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Are Extraterrestrials Really Demons?


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#271    Hazzard

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Posted 10 April 2013 - 07:09 PM

View PostR4z3rsPar4d0x, on 10 April 2013 - 05:00 PM, said:

Another reason I think the Travis Walton was abducted was because after his friends told the cops the cops thought they were lying and just trying to cover up the fact that they murdered him, They searched the woods for days on end and could find nothing. Then all of a suddenly he shows up, I mean yeah he could have lied about it, But then why when all his friends took the lie detector test did they pass.

Although Walton passed a polygraph test arranged by a UFO organization, Klass learned that Walton dictated to the examiner what questions would be asked. Further investigation by Klass led him to an earlier unpublished polygraph test of Walton, conducted by Jack McCarthy, one of the top polygraph examiners in Arizona. McCarthy gave Klass his assessment of Walton’s story: “Gross deception!” He added that Walton employed polygraph countermeasures, such as holding his breath.

Here is more,... http://www.skepticbl...detection-test/

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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#272    ReaperS_ParadoX

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Posted 10 April 2013 - 08:50 PM

View PostHazzard, on 10 April 2013 - 07:09 PM, said:

Although Walton passed a polygraph test arranged by a UFO organization, Klass learned that Walton dictated to the examiner what questions would be asked. Further investigation by Klass led him to an earlier unpublished polygraph test of Walton, conducted by Jack McCarthy, one of the top polygraph examiners in Arizona. McCarthy gave Klass his assessment of Walton’s story: “Gross deception!” He added that Walton employed polygraph countermeasures, such as holding his breath.

Here is more,... http://www.skepticbl...detection-test/
Thanks for posting that Hazz, I didnt know the ins and outs of that test

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#273    psyche101

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 02:32 AM

View PostDetective Mystery 2013, on 29 March 2013 - 08:04 AM, said:

The sources are believable. They can't all be wrong. In fact, it would be less likely that *all* of them were wrong than *some* of them were right. It's a bit too convenient and handy to discount all accounts.

I have no doubt many people believe their own interpretation, that does not mean they were right to begin with though.

I honestly do believe you are overstating the "accounts".

Edited by psyche101, 11 April 2013 - 02:33 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#274    psyche101

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 02:38 AM

View PostDetective Mystery 2013, on 30 March 2013 - 02:19 AM, said:

Let's take it in another direction. What role does hypnotic suggestion play in recovered memories of things like abductions and SRA? Some therapists probably plant false narratives. These falsehoods become "truths" in a certain segment of alternative psychology.

There is no doubt about that.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#275    psyche101

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 02:40 AM

View PostR4z3rsPar4d0x, on 31 March 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

But why would a hypnotist implant false memories? Just to keep the person coming back to them, If so then wow.

LINK - Interesting brief overview. Rather reflects my own thoughts in fact.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#276    DONTEATUS

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 02:43 AM

Well its not all that it seems to be when we talk about memories,re-call,ect first person events.
Without many,many witnesses and actual proof,were all just something thats our sighting,opinion,Event!
Dang ITs fun to be a first person witness ! You only have yourself to debate with !

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#277    Detective Mystery 2014

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 02:51 AM

View Postconspiracy buff, on 10 April 2013 - 12:55 PM, said:

I have came across this theory in reading various books and watching various programming on the UFO topic.  It very well could be that what we call "aliens" are fallen angels that were and still are watching mankind to influence us,  That would certainly explain certain physics impossibilities like faster than light travel and being able to materialize and de-materialize at will.  Science cannot explain how these crafts can execute these things and maybe the demon explanation could be plausible.  Until there is more study done, I'm more likely to believe it is aliens with superior technology and not demons.  Anything is likely, but we need more direct proof to verify such a claim.

It probably is based on cultural perspective. It's hard for some people to accept and admit that we might not be at the top of the interstellar food chain. It's simpler to say that superior beings are demons. It's like saying that only evil beings can be more intelligent than we are. Another part of the equation is based on fear and fundamentalism. Some people are phobic when it comes to the unknown, the part of life that is out of their comfort zone. I wouldn't be surprised if Dark Ages people would refer to us as demons if we could travel back in time to show our technology to them. Our technology changes, but our mentality doesn't.

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#278    Detective Mystery 2014

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 03:01 AM

View PostR4z3rsPar4d0x, on 10 April 2013 - 02:51 PM, said:

I see now thanks for explaining that

I found a horrible example of this kind of thing in the news. It was in a story about an abortionist who allegedly murdered scores of babies at his clinic, which really and truly was a very evil place. One of his assistants killed a viable *individual*, and she said that this *individual* reminded her of an alien. On a much, much lighter note, intelligence operatives, involved in mind experiments, might have used a fetus as a model for their fake extraterrestrials.

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#279    Detective Mystery 2014

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 03:04 AM

View PostEsoteric Toad, on 10 April 2013 - 04:20 PM, said:

Not to derail but how many wrong diagnosis did Edgar Cayce give? The world will never know. Keep that in mind.

Along the same lines, how many real paranormal events remain unreported? I'm sure that more than a few professional skeptics know the partial answer to that question.

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#280    Detective Mystery 2014

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 03:07 AM

View PostFrank Merton, on 10 April 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

Lie detector tests can be useful, but so much depends on who is giving it and whether they are really neutral.

Some talk shows prove that on a routine basis. Polygraph tests can be dangerous in the wrong hands.

There is one reality with billions of versions.

#281    Detective Mystery 2014

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 03:10 AM

View PostSweetpumper, on 10 April 2013 - 06:52 PM, said:

I don't think demons would need metal balls to fly around in.

I agree with you. However, fundamentalists might say that the craft is just part of the deception.

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#282    Detective Mystery 2014

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 03:13 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 11 April 2013 - 02:32 AM, said:

I have no doubt many people believe their own interpretation, that does not mean they were right to begin with though.

I honestly do believe you are overstating the "accounts".

It doesn't mean that they were wrong. I believe that you are *under*stating the accounts....infinity! ;)

There is one reality with billions of versions.

#283    Detective Mystery 2014

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 03:45 AM

View PostDONTEATUS, on 11 April 2013 - 02:43 AM, said:

Well its not all that it seems to be when we talk about memories,re-call,ect first person events.
Without many,many witnesses and actual proof,were all just something thats our sighting,opinion,Event!
Dang ITs fun to be a first person witness ! You only have yourself to debate with !

It's best to be surrounded by skeptical witnesses with great memories. Our memories can be extremely unreliable at times. This is true even for recollections of mundane and ordinary events that occurred when we were in normal emotional states with less stress. Stress (all kinds) skews our perceptions. Severe stress can prevent us from hearing and seeing reality as it truly is. Then, there's the phenomenon of "making copies of copies" where we change recollections each time they're in our minds, and the changes often make our recollections of the events nothing like the real events, themselves. We add, subtract, alter, etc. events, or we make a xerox of a xerox until our recollections are very faded facsimiles of the original events.

There is one reality with billions of versions.

#284    psyche101

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 04:24 AM

View PostDetective Mystery 2013, on 11 April 2013 - 03:13 AM, said:

It doesn't mean that they were wrong. I believe that you are *under*stating the accounts....infinity! ;)


But better and more sound explanations exist. Why are the logically not the best course of action?

I do not believe I am understating the account, I feel you are lumping everything together, as the UFO people tend to, to come up with a heavy end result. It is anything but a true reflection of what is I feel a varied field. It is an illusion of mass, when the mass is fragmented.

If I understand correctly, you are saying what many do - in thousands, if only 1% is genuine, then we have the proof. That one who is genuine has never surfaced, despite actual and literal thousands pursuing this same ideology. That is hope. That is not a statistic in your favour. To consider it such is indeed illustrating bias. Hundreds of tales of Unicorns exist as well.

Edited by psyche101, 11 April 2013 - 04:28 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#285    Detective Mystery 2014

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Posted 11 April 2013 - 05:26 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 11 April 2013 - 04:24 AM, said:

But better and more sound explanations exist. Why are the logically not the best course of action?

I do not believe I am understating the account, I feel you are lumping everything together, as the UFO people tend to, to come up with a heavy end result. It is anything but a true reflection of what is I feel a varied field. It is an illusion of mass, when the mass is fragmented.

If I understand correctly, you are saying what many do - in thousands, if only 1% is genuine, then we have the proof. That one who is genuine has never surfaced, despite actual and literal thousands pursuing this same ideology. That is hope. That is not a statistic in your favour. To consider it such is indeed illustrating bias. Hundreds of tales of Unicorns exist as well.

With all due respect, some skepticism reaches the level of extremism when it's based on explanations that are much less likely than the events and/or stories, themselves. Occam's Razor sometimes cuts in favor of the people who have the paranormal experience. It's also too convenient to dismiss *all* stories because they don't meet some unrealistic burden of proof that often is impossible to meet. It sounds like you have to literally see it to believe it. Of course, some claims of the paranormal and conspiracies are bogus. That's probably not the case when there are multitudes of credible witnesses, though, and I don't understand why that would seem confusing to you. It's all about odds. The odds are that the experienced pilot really did see the flying saucer that was witnessed by a hundred other people at the same time, although I wasn't there at the time to see it for myself.

There is one reality with billions of versions.




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