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The Loch Ness Giant Salamander

loch ness salamander

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#61    Steve Plambeck

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 01:41 AM

View PostHerryGrail, on 25 January 2013 - 04:49 PM, said:

Thanks for looking, Steve! I appreciate your attenton and look forward to reading your new post. The thing that bothers me the most is that nut/spout area. How do you interpret its inorganic appearance, especially in the "nut" area?

All I can say is, it never looked inorganic to me.  I see the "upper arm" of a limb! :-*


#62    Steve Plambeck

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 01:55 AM

View PostInsanity, on 25 January 2013 - 05:01 PM, said:

Maybe Steve can correct me if I am incorrect, but my understanding is that the original negative plate was lost many years ago.  At the time, the reproductions were converted to half tones, and then had their contrasts darkened in order to be printed in newspapers.  Most copies of the photograph that we've seen over the years have been copies of these half-toned, darkened reproductions.  The copy of a copy concept goes here, and as such, the quality is not equal to the original plate.

The photo Steve is using for his analysis is of glass lantern slides made from the original negatives in 1933.  This copy was in the Fortean Picture Library since the 1960s and for whatever reason overlooked, while the half-toned versions were the ones seen by most of us.

The photo Steve used is then the closest to the original that anyone can get, and is closer then what most of us as probably seen.

Yes, that's the print from the Heron-Allen glass slide you're referring to, and as close as we can get to the original negative.  And that is what HerryGrail has used here.  The mouth and probable eye are first indicators it's the Heron-Allen print, as they can't be recognized in the newsprint versions.

Still a good idea to check the whole image against the original though because in this modern age anyone could tamper with one part of a jpeg while leaving the rest intact.  Not the case here though, the details HerryGrail is examining look identical to the image from the Fortean Picture Library of the Heron-Allen print.

Steve


#63    Steve Plambeck

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 02:08 AM

View PostZalanox, on 25 January 2013 - 08:09 AM, said:

Shouldn't people be using the original photo?

I mean, if you use a version of the photo that's been altered then are you really studying it? To me, this "newer version" looks way too different from the stock to be taken seriously.

By all means originals should be used whenever available.  The author and Nessie researcher Roland Watson discovered the long forgotten Heron-Allen print of the Gray Photo only about a year ago.  The full story is here: http://lochnessmyste...visited_26.html

Until then, as Insanity pointed out, all researchers were stuck working with copies of copies of copies for the last several decades.


#64    the dalek killer

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 12:15 AM

my problem is that i would find it hard to believe a large amphibian could live in those temperatures
but then again koolasuchus did  
so it is possible but unlikely


#65    PlanB

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 12:25 AM

View Postthe dalek killer, on 29 January 2013 - 12:15 AM, said:

my problem is that i would find it hard to believe a large amphibian could live in those temperatures
but then again koolasuchus did  
so it is possible but unlikely

The Japanese giant salamander inhabits rivers and streams that around 8 - 18 degrees celsius which is about the range of at least some parts of the loch. Interestingly enough, this largest known salamander is also probably the origin of one Japans mythical water monsters the kappa.

Not to say that I think Nessie is a giant salamander, but I do think that it's a fun theory.

Edited by PlanB, 29 January 2013 - 12:30 AM.


#66    the dalek killer

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:36 AM

View PostPlanB, on 29 January 2013 - 12:25 AM, said:

The Japanese giant salamander inhabits rivers and streams that around 8 - 18 degrees celsius which is about the range of at least some parts of the loch. Interestingly enough, this largest known salamander is also probably the origin of one Japans mythical water monsters the kappa.

Not to say that I think Nessie is a giant salamander, but I do think that it's a fun theory.
huh i always thought it was warmer there
but i agree it is pretty neat idea
but all i think happened is a that a large eel got loose in there and scared some people for a couple years and then died


#67    The Metal

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 02:55 PM

As someone with a little knowledge and experience with image manipulation, photography and digital media i cant 100% assure you that the process used to "evaluate" this image is nothing more than playing around with values until you get something that looks right....

The final "proof" image at the bottom of the article is significantly modified: the creator has even added in their own sketches of the salamanders over the top of the image as an overlay to further help the viewers brain see what has been suggested the image is showing.

I can do this too, and arguably to much more plausible effect: Its a dog swimming with a stick in its mouth, probably a retriever or labrador.. It's just taken with a very old and bad camera and blurred significantly. Oh and im not buying the whole "check the original image" argument, not even a little bit.

Posted Image

Edited by The Metal, 29 January 2013 - 02:58 PM.

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#68    Insanity

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:56 PM

View PostThe Metal, on 29 January 2013 - 02:55 PM, said:

As someone with a little knowledge and experience with image manipulation, photography and digital media i cant 100% assure you that the process used to "evaluate" this image is nothing more than playing around with values until you get something that looks right....

The final "proof" image at the bottom of the article is significantly modified: the creator has even added in their own sketches of the salamanders over the top of the image as an overlay to further help the viewers brain see what has been suggested the image is showing.

I can do this too, and arguably to much more plausible effect: Its a dog swimming with a stick in its mouth, probably a retriever or labrador.. It's just taken with a very old and bad camera and blurred significantly. Oh and im not buying the whole "check the original image" argument, not even a little bit.


Are you not doing the same sketching of a dog on it as well?

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#69    the dalek killer

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:11 AM

i think most of us can agree
its a dog


#70    signman

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 01:39 AM

View PostHerryGrail, on 30 December 2012 - 06:10 PM, said:

One more...I got to looking at the head area and had another thought:

Posted Imagethe mouth you outline is too wide. refer instead to the Roland Watson version. other than that, your analyisis is intriguing. are you proposing the idea of a mechanical entity, ie the "nut" outline?






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