4036 replies to this topic

[Abramelin]

The OLB word "Wâk" stands for "wake, watch, guard, standby".


Dutch:

1 Timoteüs 6:20
Timoteüs, waak over hetgeen je is toevertrouwd en mijd het goddeloze gepraat en de tegenstrijdigheden van wat ten onrechte kennis wordt genoemd.

http://www.biblija.n...nl&set=10&pos=0

O, Timotheüs, bewaak het toevertrouwde, wegdraaiend van de wereldse holle klanken en de tegenstellingen van de zogenaamde kennis

http://www.schriftwo...1Timotheus6.htm

English:

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
O Timothy, guard what has been entrusted to you, avoiding worldly and empty chatter and the opposing arguments of what is falsely called "knowledge "--

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
Oh, Timothy, guard that which is committed to you and escape from empty echoes and from the perversions of false knowledge.

http://bible.cc/1_timothy/6-20.htm

More recently, Walt Disney produced National Treasure, a film that introduces Freemasonry to the younger generation. Freemasonry is a prime example of Gnosticism; in fact, the g in the Masonic symbol does not stand for God, but for gnosis—that is, knowledge. Freemasons are initiated into secret knowledge and various mysteries through the teaching of more advanced Masons. Its symbolism and esoteric knowledge draws its adherents in, modifying their worldview. The Freemasonry in National Treasure is presented as exciting but harmless, with the "secret knowledge" dealing with various clues that would lead to an old and immense treasure. (Dan Brown is said to be working on another book, The Solomon Key, believed to be about Freemasonry.)

http://www.bibletool...e-Knowledge.htm


+++

EDIT:

Dutch:

Reeds de Nederlandsche grootmeester der Vrijmetselarij J. H. Carpentier
Alting stelde vast, dat de samensteller van het Oera-Linda-Boek iemand
geweest is, die op vrijmetselaars-manier dacht en voelde, en daarom prees
hij het werk, al beschouwde ook hij het als louter verdichting uit den
nieuweren tijd.
http://www.historici...oc&view=pdfPane


English:

Already the Dutch Grandmaster of Freemasonry J. H. Carpentier
Alting found out that the compiler of the Oera-Linda-Book must have been one
who thought and felt in a Masonic way, and therefore praised
his work, even though he considered it as mere modern forgery.

.

Edited by Abramelin, 26 November 2012 - 08:56 PM.

[Otharus]

Russian translation (2007) by Andrej Kondratjew of "Die Ura Linda Chronik" (1933) by Herman Wirth.



Together with Heinrich Himmler (and Richard Darré), Wirth founded the research group "Deutsches Ahnenerbe" (as part of the SS) in 1935. He left the movement in 1938.

More information (in Dutch), see herman-wirth-en-de-indo-europese-voorgeschiedenis

[NO-ID-EA]

Guys i have a couple of questions for you but first i will try to put up a vid link , as i am not very computer savvy , and apparently you had a problem opening the last link i posted here .. hopefully this will work .



that vid called "Goffe Jansma over het oera linda boek " shows pages from OLB which are clearly fairly orange in colour , with the letters being a rusty faded brown colour, whereas Abe's recent post of page 46 with the stand , and run script both show the writting and ink , in a very bold black colour.......unless its the studio lighting they both look to me like very different copies of the OLB.

on Historum i had quite a long discussion with another member where we were both discussing , so called experts opinions of whether the writting was black or faded rusty brown , as the experts were saying this was relevant to whether there was iron pigment in the ink or not... and could lead to a better dating.

are these two seperate copies of OLB ?? and if so which is the original ?? neither of them is Ottema's copy , which one is being used to judge the dates of ink used , and the possible date that the paper was manufactured, ...........or are they both the same copy and i am just getting confused ??

On another note i would like to see a complete copy of that map Jensma shows at around 2:20 in the vid , which seems to show the Greeks in Portugal, spain , but includes them all in Fry-land......and Gog- Magog around and coming from the Kiew(presume Kiev) area, with arrows showing i presume invasion routes.

look at a few of the dates shown , medieval dates ?? this was why i mentioned Fomenko the other day.....i am becoming more and more intrigued.

I dont know why i cant get the vid to work ??? can anyone help. by uploading it ??please.....it does exist ..i have just been watching it .!!

Edited by NO-ID-EA, 27 November 2012 - 11:57 AM.

[Abramelin]

Fisrt the video:



You only have to copy the video-url from your browser, and then paste the url into your reply. It will (here on UM) automatically be embedded.

[Abramelin]

That the OLB pages in the first seconds of the video show up in a somewhat different color is caused by the type of lighting they must have used for the video. The pages you see on the Dutch Tresoar site are all photographed using special lighting to render the true color of the MS.


+++

EDIT:

You are right: the MS you see in the first seconds of the vid must be a copy because the original MS consists of loose and damaged leaves.

++++++



The map is from a to me unknown German book. At first I assumed it was from Herman Wirth's book in German, but it isn't: Then I thought it's because it's not copied into in the pdf, so I checked the actual online copy, and it's not there either:

"Die Ura Linda Chronik"

http://archive.org/s...age/n2/mode/1up

http://archive.org/d...a-Linda-Chronik

What i did notice is that it was actually Wirth who coined the term "Doggerland" already in 1933, and not Overwijn in 1941 (page 249 , C. Reid) as I always thought. Reid never called the former dry North Sea bed 'Doggerland'.

I also see Wirth had some ideas and insights we all her have discovered on our own (well, I have). Maybe I should start reading his tome, lol.

OK, I will try to make a better copy of that map you are talking about. I already did once, but it was blurry.

.

Edited by Abramelin, 27 November 2012 - 04:05 PM.

[Abramelin]

The map is wrong: it places Thyrhisburg in present Tunis, but it should be in Lebanon.

The dates are BCE, not CE, and are also way off.

I don't know from which book Jensma showed us that map, I have never seen it.

But I can assure you those dates are not medieval dates.

[Otharus]

Abramelin, on 27 November 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

"Die Ura Linda Chronik"
http://archive.org/s...age/n2/mode/1up
http://archive.org/d...a-Linda-Chronik

And here is a version with normal letters (not the gothic type):

Content & translation (to page 128): de.scribd.com/.../Ura-Linda-Chronik-Text

"Die Einführung"/ discussion (p. 129-323): de.scribd.com/.../Ura-Linda-Chronik-Einfuehrung

"Der Bilder Atlas"/ images: de.scribd.com/.../Ura-Linda-Chronik-Bilderatlas-SW

[Abramelin]

From the Archive.org site I linked to you can also download his book (pdf) in normal letters:

http://archive.org/d...a-Linda-Chronik

http://www.unexplain...10#entry4555942


.

Edited by Abramelin, 27 November 2012 - 06:36 PM.

[Abramelin]

Otharus, on 27 November 2012 - 11:26 AM, said:

Russian translation (2007) by Andrej Kondratjew of "Die Ura Linda Chronik" (1933) by Herman Wirth.



Together with Heinrich Himmler (and Richard Darré), Wirth founded the research group "Deutsches Ahnenerbe" (as part of the SS) in 1935. He left the movement in 1938.

More information (in Dutch), see herman-wirth-en-de-indo-europese-voorgeschiedenis

I recently downloaded another of Wirth's books:

Der Aufgang der Menschheit - Untersuchungen zur Geschichte der Religion, Symbolik und Schrift der Atlantisch-Nordischen Rasse (1928)

[Otharus]

Abe, I hope you finally see what I mean with OLB being somehow 'suppressed' in post-WW2 Netherlands (and Germany).

It is connected with Wirth, who is connected to Himmler and the SS (even though he stepped out of it in '38).
Himmler used to send Jul-candle holders (with the wheel on it) to families of SS-members for christmas.

Admitting that you like the OLB or take it seriously, is like saying that your parents or grandparents collaborated with the nazis.
From the younger generation, hardly anyone will know of its existance, but for the older generation, it will smell like NSB.

Taboo!

[Otharus]

To be more clear:
not suppressed as in government policy (secret service), just that people don't talk about it.

Edited by Otharus, 28 November 2012 - 01:37 PM.

[Abramelin]

Otharus, on 28 November 2012 - 12:00 PM, said:

Abe, I hope you finally see what I mean with OLB being somehow 'suppressed' in post-WW2 Netherlands (and Germany).

It is connected with Wirth, who is connected to Himmler and the SS (even though he stepped out of it in '38).
Himmler used to send Jul-candle holders (with the wheel on it) to families of SS-members for christmas.

Admitting that you like the OLB or take it seriously, is like saying that your parents or grandparents collaborated with the nazis.
From the younger generation, hardly anyone will know of its existance, but for the older generation, it will smell like NSB.

Taboo!

Sorry, not to be stubborn, but no:I don't see it like that.

Before I started writing this post, I tried to remember when exactly I heard about the OLB for the first time.

Well, I knew for certain that the first time I read about it was in a Dutch new age magazine called BRES.which I regularly bought . I googled, and arrived at Knul's site:

Grootaers, Jan - De nalatenschap van tante Aafje, of het beruchte Oera-Linda-boek. In : Bres No. 38 (dec. 1972 / jan. 1973), pp.85-103.

http://www.rodinbook...tuur120912.html


The fun thing is that I did not buy this item, but read it in the library (Bilderdijkstraat, The Hague), and..... ripped out the pages containing the article,lol ! Anyway, it fascinated me, and I needed to know more about it, although I also had some doubts about some of the things the article talked about, like - here you have it - the etymologie. However, as far as I remember, nothing about Wirth or Himmler or the Nazis was mentioned in that article.

The library itself had nothing about it, but the famous Dutch second-hand bookstore, De Slegte (the store in The Hague) had. I remember it was a hardbound book with a light-green cover and with the seal Ottema also used in his book on it. But it was in German and I wasn't willing to go read a German book voluntarily, lol, so I only leafed through it and I left it there (no, it wasn't Wirth's book).

In the years after I sometimes read a newspaper article about the OLB, but again: almost never anything about Wirth, and the Nazis.

Finally, in the 90's of the past century, I stumbled upon Overwijn's book about the OLB (second edition of 1951) in an antique book market in the Sint Pieterskerk in Leiden, and bought it without hesitation (costed me 75 guilders back then). And again: nothing about Wirth or Nazis in his book. And no one eyed me up and down when I held that 'notorious' book in my hands....

But the former owner of the book (it was signed by Overwijn himself) must have known about Wirth and the Nazis in relation to the OLB because he had cut out an article about Overwijn from a newspaper ("De Dordtenaar", Friday 22, November 1946) and had inserted it between the last page and the back cover. The article was about Overwijn's risky dealings with the NSB (collaborators) and the Nazis, he was described as somewhat of a hero of the resistance.. It also says that Goebels himself was against his book about the OLB being published, and that was about the only line about it..

I will try to make a copy of that newspaper article.

==

Anyway, I'm just saying that my impression about how the OLB was and is being treated in the Netherlands is different from yours.

The reason the OLB never got that much attention anymore, decades after Ottema published his book, is because most people were by then convinced it was a fabrication, a forgery, a hoax, or whatever label I should use.

.

Edited by Abramelin, 28 November 2012 - 06:17 PM.

[Abramelin]

Here is a copy of that newspaper article from 1946 about Overwijn:

http://i6.photobucke...jn_article1.jpg
http://i6.photobucke...jn_article2.jpg

I downsized the images because else it would take up a lot of space on my Photobucket account, but I hope you (Dutch, Belgians and South Africans) can still read it.

[Otharus]

Very interesting to read about how you found out about the OLB, as well as the article on Overwijn from 1946.

If Goebels had forbidden his 1941 edition of the OLB, that would be most significant.
Now I would really like to read that version and compare it with his post-war (1951) edition.

I don't know what to think of that 1946 article.
It is possible that Overwijn made up that story to get rid of the fishy smell he must have had by having published his '41 OLB.
There was (and is) much black-and-white thinking after the war.
OLB can indeed be read as propaganda for racial purity and as said, OLB being also known as "Himmler's Bible" says enough.

Therefore, it would be important to have confirmed that his '41 edition was indeed illegal and to know what he wrote in it (other than his translation). What was Overwijn's '41 ideology? If he was not explicit about it, it may be readable 'between the lines'.

What many people will not know is that there are actually many parallels (not all obviously) between 'New Age' ideas and Nazi (specially SS) ideology.

Significantly, Jensma mentioned New Agers in one breath (Dutch expression) with nazis and right-extremists ('new-right'):

As I posted on 17 oct. 2010:

Quote

Jensma (2004; page 17)

"This Ottema was followed by a long row of believers of suspicious character. Of them SS-Führer Heinrich Himmler is most notorious, but he was certainly not the only one. Theosophists, nazi's, New Agers and right extremists of various sorts explained and still explain this OLB as an authentic and important source for our knowledge of western civilisation."

Original text:

"Deze Ottema kreeg een lange stoet van gelovigen van bedenkelijk allooi achter zich aan. De SS-Führer Heinrich Himmler is van hen de beruchtste, maar hij was zeker niet de enige. Theosofen, nazi's, New Agers en Nieuwe Rechtsen van allerlei pluimage verklaarden en verklaren dit Oera Linda-boek nog steeds voor een authentieke en belangrijke bron voor onze kennis van de westerse beschaving."

These two videos about SS and the occult (New Age themes) are interesting:

https://www.youtube....h?v=-cQI9rtMbRI
https://www.youtube....h?v=OvwIHZ1EljI

(This is not the "Occult history of the 3rd Reich" series I posted earlier.)

I edited your newspaper article for future reference:

[Otharus]

Reasons to doubt Overwijn's resistance story and that his OLB work would have been illegal:

Source: www.oeralindaboek.nl/...dossier24

Overwijn. J.F., - De strekking van het O.L.B. Onze voorvaderen: de West-Friezen van Doggerland (Verslag van twee lezingen voor het genootschap 'Yggdrasil'). - Het Vaderland 1941, 25 Maart en 10 Apr.

Overwijn. J.F., - Thàt Ura Linda Bok, Opnieuw bewerkt en uitgegeven door --. - Enkhuizen, N.V. Enkhuizer Courant v.h. D.C. Egmond, 1941, LVII, 189, XXIV pp. 8° (get. Dordrecht, Aug. 1941). vgl [nr. *635].

Overwijn, J.F., - Merkwaardige namen en plaatsen in het O.L.B. - Ons Eigen Volk III, 1943, pp. 262-271.
.
.
.
Edit:
The founder of Yggdrasil was a National Socialist.

In 1932 was hij [Elle Gerrit Bolhuis, 1887-1970] een van de oprichters van de Kelto-Germaanse Studiekring Yggdrasil. Vermoedelijk vlak voor de Tweede Wereldoorlog bekeerde hij zich tot het nationaalsocialisme.

source: nl.wikipedia.org/Elle_Gerrit_Bolhuis

And if his '41 book would have been forbidden, it would not have been reviewed in the Enkhuizer newspaper.

Edited by Otharus, 28 November 2012 - 10:10 PM.