23 replies to this topic

[Simbi Laveau]

http://www.japantoda...r_2013-01-28_PM

Satellite images are showing activity at previous rocket launch sites in North Korea .
No word about this has been made public by N Korea however .
The USAs staunch critisism of NKs previous launches ,has drawn a rebuttle from China,who said they would support any launch NK might do .


Anyone seeing a pattern here ?

Edited by Simbi Laveau, 29 January 2013 - 08:08 AM.

[AsteroidX]

Its pretty much a given there gonna get it right eventually. Who are we to condemn a countries progress when we ourselves are trying to advance our own military might and technologies. It does not suprise me that countries like Iran/NK follow the path the Americans took via missile/rocket/nuclear tech. The only real hope is China will keep NK in check once they have the nuke ready by explaining to them in detail what the world thinks of nuclear launches and what is considered an appropriate response to such an attack type launch.

For America NK is a much bigger threat then Iran as we are only in a  state of armistace and not peace with then. The Korean war never ended essentially.

Could it be dangerous. Yerp.

Im other news Iran shot a monkey into space and caught it.

[WhyDontYouBeliEveMe]

who are we to tell them what they can and what they cant do ?  no1 can appreciate it when someone is telling you what to do in your own home !  
let N korea and the puppet country S korea , solve this themselves ! the winner ll be writing history .
the world need to stop making up excuses to turn a country into a puppet country !

i believe this is all propaganda from the western countries , telling us that N korea might be a danger to the world , just like iraq !
if it comes to a nuclear war i wont blame N korea ! but rather those who provoked them ! and made them use it !

[AsteroidX]

North Korea will be a threat if we keep treating them like rabid dogs for another 10 years. Theyve been austercized by the World since the late 1950's and the people of NK have suffered greatly for it. Obviously the war machine of NK was slowed but not stopped. So perhaps a new approach to dealing with the New leader of NK is in order. How we can expect their attitudes to change to the world if our attitudes if anything have become more isolating and harsher then ever towards them.

[and then]

AsteroidX, on 29 January 2013 - 08:59 AM, said:

North Korea will be a threat if we keep treating them like rabid dogs for another 10 years. Theyve been austercized by the World since the late 1950's and the people of NK have suffered greatly for it. Obviously the war machine of NK was slowed but not stopped. So perhaps a new approach to dealing with the New leader of NK is in order. How we can expect their attitudes to change to the world if our attitudes if anything have become more isolating and harsher then ever towards them.

In the '90s Clinton sought rapprochement.  He gave them massive amounts of food when their people were starving and he essentially built a "light water" nuclear reactor for them.  They made some minor gestures for a brief period then it comes to our attention during Bush's term that they have another facility and have never stopped their nuclear work.  Coddling them is useless.  If it weren't for the severity of the threat they would be comical they're so childish.  Throw a tantrum and threaten - receive aid, repeat.  In time their civilians may not have to worry about living in starvation and deprivation any longer because the world will be forced to nuke them out of existence.

WhyDontYouBeliEveMe, on 29 January 2013 - 08:51 AM, said:

who are we to tell them what they can and what they cant do ?  no1 can appreciate it when someone is telling you what to do in your own home !  
let N korea and the puppet country S korea , solve this themselves ! the winner ll be writing history .
the world need to stop making up excuses to turn a country into a puppet country !

i believe this is all propaganda from the western countries , telling us that N korea might be a danger to the world , just like iraq !
if it comes to a nuclear war i wont blame N korea ! but rather those who provoked them ! and made them use it !

If they use it, for whatever reason, they will be annihilated.  When adults use the logic you do that essentially says THAT'S NOT FAIR!!  I have to wonder about them.  No one has been attempting to tell the DPRK what to do in "their own home".  The world has simply asked them not to build nukes.  NK has no wealth, no oil, almost no food even.... what exactly is there that another country would want to take by force?  It's obvious to most rational persons that this backward, brutal regime is killing it's own in massive numbers just to survive and their good friend China is giving them just enough aid to keep them hungry and dangerous.  Of all the countries on this planet that the US might consider unleashing a nuke (s) on...NK is easily the soft choice.  A few cruise missiles against the forward concentrated troops and the command, control, communication nodes and voila'! stern faced fat boy no longer is a threat.

[AsteroidX]

Quote

In the '90s Clinton sought rapprochement.  He gave them massive amounts of food when their people were starving and he essentially built a "light water" nuclear reactor for them.  They made some minor gestures for a brief period then it comes to our attention during Bush's term that they have another facility and have never stopped their nuclear work.  Coddling them is useless.  If it weren't for the severity of the threat they would be comical they're so childish.  Throw a tantrum and threaten - receive aid, repeat.  In time their civilians may not have to worry about living in starvation and deprivation any longer because the world will be forced to nuke them out of existence.

I remember that now that you gave me a refresher. Id just have to say perhaps the US is not the best country to reapproach them since were still technically at war. Its not like we have to be the world policeman anymore. But we can be supportive of others trying to deescalate the problem. The gesture especially since we have a new leader that is young and will be in power for some time to come would not be stupid IMO. But yeah giving them soft nukes not so much. Food. No reason not too IMO. It doesnt have to come from US.

[Frank Merton]

I dunno about all this "let them do it" business.  Frankly every time another country gets nuclear capability I just see the end of humanity as getting a little bit closer.

[WhyDontYouBeliEveMe]

and then, on 29 January 2013 - 09:19 AM, said:

In the '90s Clinton sought rapprochement.  He gave them massive amounts of food when their people were starving and he essentially built a "light water" nuclear reactor for them.  They made some minor gestures for a brief period then it comes to our attention during Bush's term that they have another facility and have never stopped their nuclear work.  Coddling them is useless.  If it weren't for the severity of the threat they would be comical they're so childish.  Throw a tantrum and threaten - receive aid, repeat.  In time their civilians may not have to worry about living in starvation and deprivation any longer because the world will be forced to nuke them out of existence.If they use it, for whatever reason, they will be annihilated.  When adults use the logic you do that essentially says THAT'S NOT FAIR!!  I have to wonder about them.  No one has been attempting to tell the DPRK what to do in "their own home".  The world has simply asked them not to build nukes.  NK has no wealth, no oil, almost no food even.... what exactly is there that another country would want to take by force?  It's obvious to most rational persons that this backward, brutal regime is killing it's own in massive numbers just to survive and their good friend China is giving them just enough aid to keep them hungry and dangerous.  Of all the countries on this planet that the US might consider unleashing a nuke (s) on...NK is easily the soft choice.  A few cruise missiles against the forward concentrated troops and the command, control, communication nodes and voila'! stern faced fat boy no longer is a threat.

asking them sounds nice ! the fact remains the same ,asking or telling !
give them some aid ,food ,medicine , water , built a house for them after you have taken it from them, show the world you care ! and at the same time , the USA isolates them from the world !
offcours they will starve , offcours they need resource ! no country can survive without trade !
about the regime killing their own . we dont know about that.  its proberly propaganda . just like what they did to saddam, with those chemical weapons  !
you think the western countries can survive without the resource from asian countries? trade is essential for a country ! take that away from them , is the same as poison them !
offcours a country like that would feel treated and wants to defend themselves . thats where nukes come in so that they could have a voice in the world !
and do yuo really believe south korea has more food , got oil , has more minerals? no they got trade ! tahts exacly why they flourish!
but then we would never know what the top elite is thinking !
maybe its just china and Usa that are fighting over world supremacy, N korea is just in the middle of it ! that doesnt wants to be crushed ! having nukes ,can save them,
but the poison ll get them in the end ! all we can do is pray ! for a solution for the best of mankind !

[libstaK]

Frank Merton, on 29 January 2013 - 10:14 AM, said:

I dunno about all this "let them do it" business.  Frankly every time another country gets nuclear capability I just see the end of humanity as getting a little bit closer.

I have to agree, the suffering of their people bears a direct correlation with their leaderships lack of conscience and care, the trillions they are spending on developing their military might could have fed their population for a long time.  Couple that cold blooded single mindedness with nucleur power and the potential for disaster is very real.

[and then]

AsteroidX, on 29 January 2013 - 09:32 AM, said:

I remember that now that you gave me a refresher. Id just have to say perhaps the US is not the best country to reapproach them since were still technically at war. Its not like we have to be the world policeman anymore. But we can be supportive of others trying to deescalate the problem. The gesture especially since we have a new leader that is young and will be in power for some time to come would not be stupid IMO. But yeah giving them soft nukes not so much. Food. No reason not too IMO. It doesnt have to come from US.

Yes, I don't advocate rattling their cage - far from it.  But to give them food and fuel while they are refusing to even slow their nuclear weapons and missile programs is not wise.  If they have to struggle with feeding their people to keep down the specter - no matter how improbable - of insurrection, then we in the west are better off I think.  They obviously feel they can bully the world with the threat of their weapons.  If they continue to be rewarded for such behavior they will only grow bolder - maybe to the point of miscalculation?

[AsteroidX]

Maybe the old proverb give a man a fish you feed him for a day. Teach the same man how to fish and he will eat for a lifetime applies.

The thing is we dont do much to make the situation more amenable. So we will never know likely.

[and then]

libstaK, on 29 January 2013 - 11:32 AM, said:

I have to agree, the suffering of their people bears a direct correlation with their leaderships lack of conscience and care, the trillions they are spending on developing their military might could have fed their population for a long time.  Couple that cold blooded single mindedness with nucleur power and the potential for disaster is very real.

I agree.  I just came across an interesting piece from StratFor on this very issue.

"<a href="http://www.stratfor.com/weekly/ferocious-weak-and-crazy-north-korean-strategy">Ferocious, Weak and Crazy: The North Korean Strategy</a> is republished with permission of Stratfor."

It seems that real intelligence analysts think the NK leaders are a lot more savvy than they might appear to be

[wolfknight]

Why can't we all just get along

[libstaK]

and then, on 29 January 2013 - 12:11 PM, said:

I agree.  I just came across an interesting piece from StratFor on this very issue.

"<a href="http://www.stratfor.com/weekly/ferocious-weak-and-crazy-north-korean-strategy">Ferocious, Weak and Crazy: The North Korean Strategy</a> is republished with permission of Stratfor."

It seems that real intelligence analysts think the NK leaders are a lot more savvy than they might appear to be

That link didn't work too well, here is another to the same.  Thanks for the heads up, will read this shortly.

http://www.stratfor....korean-strategy

[Yamato]

wolfknight, on 29 January 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

Why can't we all just get along

Ahh such agreeable rhetoric, that.   And spoken like every federal lawmaker in the Congress,  We build 100x more nuclear missiles than we'll ever need to wipe out human civilization and you guys don't build ANY, and we'll get along...errrrrr....except if you don't have nukes then we might bomb the &$#$ out of you if you do something disagreeable, like nationalize your oil production, or decide to trade your resources in non-dollar currency.