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Do you accept the reality of AGW ?


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Poll: Do you accept the science of anthropogenic climate change ? (50 member(s) have cast votes)

Do you accept the science of anthropogenic climate change ?

  1. Yes (31 votes [60.78%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 60.78%

  2. No (20 votes [39.22%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 39.22%

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#136    Little Fish

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 03:37 PM

View PostDoug1o29, on 01 March 2013 - 01:51 PM, said:

Chill out, Bro.  This is UM!  Insults and flame baiting are a standard part of the "debating" strategy here:  make the other guy mad so he quits thinking.  I've been on sites where the kind of stuff you see here would get one banned for life.  The tactic worked quite well on me until I figured out what was going on.

Little Fish is not interested in what is actually happening with climate.  Her entire thing is antagonizing people.  All you have to do is refuse to take the bait.  I know it's sometimes tough and sometimes I still fall into the trap.

Face it:  nothing you can do, say or post are going to make a believer out of Little Fish.  Facts are irrelevant to her.
Doug
I just asked a question. in what realm, other than a religious one, does a question constitute "antagonizing, insults and flamebaiting"?

maybe I should apologise to cornelius for him insulting me?

and why don't you try to address the question instead of trying to discredit the questioner?


#137    jbondo

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 04:18 PM

Doing your own unbiased research proves that man has in fact sped up the current warming cycle and may be responsible for the planet heating up to temps unheard of. Glacial recession alone tells the story.

One of the most recent changes is the odd fluctuation of the polar jet stream. The winters are getting shorter, yet there are more severe storms as the temp hangs around that good snow making level.

I could go on and on with temp maps, etc...but unless you do it yourself, you'll never believe me. The fact is that it's happening and it's happening much faster and more severely than predictions can keep up with.

I am as conservative as they come, but I also make it a point to do my own research, especially when there are two opposing sides fighting it out. To deny that we are in serious trouble from GW and we as humans are at least partly responsible for the acceleration is blind thinking. There are obvious things going on that you have to be seeing right before your eyes.

Go do the research! Some glaciers have live feeds, so you can watch them all the time if you like.


#138    Doug1o29

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 04:47 PM

View PostBr Cornelius, on 27 February 2013 - 10:59 PM, said:

So Little Fish - how is Bill Gates killing off the world through vaccines ??
The campaign to eradicate smallpox in Africa probably unwittingly spread AIDS by the re-use of contaminated needles.  Bill Gates didn't have anything to do with that.
Doug

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Science is the father of knowledge, but opinion breeds ignorance. --Hippocrates
Ignorance is not an opinion. --Adam Scott

#139    Doug1o29

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 04:54 PM

View PostLittle Fish, on 01 March 2013 - 03:37 PM, said:

I just asked a question. in what realm, other than a religious one, does a question constitute "antagonizing, insults and flamebaiting"?
You have done so with me on other threads and I have lost my cool and done the same with you.  You're as much a part of the problem as anybody else.  Enough of the holier-than-thou attitude.

Quote

maybe I should apologise to cornelius for him insulting me?
Maybe you should.  You are deliberately eliciting that response.

Quote

and why don't you try to address the question instead of trying to discredit the questioner?
Just what question did Br. Cornelius ask?  I was addressing my remarks to him.
Doug

If I have seen farther than other men, it is because I stood on the shoulders of giants. --Bernard de Chartres
The beginning of knowledge is the realization that one doesn't and cannot know everything.
Science is the father of knowledge, but opinion breeds ignorance. --Hippocrates
Ignorance is not an opinion. --Adam Scott

#140    Little Fish

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 05:23 PM

View PostDoug1o29, on 01 March 2013 - 04:54 PM, said:

Just what question did Br. Cornelius ask?  I was addressing my remarks to him.
don't be a smart alec, your contribution was to slander and insult me with lies. the two of you are shutting down discussion with your tactics, you both know that many people won't risk voicing themselves on this forum because they would expose themselves to unwanted vitriol, and that's a failure of the moderation here, and a loss for UM.


#141    Little Fish

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 05:27 PM

View Postjbondo, on 01 March 2013 - 04:18 PM, said:

there are more severe storms as the temp hangs around that good snow making level.
severity of storms globally show no trend:

Posted Image

number of global severe storms is also flat:
Posted Image

the 2 plots in each graph are the n/s hemispheres

Edited by Little Fish, 01 March 2013 - 05:31 PM.


#142    Little Fish

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 05:38 PM

View Postjbondo, on 01 March 2013 - 04:18 PM, said:

To deny that we are in serious trouble from GW and we as humans are at least partly responsible for the acceleration is blind thinking
where is the evidence "we are in serious trouble from GW"?
how can anyone deny something which is not shown.


#143    Doug1o29

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 07:31 PM

View PostLittle Fish, on 01 March 2013 - 05:23 PM, said:

and that's a failure of the moderation here, and a loss for UM.
On that, I quite agree.  It would be a much better site if UM actually enforced its rules.
Doug

If I have seen farther than other men, it is because I stood on the shoulders of giants. --Bernard de Chartres
The beginning of knowledge is the realization that one doesn't and cannot know everything.
Science is the father of knowledge, but opinion breeds ignorance. --Hippocrates
Ignorance is not an opinion. --Adam Scott

#144    stevewinn

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 07:54 PM

View Postjbondo, on 01 March 2013 - 04:18 PM, said:

Doing your own unbiased research proves that man has in fact sped up the current warming cycle and may be responsible for the planet heating up to temps unheard of. Glacial recession alone tells the story.

One of the most recent changes is the odd fluctuation of the polar jet stream. The winters are getting shorter, yet there are more severe storms as the temp hangs around that good snow making level.

I could go on and on with temp maps, etc...but unless you do it yourself, you'll never believe me. The fact is that it's happening and it's happening much faster and more severely than predictions can keep up with.

I am as conservative as they come, but I also make it a point to do my own research, especially when there are two opposing sides fighting it out. To deny that we are in serious trouble from GW and we as humans are at least partly responsible for the acceleration is blind thinking. There are obvious things going on that you have to be seeing right before your eyes.

Go do the research! Some glaciers have live feeds, so you can watch them all the time if you like.

as it stands today its not proven man released C02 is causing global warming. they suspect, but its nothing more than that. the atmosphere is so complex only the foolhardy rush in with predictions of certainty.  the best thing about this global warming, re-branded climate change is its living History. - the models the scientist used use to predict events for periods of 3 to 5 years when these predictions didnt come true it raised questions, such as why didnt it happen, something they couldn't answer. - so what happens now, the models now predict events on times scales of hundreds of years, this way no questions will be asked or anyone held to account. a hundred years is a long time to see if the 'model' is right. - as for, there are more storms or 'strange' weather is just a trick on the human mind, if your told of more storms you start noticing storms/weather events more. -  i'll give you an example. take a rare coloured car say, Yellow. now from tomorrow, keep your eye out for a yellow coloured car, now because your looking more and paying more attention you'll see the yellow car isn't as rare as first thought.  (you get the gist)

Posted Image

British by Birth - English by the Grace of God

#145    danielost

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 09:15 PM

Man made agw, no.
Nature made agw, yes.
Does man have an effect, yes.

I am a mormon.  If I don't use mormons believe, those my beliefs only.
I do not go to church haven't for thirty years.
There are other mormons on this site. So if I have misspoken about the beliefs. I welcome their input.
I am not perfect and never will be. I do strive to be true to myself. I do my best to stay true to the mormon faith. Thank for careing and if you don't peace be with you.

#146    Doug1o29

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 09:49 PM

View PostLittle Fish, on 01 March 2013 - 05:27 PM, said:

severity of storms globally show no trend:
number of global severe storms is also flat:
I note that in both graphs, the greatest number and intensity of severe storms occurred during periods of greatest increase in global temps.  Both seem to be related to the DERIVATIVE of temperature, rather than to temperature itself.  What would that mean? When the rate of warming increases again, the number of severe storms will go up.  These make a good case for severe storms being related to warming.  And that begs the next set of graphs showing the relationship between storm numbers and intensity and the RATE of warming.  How about posting them?

I also note that in my own research involving storms in the interior of North America, the number of SMALL storms has increased significantly since 1965, while the number of SEVERE storms has actually fallen off, particularly large winter storms.  The total amount of energy in the system has increased.

Showing just large storms is cherry-picking the data; although, I doubt you were aware of doing it.  I suspect that the source you are using didn't show the small storms.
Doug

If I have seen farther than other men, it is because I stood on the shoulders of giants. --Bernard de Chartres
The beginning of knowledge is the realization that one doesn't and cannot know everything.
Science is the father of knowledge, but opinion breeds ignorance. --Hippocrates
Ignorance is not an opinion. --Adam Scott

#147    shaddow134

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 03:08 AM

http://phys.org/news...mped-earth.html

Is it possible for Mother Nature to balance things out or will she just be overwhelmed in the end ?

Edited by shaddow134, 02 March 2013 - 03:11 AM.

"Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia." - Charles Schulz

#148    Frank Merton

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 03:32 AM

Volcanoes just happen, there is of course no "Mother Nature" with some balancing act.  Otherwise Mars and Venus would be like the earth.  It may be that we've been lucky that some volcanic activity bought us a decade or so.  On the other hand, it is conceivable that such a level of volcanic activity is relatively normal, in which case the global warming we saw earlier was the aberration.

I think the first possibility is the more likely, when one looks even longer term, but time will tell.  In the meantime what do we do?

The predictions of global warming that the scare-mongering types give us are probably exaggerated, but even a few degrees in the next century will case significant problems, so it behooves us to prevent it if we can.  There is also a small but non-zero chance that we will set of processes we don't understand that will lead to runaway warming and the extinction of life (a Venus effect).

This is the sort of intervention that only government can do.  Private enterprises may be well intentioned or not, but the realities of the market are such that those who are not well-intentioned have an advantage unless offset some way.

I don't think subsidies for alternative energy sources work very well -- they end up wasting a lot of money and producing very little alternative energy.  However here and there there are exceptions.  Research support via grants to universities is a better route.  Also, of course, public resistance to change (such as resistance to offshore wind energy installations) needs to itself be resisted.


#149    Yamato

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 10:13 AM

I at first objected to the word "reality" in the title question but when I saw the question re-worded in the poll as "science" I answered Yes.  A sleight of hand.   I accept the idea of it, and the study of it, or more scientifically the hypotheses and theories.

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#150    Little Fish

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 10:52 AM

View PostYamato, on 02 March 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

I at first objected to the word "reality" in the title question but when I saw the question re-worded in the poll as "science" I answered Yes.  A sleight of hand.   I accept the idea of it, and the study of it, or more scientifically the hypotheses and theories.
the poll is skewed to illicit a yes vote, but this is what i have come to expect from the alarmists.





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