4dplane Posted November 17, 2004 #1 Share Posted November 17, 2004 (edited) Can someone please explain to me how the story of Sodom and Gomorrah in the book of Genesis has anything to do with homosexuality? I really don't think it does, to me, when Lot gave up his two daughters to the mob instead of the two Angels; it shows that one must give up his family before he gives up the Lord. Kind of like the Story of Abraham and Isaac on Mount Sinai, when god asks Abraham to murder his son. When the mob asks for the two Angels to come outside so they can rape them; this may or may not have something to do with homosexuality. Do angels have a sex? If so, how do we know the two Angels were not female? If they were female, then it would be a story about the evils of rape, and not a story about homosexuality being wrong. What am I missing? Edited November 17, 2004 by 4dplane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kikuchiyo Posted November 17, 2004 #2 Share Posted November 17, 2004 well yeah the whole story of sodom and gomorrah is a complicated one. Technically (well usually) angels are male. Also the way the mob ask for the angels is an other form for the bible to represent homosexuality, as they "compliment" them in a "odd" way. But what's more puzzling is what happens to Lot and he's daughters when they hide in the mountains. I don't think it says homosexuality is wrong i think it says promiscuity is wrong, but that's just me. I'm no theologist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tupac amaru Posted November 17, 2004 #3 Share Posted November 17, 2004 angels are male Actually Jesus indicates that Angels are sexless! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaus Posted November 17, 2004 #4 Share Posted November 17, 2004 God sent Michael to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah(2 cities?) because of all the homo's and sexual acts going on there. God doesn't like homo's or people who have sex out of wedlock. Besides the characters in the Bible dont always do whats right, especially Lot's daughters getting him drunk and... you know the rest of the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JennRose Posted November 17, 2004 #5 Share Posted November 17, 2004 There is so much about that story that conflicts with modern ideas of morality. One piece has been lifted to serve as a 'lesson'. If you take what happens in this story to be represent the "right" course of actions, then the idea of men "knowing" each other sexually is sinful. But, a better alternative is a father offering up his virgin daughters to be gang raped, or having these same daughters (when there are no men around) getting their father drunk so they can have a child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panther10758 Posted November 17, 2004 #6 Share Posted November 17, 2004 This story is indeed a strange one. The people of the city see Lot with two men (Angels) and they come to the door and ask Lot to let them out so they may "know them" which is commonly thought to be so they may have sex with them. Lot instead offers his virgin daughters to please The Lord and protect The Angels. It was common back in these times also that one treated a guest like royalty so this too falls into place at that time period strange as it may sound. Lot also knew that The Angels had come to warn Lot to get his family out because The Lord was about to destroy the two cities. This wasn't just due to homosexual relations which ran rampant in cities but all kinds of sins. God destroyed the cities because they were full of sin not just same sex relations which is common misconception. Once they leave (Lot and his family) the cities are destroyed Lot's wife disobeys God's order and looks back and turns to a Pillar of salt! This leaves Lot and his two daughters alone in the hills. The daughters believe they are the last humans on earth and that God had destroyed all humanl ife but them. The feel God would want humans to be reborn anew so they feel it is up to them to bring forth man again so man gave live a proper life. The daughters knowing their Father a decent GOOD man conspire to get him drunk and thus weaken his will. They do so and have sex with him in order to reproduce. Although an inmoral act they believe they are doing so to repopulate the earth and so this sin would be ok little did they know only the two sinful cities had been destroyed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athenian Posted November 17, 2004 #7 Share Posted November 17, 2004 (edited) What is so complicated about this story guys? Cities full of Sin=Destroyed, Obliterated, and Annihilated. And that is all you need to know... Now if homosexuality was going on in those cities and if it is a sin or not is for you to decide. You will eventually find out one day if you picked the right path and answer during the time of the Great Judgement. Edited November 17, 2004 by Athenian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TooFarGone Posted November 17, 2004 #8 Share Posted November 17, 2004 There is so much about that story that conflicts with modern ideas of morality. One piece has been lifted to serve as a 'lesson'. If you take what happens in this story to be represent the "right" course of actions, then the idea of men "knowing" each other sexually is sinful. But, a better alternative is a father offering up his virgin daughters to be gang raped, or having these same daughters (when there are no men around) getting their father drunk so they can have a child. 360208[/snapback] Yeah, this is just more proof that the bible has warped our society Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panther10758 Posted November 17, 2004 #9 Share Posted November 17, 2004 There is so much about that story that conflicts with modern ideas of morality. One piece has been lifted to serve as a 'lesson'. If you take what happens in this story to be represent the "right" course of actions, then the idea of men "knowing" each other sexually is sinful. But, a better alternative is a father offering up his virgin daughters to be gang raped, or having these same daughters (when there are no men around) getting their father drunk so they can have a child. 360208[/snapback] Yeah, this is just more proof that the bible has warped our society 360404[/snapback] A book that is basically about living a GOOD life WARPED! Now that is a reply I didnt expect lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TooFarGone Posted November 17, 2004 #10 Share Posted November 17, 2004 Yes well, the bible is kind of anti gay, which i dont agree with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus_Freak Posted November 18, 2004 #11 Share Posted November 18, 2004 Well, in Genesis, it does say that God made woman for and out of man.... not man for and out of man. I do believe God dislikes homosexuality, but it makes me mad when people say "God hates gays" because God could never hate any of His children. You could be the worst sinner in the world, and you could curse God's name every day of your life, but that would never change how much God loves you. i think that's all i have to say about that... my brain just stopped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4dplane Posted November 18, 2004 Author #12 Share Posted November 18, 2004 Where in the Bible does it say: 1) Are angels male, female or sexless? 2) Sodom and Gomorrah are full of sexual deviant acts? […] but it makes me mad when people say "God hates gays" because God could never hate any of His children. Side topic but how do you know god does not hate? I mean he is the creator of all; thus, he created hate, evil, sin as well all things good. Secondly, if you were to lock your child in a small room and turn up the heat to120 degrees, would this not be looked at as hate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus_Freak Posted November 18, 2004 #13 Share Posted November 18, 2004 God did not create evil... Lucifer did. And, of course humans could hate... but God surely could not hate any of us. He could be disappointed in us for making the wrong decisions... but not hate us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellar Posted November 18, 2004 #14 Share Posted November 18, 2004 God did not create evil... Lucifer did. Who created Lucifer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus_Freak Posted November 18, 2004 #15 Share Posted November 18, 2004 (edited) ok wait, lemme revise that.... angels can't create... only God can. but how do you create emotion, or a state of being? so yeah, God created something that became evil Edited November 18, 2004 by Jesus_Freak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unorthodox Thesis Posted November 19, 2004 #16 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Yeah, they were gay. I mean they were't petty attitude gay, I mean they were hardcore; thats why God burned them to hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing_Dumplings Posted November 19, 2004 #17 Share Posted November 19, 2004 heres a site that says god hates gays. although it uses "fag". they say they arent homophobic, but they just wish to spread the word..... yeah sure w/e. *sigh* here you are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unorthodox Thesis Posted November 19, 2004 #18 Share Posted November 19, 2004 For those of you who want to argue about gays, and the reason God does't like them, let me just stop you right there. Lets not make any arguments about this. They reason God is displeased by homosexuality is because He meant men for women, and women for men. Not homo. We should find partners of the opposite sex because thats they way we multiply in case you did't know. God commanded humans to reproduce, and you can't do that my natural means if you're gay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TooFarGone Posted November 19, 2004 #19 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Who created Lucifer? God. Lucifer was an angel who wanted to be free to do what he wished. Got said no, so Lucifer got p***ed, and God banished him to hell. Lucifer got more p***ed off at god, and became the ruler of hell. Now Lucifer does every thing in his power to p*** off god. I totally agree with what Lucifer did. Anyway................ heres a site that says god hates gays. although it uses "fag". they say they arent homophobic, but they just wish to spread the word..... yeah sure w/e. Its ignorant b******* like the ones who made that site that make me hate the world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus_Freak Posted November 19, 2004 #20 Share Posted November 19, 2004 (edited) he doesn't just want to p*** off God. He hates humans with a passion. we're another reason why he hates God too. he doesnt understand why God loves us when the majority of us don't believe in Him, and out of those who believe in Him, the majority dont even live up to what God expects. He doesnt understand why God gave us free will, and why God gave us bodies to house our souls. he dispises us for taking what he thinks that angels deserve. so now he does everything he can to corrupt us, and get us to stray from God. he's tricky too. you hafta watch out for him. ever since i was saved i started noticing how much influence he has on this world. it's terrifying. anyway... that was way off topic.. but yeah, God loves gays, he just dislikes their lifestyle choice Edited November 19, 2004 by Jesus_Freak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4dplane Posted November 19, 2004 Author #21 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Interesting stuff, it opens the door for some good discussion, but again, can any help me out with these two questions? Where in the Bible does it say: 1) Angels are male, female or sexless? 2) Sodom and Gomorrah are full of sexual deviant acts - homosexuality? Or do people just clam to know these answers without having any real biblical truth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TooFarGone Posted November 19, 2004 #22 Share Posted November 19, 2004 ^For 2) When the angels are at Lots place, the men in the village go to his house and yell"Bring out the visitors, so that we may have sex with them" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild_Woman Posted November 19, 2004 #23 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I thought we were all created equal. Except when we were created and whan people were most religious. then we were all created equal except for homosexuals and women and animals and plants and people of coloured races. do you have a feeling this is hypocritical? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kikuchiyo Posted November 19, 2004 #24 Share Posted November 19, 2004 the "god hates fags" link...that thing got me mad (mad is an understatement) in so many levels, i'm a pacifist so for something to make me mad would be something huge. First they use god to promote hate, then they blame homosexuals for the "undoing" of society, god is a character of love that's it's main message: Love, Peace and Unity... *** People often misuse the bible to oppress others, the best way ( to understand religion, according to me) is to read the bible not as a truth, but as a roman. Read it then make your own ideas, don't take what someone else say it's the truth without questioning first. 1- well angels are just named, but if i remember correctly the one in sodom had the appearance of men. (I think they can shift from "form") 2- I'd say promiscuity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverCougar Posted November 19, 2004 #25 Share Posted November 19, 2004 God did not create evil... Lucifer did. Who created Lucifer? 362438[/snapback] Aurora, Goddess of the Dawn did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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