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#166    oy-


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Posted 28 July 2004 - 12:37 AM

QUOTE (Stellar @ Jul 27 2004, 08:27 PM)
QUOTE (DrStrangelove @ Jul 27 2004, 05:31 PM)
I believe in God simply because creation needs a creator.  original.gif

So you admit that God also needs a creator?

Good question.

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Earth has inherent homelands yes,
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#167    CatAstrofix



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Posted 28 July 2004 - 11:20 AM

I've been participating in a couple of religion-threads here, mostly trying to correct ppl's impressions about christians, or christianity. It seems that it was at very least meaningless, since in the countries that most of you are (specially US) christianity is so different from what it is here.
I belong into Finnish lutherian churce. I'm what they call a list member. I'm raised as a christian, taught all the basics, but I don't participate in church-activities. I don't even go to church, except last easter I did, and some years I've gone to christmas church. I'm left to determine individually what christianity means to me, and allowed to call myself as christian, even if I didn't agree with the church about everything.
I believe, that things like 10 commandmends, or "love yourself like you love others" are really good guidelines on how to live my life. Of course I can't always follow them, not even if I wanted to, but the point is to try. I also believe in mercy and forgiving, which is necessary since I'll never be throughoutly good. I don't believe in hell, nor I believe that anyone can earn their place in heaven. I'm not even sure what I think about heaven. I don't believe in converting others. My friends are atheists, orthodox-christians, pagans and lots of other things. I have no wish to bang them on the head with the bible to save their souls. Even if I was convinced that I need to convert others, I believe that best way to do that would be thru example. "live like I do, repecting and loving ppl around you and taking care of yourself".
There are christians, telling me that if I don't truly find the way to give my life to Jesus, I will burn in hell, from their opinion what I do now is not enough. What do I care, it's their opinion. According to my beliefs they couldn't save my soul anyhow, and I won't be judged by them. There are atheists who tell me, that since I don't take bible 100% true, I can't believe any of it, and therefore I'm not truly christian. I don't care about that either, 'cause they don't define me or my beliefs.

This is the backround I base my postings on. It's what I stand for, and call myself christian. If I didn't live in Finland, and belonged to this specific church, which lets me be as I am, I don't know if I could belong into any other church, but I'd still be what I am.

Religion isn't dangerous, ppl can be. and btw, about the mass and serial killers, most of them are motivated by something else than saving souls.

#168    DrStrangelove



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Posted 28 July 2004 - 05:44 PM

So you admit that God also needs a creator?

No, silly, God itsn't the created. He doesn't need a creator. He just is God. He existed forever and will continue to do so.

Edited by DrStrangelove, 28 July 2004 - 05:44 PM.

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#169    Stellar


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Posted 28 July 2004 - 06:06 PM

He needs to have been created though... unless you admit that some things dont need to be created and they were just always there...

"I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent."


#170    Kat_Kloud


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Posted 29 July 2004 - 10:48 AM

Norman needs to take lessons from CatAstrofix.

No, silly, God itsn't the created. He doesn't need a creator. He just is God. He existed forever and will continue to do so.

And that is the stupidest thing I have ever heard (or at least in the top ten list). If someone argues that creation needs a creator, then everything must have a creator, no? I thought something could come never come from nothing?  rolleyes.gif

And if so, why isn't it possible for the universe to always have been present, in existence? The universe is infinite and has millions of stars, suns, galaxies and solar systems- And I wonder, where is god when he is busy making us and planning our destinies for us? Is he sitting in the universe?

By the way, I don't support the big bang theory, but creationism is no better than that. If creationists are going to argue that you can't get something out of nothing (the tiny speck that became the universe*- Then where the hell did God get his ingridients to make us? Did he pull them out of his butt? Thin air?

I have to agree that some of the things taught in the bible are good morals. Example: treat others as you would want to be treated, do not murder, do not lie... but there are many good morals like that from all kinds of things, not just the bible.

By the way, there's this great guy named Neo who died for the human race and fought this big bad guy named Agent Smith- Is the Matrix going to be a religion in 2000 years!?!? I seriously doubt it.

Edited by Kat_Kloud, 29 July 2004 - 01:52 PM.


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#171    Wings of Selkhet

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Posted 29 July 2004 - 08:07 PM

Is the Matrix going to be a religion in 2000 years!?!? I seriously doubt it.

Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if there aren't some crazy Matrix cults developing out there right now...

The big bang is just as improbable as creationism, because the first law of physics one learns is that energy can neither be created nor destroyed. So DrStrangeLove is right in a sense that, all the energy that exists right now always has and will continue to do so. You can't destroy it. But you can't create it. So where did it all come from? The energy/matter involved in the big bang had to come from somewhere, right?

*sigh* I guess my belief is that all the energy that exists right now always has existed. It's impossible to create energy. But I digress, because this has nothing to do with evolution.

Edited by Wings of Selkhet, 29 July 2004 - 08:08 PM.

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i carry your heart(i carry it in my heart)

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