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Time travel


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#31    seeder

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 10:18 PM

View PostDr. Mrdad, on 30 December 2012 - 06:03 PM, said:

I understand what you mean. I think your talking about time traveling in a form of being in location A and then using a method which would transport the physical body into location B which would be the future. For the physical body to return to location A from location B would mean that there must be a method or the same apparatus that would be able to receive the physical body in location A, which is the past. So in that case you would be stuck in the past without being able to go back to your original time line. Kind of like the movie Looper.

The form of time traveling i'm speaking of is being in a craft or machine that is able to transport itself, crew and all parts intact through time space with great precision. First we would have to master the form(method) which I will term Looping. Only the only way that could happen is by mastering the method of being able to tell what time and date to appear and in what location is desired. For it to be able to move in the sky would be determined upon its shape. Then the best thing that comes to mind is the saucer shape. Look at the Frisbee, how it moves effortlessly through the air. This form would maybe also able to penetrate space time just as easily as it does in air.

The form of time traveling I always thought of is that the occupants would not be transported physically to a location like being beamed or sent through a worm hole. I always thought that we could build a machine that would be able to transport the machine itself to and through the past and to the future, with the occupants inside the machine, Instead of the energy being focused inwardly on the occupants, the energy would be focused outwardly on the shell of the machine. the shell would become the radiating source of energy itself used to time travel. When machine shifts from location a to location b. All occupants and parts would be shifted there intact with the machine itself.

True stoners will understand me.

Aint that the truth!  yes I hear you in regards to a device, I think the best one really was the original HG Wells film, the Time Machine, an old fave of mine! he never left the house in his machine, it just all crumbled away around him when he traveled etc...

I don't know if it ever will become do-able tho...   but, be neat if it could!  I have no idea about the quantum level and time travel, quantum mechanics is enough for even a stoner to freak out with, or even the possibility of ripples in time in space...

But if it were a reality... I think Id just want to go to the future for a visit, we have the past pretty well recorded already, and I think Id like to know how I turned out in the end. If I didnt make it in the future, boy Id pull my sox up - in the here and now..that journey alone would do for me,  but again theres a small issue, if I knew alls well for me in say 20 years...would that make me stop trying to do well now?

Im not sure how we would react or change (in the present)  to see our future selves, and how that will affect our actions now... if I traveled to the future and saw myself locked up in jail for something bad... would I be ever vigilant NOW to be sure I lived a crime free life? Perhaps I would, but that's what in the future for me anyway! Or is it avoided just by knowing it?

Or is the future inevitable? Would knowing what lies before you - be a really good thing? Or would we lose our sense of passion and interest and enthusiasm for life NOW, if we knew in the end.. we have failed?

if you get my drift of course!  now where's those zig-zags!

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#32    keninsc

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 10:53 PM

View PostRlyeh, on 30 December 2012 - 06:18 PM, said:

Time doesn't flow backward so time dilation can't take you back in time.
Besides it would violate causality if you could.

Dude, that's like saying you can only go one direction on a river because it only flows in one direction. Besides, if you only can travel one direction in time then you'd be trapped in whatever time you wound up in.........until you died. Then the whole time you'd have to be careful not to screw up the current timeline. Seriously?


#33    seeder

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 10:59 PM

View Postkeninsc, on 30 December 2012 - 10:53 PM, said:

Dude, that's like saying you can only go one direction on a river because it only flows in one direction. Besides, if you only can travel one direction in time then you'd be trapped in whatever time you wound up in.........until you died. Then the whole time you'd have to be careful not to screw up the current timeline. Seriously?

Good point and well said!

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#34    keninsc

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 10:40 AM

oops, forgot to quote. Be back in a bit to fix that.


That assumes that the time line is a seriously fragile thing and can be screwed up with but a whisper. That I seriously doubt, for example, you go back in time and do something really stupid.......yes, intentionally changing the time line would be pretty darn stupid if you ask me. Ok, say you go and take out Hitler before he rises to power in Germany. You might well avert WWII, however you might set up a chain of events that results in the US and the USSR exchanging nukes and laying waste to the entire planet. Now which one would be better for the world in long run? Hmmm? Yes, there will be carnage and there will be suffering and many will die horribly in the concentration camps and many a US service man will die on the Bataan Death March. You see what I'm saying? The world ain't perfect now but it never has been and most likely never will be because humans tend to be self centered and asinine by nature.

Going back and changing a pivotal historical event or taking out a single person might change one thing but wind up changing other things that you can't foresee be cause it's all different now. So first and fore most, don't screw with it. That has to be the first rule for any time traveler.

.....and please don't go to the Grand father causality thing. Why on Earth would you want to do that in the first place? Perform a retroactive abortion on yourself?

Now, having said all that, going back and doing historical research to fill in gaps in our own historical record wouldn't be such a difficult thing to do. Pop back on board the Titanic before it set sail from Southampton and video things and people. You could do it with a camera that looks like a broach or a pair of eyeglasses.....they won't know what they're looking at because it hasn't been invented yet. Then just before the ship goes down, pop back out and return to your time. Granted it'll be grizzly to see people you saw alive when you look at the dead, but it was for history's sake. See what I'm saying?

Go back to ancient Egypt and see exactly how the pyramids were built, what they looked like when they were completed and brand spanking new. The list of things goes on. Go to ancient Rome, check out the Colosseum, maybe take in a gladiatorial bout or two.

You don't have to change anything if you train your people right and make sure you have ones that understand the importance of the time line.

Edited by keninsc, 31 December 2012 - 10:41 AM.


#35    NiteMarcher

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 11:09 AM

I sometimes wonder if all time is the same, perhaps a possibility of somehow being an intertwining of the past, the present and the future simultaneously. For myself, I say this, because as farfetched as this may sound, I've often wondered how I was able to get a glimpse of my other half (spouse) several years earlier while lying in bed and seeing this persons face before my eyes upon awaking from a  nap in broad day light...I guess you could call it some type of a vision, or a peak into the future, I don't know, but call it what you may.  This persons smiling face looked as real to me as anything else before my eyes. It was like I had a panoramic view of what I was seeing...and yet, upon closing my eyes after what seemed like about two minutes or so, & than opening it once again, I found myself now staring up at a blank ceiling. Several years later I eventually met this person, who when I had seen for the first time, I already knew who this person was. This person eventually became my other half. I can say that physically I didn't travel anywhere, because I was still aware of the room I was in. But, mentally something definitely happened where my perception was opened up to allow me to catch a glimpse of someone who would eventually become a part of my future.  Incidents such as these has led me to believe that all time may just be one and the same. I haven't gone back into the past....at least not in this life time.

Edited by NiteMarcher, 31 December 2012 - 11:14 AM.

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#36    Rlyeh

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 11:10 AM

View Postkeninsc, on 30 December 2012 - 10:53 PM, said:

Dude, that's like saying you can only go one direction on a river because it only flows in one direction.
Yes, seriously. Time dilation does not go backwards. Maybe you should read up on it?
It's the elapsed time between different reference frames.

Quote

Besides, if you only can travel one direction in time then you'd be trapped in whatever time you wound up in.........until you died.
No more trapped than you are now. Time simply passed at a different rate.

Quote

Then the whole time you'd have to be careful not to screw up the current timeline. Seriously?
Sorry, what? Time dilation doesn't violate causality, so I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.

Edited by Rlyeh, 31 December 2012 - 11:29 AM.


#37    Rlyeh

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 11:29 AM

View Postkeninsc, on 31 December 2012 - 10:40 AM, said:

Ok, say you go and take out Hitler before he rises to power in Germany. You might well avert WWII, however you might set up a chain of events that results in the US and the USSR exchanging nukes and laying waste to the entire planet.
Causality is when an event leads to another event.

In your example, Hitler is the reason you went back. You remove him and thereby remove the event that lead to you going back.


#38    keninsc

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 12:02 PM

View PostRlyeh, on 31 December 2012 - 11:29 AM, said:

Causality is when an event leads to another event.

In your example, Hitler is the reason you went back. You remove him and thereby remove the event that lead to you going back.

....and destroyed the world in the process, all without doing anything. Don't screw with the time line.


#39    keninsc

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 12:10 PM

View PostRlyeh, on 31 December 2012 - 11:10 AM, said:

Yes, seriously. Time dilation does not go backwards. Maybe you should read up on it?
It's the elapsed time between different reference frames.

Actually, I have rather extensively, but who said it went backward? A time dilations is a slow down in time itself, not a change of direction.

No more trapped than you are now. Time simply passed at a different rate.

Well duh! Of course I'm trapped in time there Bubba. I don't have a time machine....but I'm working on it. I'll let you know when I have it worked out.

Sorry, what? Time dilation doesn't violate causality, so I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.

Ok, that one obviously went completely over your head. Here's a hint, instead of breaking things down into the elemental parts, if you take them as whole thought you'd be able to follow them better. Just a suggestion. I fully anticipate you freaking out that I've insulted you when that wasn't the intention.......because you're over analyzing and not getting the concept.

Edited by keninsc, 31 December 2012 - 12:23 PM.


#40    keninsc

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 12:21 PM

View PostNiteMarcher, on 31 December 2012 - 11:09 AM, said:

I sometimes wonder if all time is the same, perhaps a possibility of somehow being an intertwining of the past, the present and the future simultaneously. For myself, I say this, because as farfetched as this may sound, I've often wondered how I was able to get a glimpse of my other half (spouse) several years earlier while lying in bed and seeing this persons face before my eyes upon awaking from a  nap in broad day light...I guess you could call it some type of a vision, or a peak into the future, I don't know, but call it what you may.  This persons smiling face looked as real to me as anything else before my eyes. It was like I had a panoramic view of what I was seeing...and yet, upon closing my eyes after what seemed like about two minutes or so, & than opening it once again, I found myself now staring up at a blank ceiling. Several years later I eventually met this person, who when I had seen for the first time, I already knew who this person was. This person eventually became my other half. I can say that physically I didn't travel anywhere, because I was still aware of the room I was in. But, mentally something definitely happened where my perception was opened up to allow me to catch a glimpse of someone who would eventually become a part of my future.  Incidents such as these has led me to believe that all time may just be one and the same. I haven't gone back into the past....at least not in this life time.

That I can't answer, however I do know that we do have things happen are they psychic? Are they time jumps? Beats me, but I know they happen because I've experienced them. I don't know why or how and I can't make it happen, it just happens and when it does......dayuum!


#41    Rlyeh

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 12:39 PM

View Postkeninsc, on 31 December 2012 - 12:10 PM, said:

Ok, that one obviously went completely over your head. Here's a hint, instead of breaking things down into the elemental parts, if you take them as whole thought you'd be able to follow them better. Just a suggestion. I fully anticipate you freaking out that I've insulted you when that wasn't the intention.......because you're over analyzing and not getting the concept.
Perhaps if you broke it down, you'd be able to read more carefully.
You see I brought up about time flow and time dilation being one way. You respond something about affecting the time line and travelling back wards, nothing to do with time dilation. Your reply shows you either didn't read, or didn't understand. Now that is called going over your head.


#42    Dr. Mirdad

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 01:59 PM

View PostRlyeh, on 31 December 2012 - 11:29 AM, said:

Causality is when an event leads to another event.

In your example, Hitler is the reason you went back. You remove him and thereby remove the event that lead to you going back.

If you went back and removed Hitler, it still wouldn't affect your reality. Removing Hitler would create a whole new world, but it will not change the one you came from. You would still go back to a world that was tainted by Hitler because that is the reality your a Projecting from. The instant moment Hitler is removed, it no longer becomes the same reality you will project from.

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#43    Dr. Mirdad

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 02:24 PM

View PostNiteMarcher, on 31 December 2012 - 11:09 AM, said:

I sometimes wonder if all time is the same, perhaps a possibility of somehow being an intertwining of the past, the present and the future simultaneously. For myself, I say this, because as farfetched as this may sound, I've often wondered how I was able to get a glimpse of my other half (spouse) several years earlier while lying in bed and seeing this persons face before my eyes upon awaking from a  nap in broad day light...I guess you could call it some type of a vision, or a peak into the future, I don't know, but call it what you may.  This persons smiling face looked as real to me as anything else before my eyes. It was like I had a panoramic view of what I was seeing...and yet, upon closing my eyes after what seemed like about two minutes or so, & than opening it once again, I found myself now staring up at a blank ceiling. Several years later I eventually met this person, who when I had seen for the first time, I already knew who this person was. This person eventually became my other half. I can say that physically I didn't travel anywhere, because I was still aware of the room I was in. But, mentally something definitely happened where my perception was opened up to allow me to catch a glimpse of someone who would eventually become a part of my future.  Incidents such as these has led me to believe that all time may just be one and the same. I haven't gone back into the past....at least not in this life time.

I wonder if deja vu is a form of time travel? Like a sensing of the future. I once had a dream about a Flood hitting a japan. Then 3 months later japan was hit by a flood. Maybe our consciousness has the ability to sense and perceive the future in which it still exists in. Like I could sense the future upon until the point where I have passed away. It would be the same consciousness projecting in the future, in the past and the present. The only difference is what the consciousness is experiencing. Thats just my 2 and 1/2 sense.

“Often you shall think your road impassable, sombre and companionless. Have will and plod along; and round each curve you shall find a new companion.”

#44    seeder

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 02:44 PM

Glad no-ones mentioned John Titor so far...

he was a real time traveler from 2036 you know, came back for an old IBM PC that was needed urgently in the future as the old IBM could read much code that others couldnt - in the future.. :yes:

haha...

Much like the Terminator - coming back to destroy a microchip....

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#45    Ashotep

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 04:05 PM

Since people can get premonitions of the future and often they happen then I think the future is already written but can be changed.  If we start going forward and backward in time we might screw things up so bad our whole reality would change.  I hope time travel never happens, it could be used for good but all we need is some deranged person let say that hates the US.  They go back and kill George Washington and possibly change things so the US never happens.  We could also stop bad things from happening by lets say killing Hitler but I bet that wouldn't be what it is used for.





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