is more than a little arrogant, yet this is the foundation of the lie told repeatedly in pulpits all across America.

I've got news for the rapturists, who believe they'll have no price to pay. You WILL be here, and you will likely all be hunted down, especially if millions die as a result of a religious war that you helped bring about.

You will help set the stage for a war on religion. You will help bring about your Antichrist, this Devil you seek.

Better to let wisdom prevail, and earn the respect of Heaven, without all this bloodshed.

There will be no escape or rapture for the wicked, who invite this war.

No where is it written that men couldn't change the playbook of history. In fact, maybe that's the real test. To see if we'll write our own ending.

That's typical and I expected a bit more from you.  Blame the messenger is the best you can do?  As to being hunted down -Christians do martyrdom also.  It's just that we don't think it involves killing others.  I fully expect to be here.   You fascinate me RW.  You speak as if the faith of a group of believers could simultaneously bring on war and stop Israel from attempting to save itself at the same time.  Which is it?  Do you really think Christian Zionists can effect change in Israeli policies regarding self defense?  From a secular POV this war became reality the DAY Israel built it's first atomic weapon.  And I think France was the country that mostly made that possible.  I think the ending got written for us because He is tired of watching His creation be destroyed by those who feel this way: " you will likely all be hunted down, especially if millions die as a result of a religious war that you helped bring about".
Sad commentary.

[Raptor Witness]

and then, on 05 December 2012 - 09:12 AM, said:

That's typical and I expected a bit more from you.  Blame the messenger is the best you can do?  As to being hunted down -Christians do martyrdom also.  It's just that we don't think it involves killing others.  I fully expect to be here.   You fascinate me RW.  You speak as if the faith of a group of believers could simultaneously bring on war and stop Israel from attempting to save itself at the same time.  Which is it?  Do you really think Christian Zionists can effect change in Israeli policies regarding self defense?  From a secular POV this war became reality the DAY Israel built it's first atomic weapon.  And I think France was the country that mostly made that possible.  I think the ending got written for us because He is tired of watching His creation be destroyed by those who feel this way: " you will likely all be hunted down, especially if millions die as a result of a religious war that you helped bring about".
Sad commentary.

I don't count myself as worthy, to die again, for my own salvation, brother.

If the best advertising Christianity has, is hell on earth, then I'll go looking elsewhere, for Heaven.

[and then]

Raptor Witness, on 05 December 2012 - 09:17 AM, said:

I don't count myself as worthy, to die again, for my own salvation, brother.

If the best advertising Christianity has, is hell on earth, then I'll go looking elsewhere, for Heaven.

I think your ideas are warped.  You seem to think it is the Christian who is making these things happen.  That is a typical mindset of a one who counts without God in the equation.  Christians wait on Him - not the other way around.  I think heaven finds us if we are meant to be there.

[Raptor Witness]

and then, on 05 December 2012 - 09:20 AM, said:

I think your ideas are warped.  You seem to think it is the Christian who is making these things happen.  That is a typical mindset of a one who counts without God in the equation.  Christians wait on Him - not the other way around.  I think heaven finds us if we are meant to be there.

I don't believe Christians are the problem, per se. I just have no illusions the degree which we have been compromised by Satan.

This is the lukewarm church, and what man returns to the spittle he has spewed on the ground?

[odas]

Erikl, on 04 December 2012 - 08:30 PM, said:

Tomorrow a bunch of French people will go to the UN and will ask to be accepted as an observer state. 138 states for in favour. Only 9 against. How will the Canadian government react?



And the one-sided move by the Palestinians doesn't advance peace as well. If anything, this makes peace fly further away.


Indeed. Show me any other country in the world where it's citizens cannot agree on it's boundaries for almost 70 years now. If we cannot do it, we cannot expect the world to be holier than the pope.

IMO, my government should annex Judea and Samaria, and give full citizenship (in a very long process, perhaps only to newly born Palestinians after the annexation) to all the inhabitants of the annexed territories. The Gaza Strip is now a Somalia-like land, and with the same party in power (Muslim Brotherhood) as in Egypt, should be pushed away to the hands of the Egyptians (ie we should stop providing electricity to them, stop allowing Israeli currency be the official currency, etc.).

Currently, 62% of the West Bank (Judea and Samaria) and some 2% of the Palestinians (about 50,000) in what is called Area C, are under direct Israeli rule. There, Jews are a majority (87%). The PA, in it's 20 years of governance, have proved anything good for both Israel and the Palestinians themselves. They govern 98% of the Palestinians. They teach them hatred, they steal money from their people, and the failed to dismantle the refugee camps. They keep feeding their people with delusions of millions of refugees flooding Israeli cities.

On the other hand, the only Arab people we seem to have peace with for the past 64 years, are Israeli Palestinians, now number some 1.5 million. By that logic, Israel should solve the conflict by annexing all of the West Bank, ridding the PA, dismantling the refugee camps, and offering them Israeli passports.

It would not be a bunch of French. There is something called a referendum and if the majority of Quebecers deside to have a state Canada will accept it because Quebec is not occupied and their citizens have a voice. Quebec joined the federation it was not taken by force.

[MichaelW]

Raptor Witness, on 05 December 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

These are the wisest words I've heard spoken here on this subject in a long time.

Eh? I must have missed the memo that stated that lunatics were capable of making profound and prophetic statements about Israel.

[and then]

Raptor Witness, on 05 December 2012 - 09:17 AM, said:

I don't count myself as worthy, to die again, for my own salvation, brother.

If the best advertising Christianity has, is hell on earth, then I'll go looking elsewhere, for Heaven.

Do you consider the sacrifice of all the early members of the Church to be vain?  They are accounted as blessed in the Bible.  And all they did was die for the name of the Lord.