168 replies to this topic

[Ben Masada]

EVIDENCE THAT JESUS WAS MARRIED (1)


Imagine 2000 years ago! Today, the 21st Century, a woman cannot address a religious Jew in public to ask or say anything if she is not his wife. Even being his wife, she must walk a few steps back for the sake of traditional Jewish discretion.

Now, let us read John 11:2. "This Mary whose brother Lazarus and sister was Martha, was the one who anointed Jesus with a very expensive perfume and dried his feet with her hair. (John 12:3) Luke says that Mary even kissed Jesus' feet. If a religious Jew could not even be talked to by a woman in public how could Jesus be anointed and touched by a woman and even kissed if she was not his wife? (Luke 7:38) The only way to refute this assertion is by denying that Jesus was a Jew at all, let alone that he was a religious Jew.

Ben

[Paranoid Android]

Are you saying a Rabbi cannot give spiritual counsel to a female in modern-day Israel if she comes up to him in the street to ask?

Somehow I feel that even if this was the case in the 1st Century AD that Jesus wouldn't have cared about the rules.  After all, he ate with tax collectors, talking to a woman is pretty normal next to that

That said, even if Jesus was married it matters not one whit to me.  It doesn't change anything about him.

~ Regards, PA

Edited by Paranoid Android, 29 December 2012 - 04:41 AM.

[Sean93]

Well big Jesus was a bit of a rebel wasn't he?

[docyabut2]

Many women followed Jesus… including prostitutes

[Ben Masada]

Paranoid Android, on 29 December 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

Are you saying a Rabbi cannot give spiritual counsel to a female in modern-day Israel if she comes up to him in the street to ask?

Somehow I feel that even if this was the case in the 1st Century AD that Jesus wouldn't have cared about the rules.  After all, he ate with tax collectors, talking to a woman is pretty normal next to that

That said, even if Jesus was married it matters not one whit to me.  It doesn't change anything about him.

~ Regards, PA

Talking about an Ultra-Orthodox Rabbi, yes PA, he won't. First of all, an Israeli woman knows she cannot address to a religious Jew
on the street. If someone from outside who does not know the rules, yes, the Rabbi won't talk to her, unless her life is in danger. Even so, he will reach for someone else to help.

Regarding Jesus in the First Century, to eat with tax collectors was one thing to chit-chat with a woman in public something else much different, unless she was his wife, as in the case of Mary.

I am very glad to hear that if Jesus was married, that would change nothing to you with reference to him. IMHO, it would rather enhance his credibility as a serious and loyal Jew that he was.

Ben

[Ben Masada]

Sean93, on 29 December 2012 - 03:50 AM, said:

Well big Jesus was a bit of a rebel wasn't he?

I don't think so; unless what one says about him under preconceived notions is to be believed.

Ben

[Ben Masada]

docyabut2, on 29 December 2012 - 04:12 AM, said:

Many women followed Jesus… including prostitutes

I don't think so. True that many would help him with their means but to personally follow him, only Mary IMHO. (Luke 8:3)

Ben

[Hasina]

If he's also the Son of Man, God incarnate in flesh to die for the sins of the people who's blood he bares? I'd think he'd want to experience humanity.

[eight bits]

Quote

I don't think so. True that many would help him with their means but to personally follow him, only Mary IMHO. (Luke 8:3)

Luke 8: 1-3 names 3 women who accompanied Jesus "from one town and village and another."

Mary Magdalene
Joanna, the wife of Chuza
Susanna

None of whom is Mary of Bethany, the woman who annointed Jesus in John 12, who in turn isn't the unnanmed sinful woman in Luke 7: 38, who also annointed Jesus, tearfully  and with much disapproval from their host, Simon the Pharisee. That woman kissed Jesus' feet without ceasing, 7: 45. Nevertheless, I don't think she's Jesus' wife, either, since a host would hardly call a guest's wife a >ahem< sinner.

Although, there is an American joke on that point.

Host: Georgia Tech is a lousy school; the only people who go there are football players and prostitutes.

Guest: My wife graduated from Georgia Tech.

Host: And what position did your wife play?

[Ben Masada]

Hasina, on 04 January 2013 - 08:32 PM, said:

If he's also the Son of Man, God incarnate in flesh to die for the sins of the people who's blood he bares? I'd think he'd want to experience humanity.

I would not worry about that. That's part of the Pauline gospel. Jesus could not have died for the sins of anyone because it is against the Scriptures in Jeremiah 31:30. "No one can die for the sins of another. Only for his own sins shall one die." And for Jesus to have been God's incarnate in the flesh, too bad. Jews don't believe in incarnation of a Spirit. That's too Greek.

Ben

[Hasina]

Ben Masada, on 04 January 2013 - 10:17 PM, said:

I would not worry about that. That's part of the Pauline gospel. Jesus could not have died for the sins of anyone because it is against the Scriptures in Jeremiah 31:30. "No one can die for the sins of another. Only for his own sins shall one die." And for Jesus to have been God's incarnate in the flesh, too bad. Jews don't believe in incarnation of a Spirit. That's too Greek.

Ben

Well, let me key you into this new religion called 'Christianity', a few followers of this archaic Abrahamic religion believe that Jesus is the 'Son of God' and 'God himself'.

Personally? I think the concept of a deity is a bit batty.

[Ben Masada]

eight bits, on 04 January 2013 - 09:06 PM, said:

Luke 8: 1-3 names 3 women who accompanied Jesus "from one town and village and another."

Mary Magdalene
Joanna, the wife of Chuza
Susanna

None of whom is Mary of Bethany, the woman who annointed Jesus in John 12, who in turn isn't the unnanmed sinful woman in Luke 7: 38, who also annointed Jesus, tearfully  and with much disapproval from their host, Simon the Pharisee. That woman kissed Jesus' feet without ceasing, 7: 45. Nevertheless, I don't think she's Jesus' wife, either, since a host would hardly call a guest's wife a >ahem< sinner.

Although, there is an American joke on that point.

Host: Georgia Tech is a lousy school; the only people who go there are football players and prostitutes.

Guest: My wife graduated from Georgia Tech.

Host: And what position did your wife play?

Mary Magdalene and Mary of Bethany were one and the same. What do you think that Jesus was a kind of "Casa Nova" to be anointed by women wherever he found himself? The point is that Mary was by profession a famous courtezan in the city of Gadara, a fish sea-coast city where Jesus would often hang around with his disciples. He met Mary whom he exorcised seven demons and, obviously fell in love with each other. Eventually, they got married in Cana of Galilee just prior to Jesus' ordination as a Rabbi since he couldn't be one as a single man. (John 2:1-12) Her home in Bethany was cared for by her sister Matha and Lazarus. Mary became known as Magdalene but,
at home, the name was avoided because of the not-too-kosher background.

Ben

[Ben Masada]

Hasina, on 04 January 2013 - 10:26 PM, said:

Well, let me key you into this new religion called 'Christianity', a few followers of this archaic Abrahamic religion believe that Jesus is the 'Son of God' and 'God himself'.

Personally? I think the concept of a deity is a bit batty.

Hey Hasina, Christianity was never an Abrahamic religious belief. Christians believe that Jesus was the son of God because Paul fabricated that idea when he founded the Christian religion. (Acts 11:26) The whole concept is Hellenistic, as Paul was a Hellenistic Jew from birth. Have you ever heard about the myth of the demigod? That's the son of a god with an earthly woman. Christianity adopted it from Greek Mythology.

Ben

[Hasina]

Ben Masada, on 04 January 2013 - 10:38 PM, said:

Hey Hasina, Christianity was never an Abrahamic religious belief. Christians believe that Jesus was the son of God because Paul fabricated that idea when he founded the Christian religion. (Acts 11:26) The whole concept is Hellenistic, as Paul was a Hellenistic Jew from birth. Have you ever heard about the myth of the demigod? That's the son of a god with an earthly woman. Christianity adopted it from Greek Mythology.

Ben

And? Does that make Judaism any more 'realistic' then Christianity? Nope. Though when you say 'fabricated' parts of a religion, you'll have to realize any religion that just has no proof of any of it's deity could have the same argument put forth.

Edited by Hasina, 04 January 2013 - 10:45 PM.

[eight bits]

Quote

Mary Magdalene and Mary of Bethany were one and the same.

No, they weren't. Nor was either of them Susanna, nor was either of them Joanna, wife of Chuza, nor was any of those the woman who annointed Jesus at Simon the Pharisee's house.

Quote

What do you think that Jesus was a kind of "Casa Nova" to be anointed by women wherever he found himself?

Foot cleaning was a typical hospitable courtesy of the time and place. Jesus complains that Simon had not extended this hospitality to him, and observes favorably that the woman did. I don't see what a serial seducer of another era has to do with it.

Quote

The point is that Mary was by profession a famous courtezan in the city of Gadara,

That Pope Gregory "the Great" misidentified Mary Magdalene as a prostitute is at least as well known as Anatole France's short story about Pontius Pilate and Carl Sagan's views on traditional creation myths.

Quote

  He met Mary whom he exorcised seven demons and, obviously fell in love with each other.

No, it isn't obvious, Ben. You made up a love affair. That's what's obvious.

Quote

Eventually, they got married in Cana of Galilee just prior to Jesus' ordination as a Rabbi since he couldn't be one as a single man. (John 2:1-12)

John 2: 2 says Jesus was a guest at that wedding, "Jesus and his disciples were also invited to the wedding." The bridgegroom is a different character in the story (2: 9).