A sermon from a Rev.

[SilverCougar]

Rev. Derrek Younger Videotapes his surmons, and shares them on the web.

What's so special about this one that got my cruel harden pagan heart beating? He speaks up for pagans. He "demistifies" us, and what we do. He even touches apon why it's wrong to say we're Satan/devil worshipers. And all the yummy goodness that we have in common. (MITHRA!! I'M TALKING TO YOU!!! WATCH THIS! ;P)

Now, he does give it to those of us (and I will admitt I had done this.. but usually when I'm so fricken fed up it's not even funny) saying that we just need to stop crying persicution... and just go about our lives. Which is something I have been trying to do... but like I said.. when I hear "You're going to hell! You're just a satan worshipper! Heathen!!" about... 2 or 3 times aday.. by about the.. second week of this.. my patience is gone. *breaths in* Must not let angrycougar out...

He also says that we need to stop saying we're not devil worshippers *AND* satanists. Simply because (And I've tried to explain this as well) Satanists don't worship satan. It's like.. a figure head.. they (from what I was told a few years back from a satanist I worked with) believe in the ever changing nature of things and how chaotic it is. Now there is alot more to that... But I don't really want to go searching for the right website by sludging through the crap and eye seering sites that are out there.

Anyways... Please, if paganism ever confused you, and neither of us who are pagans here on the boards had explained it propperly enough... I am sorry. But I do hope this fellow can help some.

[EmpressStarXVII]

Now this is what I like to hear about! Thanks for sharing this .

I actually cant think of any pagan who calls themselves devilworshipers or satanists. Most of us are offended by the comment that we are . It gets old having to explain why we aren't.

[SilverCougar]

Now this is what I like to hear about! Thanks for sharing this .

I actually cant think of any pagan who calls themselves devilworshipers or satanists. Most of us are offended by the comment that we are . It gets old having to explain why we aren't.

Oh yes it does. Just like the "you're going to hell!" thing. It's like after awhile you either want to eat faces or just.. walk away.

But then again, like I said.. Satanists don't even worship satan. *laughs* So it's just a matter of familiarizing oneself with what satanists (real.. not the misconceptionized stuff) truly believe in. And it is not the Juedao/Christian/Islamic satan.

And you are very welcomed. Like I said.. I hope this helps some. (and some people)

[AtlantisRises]

Good to here SC.

Always good t o see that people are getting a little more accepting.

Hopefully this sentiment starts to fill the rest of the religious world and people stop with being so illinformed and making foolish judgements of other beliefs

[Wolf MacCanine]

Thank you for posting this,SC.

I've never been big on sermons (having had to listen to some when I was a wee pup),yet I actually listened to every bit of this one.

[EmpressStarXVII]

I think the Rev. had a little bit of pagan in him .

[SilverCougar]

Thank you for posting this,SC.

I've never been big on sermons (having had to listen to some when I was a wee pup),yet I actually listened to every bit of this one.

Welcome Wolfy my dear! X)

Yeah.. pretty much the same. Could not hold still through one. But found myself rewinding and relistening to parts of this one to make sure I got every bit.

He is literaly the first rev.. or pastor or preist that I've ever heard actually taking the time to finding out what paganism is, and preaching how it really is.. and not all the misconseptions the others do to pass along fear. And it really hit home.

And he just might, Empress. XD He did say he wore a pentacle for a while. *laughs*

Good to here SC.

Always good t o see that people are getting a little more accepting.

Hopefully this sentiment starts to fill the rest of the religious world and people stop with being so illinformed and making foolish judgements of other beliefs

One can hope, Atlan... one can hope.

Edited February 2, 2007 by SilverCougar

[Grandpa Greenman]

Wow that was great SC. I can make use of that. If you go to his web site you can down load a transcript to print.

http://rev.dyounger.googlepages.com/transc...ing-paganis.pdf

Edited February 2, 2007 by Darkwind

[dlv]

Rev. Derrek Younger Videotapes his surmons, and shares them on the web.

Interesting, SilverCougar. Thanks for the link. But, (most) pagans didn't ask to be defended (21:20 - 21:22) by Rev. Derrek Younger, a Christian.

Edited February 2, 2007 by dlv

[SilverCougar]

Interesting, SilverCougar. Thanks for the link. But, (most) pagans didn't ask to be defended by Rev. Derrek Younger, a Christian.

You're right. I didn't ask.. Dark didn't ask.. Wolfy didn't ask... I'm sure Kissy didn't either. Nor did any other pagan I know.

So what? We didn't ask him to defend us. He's doing it on his own accord, and truthfully, you'll find that these "(most) pagans" will whole heartely thank him for it. Because it shows us that he is someone who would rather preach tolorance, and acceptance as well as encourage his congrigation(bigword!) to to more looking into things they don't understand. He wants to help ease the tension that alot of other people have placed between christians and pagans. And he is more then welcomed to do such.

If it takes a single christian pastor/rev/preist to preach this kind of tolorance and understanding... then that's one pastor/rev/preist being true to his God's word. And his words to his parish and followers will be like seeds planted into their minds. And hopefully that will sprout more tolorance.. more understanding.. and less people fearing us pagans and either trying to condemn or convert us.

So yes. Even though we never asked him to deffend us, we will thank him for it. Thank him for spreading truth and not fear. Thank him for being the one pastpr/rev/preist that dares preach about the goodness of paganism, and explain it to his followers and not the misconceptions of it to make his followers fear and hate us.

[dlv]

You're right. I didn't ask.. Dark didn't ask.. Wolfy didn't ask... I'm sure Kissy didn't either. Nor did any other pagan I know.

So what? We didn't ask him to defend us. He's doing it on his own accord, and truthfully, you'll find that these "(most) pagans" will whole heartely thank him for it. Because it shows us that he is someone who would rather preach tolorance, and acceptance as well as encourage his congrigation(bigword!) to to more looking into things they don't understand. He wants to help ease the tension that alot of other people have placed between christians and pagans. And he is more then welcomed to do such.

If it takes a single christian pastor/rev/preist to preach this kind of tolorance and understanding... then that's one pastor/rev/preist being true to his God's word. And his words to his parish and followers will be like seeds planted into their minds. And hopefully that will sprout more tolorance.. more understanding.. and less people fearing us pagans and either trying to condemn or convert us.

So yes. Even though we never asked him to deffend us, we will thank him for it. Thank him for spreading truth and not fear. Thank him for being the one pastpr/rev/preist that dares preach about the goodness of paganism, and explain it to his followers and not the misconceptions of it to make his followers fear and hate us.

I am glad this works for you. I, on the other, found the tone of that particular line a bit presumptuous, a bit patronizing.

[SilverCougar]

I am glad this works for you. I, on the other, found the tone of that particular line a bit presumptuous, a bit patronizing.

*shrugs* If that's what you found.. then I'm sorry it's not something you like. Can't please all of the people all of the time.

He wasn't patronizing anyone but people who would rather judge others on misconceptions and their own ego.

[dlv]

Can't please all of the people all of the time.

He wasn't patronizing anyone...

Exactly. One "can't please all of the people all of the time." And you are probably right that "he wasn't patronizing anyone..." But one could never be 100% sure nowadays, at least in my experience. Why did he say it, I wonder??? Is it because Christians are in the majority (and to his eyes, these poor pagans need defending)? In that tiny statement, there is so much going on, so much history... Without it, the whole sermon would've been perfect.

Edited February 2, 2007 by dlv

[SilverCougar]

You know a wise cat once said... It takes s special person to look to deeply into a rose, and see something ugly, and then ruin it for those who see the rose as something lovely.

[dlv]

You know a wise cat once said... It takes s special person to look to deeply into a rose, and see something ugly, and then ruin it for those who see the rose as something lovely.

Knowledge is a double-edged sword, and beauty is in the eye... Again, I respect your POV, don't get me wrong.

Peace to you.

[Wolf MacCanine]

Interesting, SilverCougar. Thanks for the link. But, (most) pagans didn't ask to be defended (21:20 - 21:22) by Rev. Derrek Younger, a Christian.

If you even bothered to take the time to look at the guy's credentials...you'll notice that he's not really a "Christian".He's a pagan who went through the Universal Life Church (and a couple of others) to get ordained.Just because one wears the typical "priest collar" doesn't mean that they belong to a Christian or Catholic religion...*anyone* who is ordained can wear those.Now,the Universal Life Church believes that anyone who feels the call to be ordained should be able to be ordained as a minister...no matter which religion they belong to.There have been many pagans (including myself) who went through that church to become ordained because all of the regular Christian churches will not allow anyone not of their religion to become ordained through them.

The reason that the Reverend Derreck Younger knows so much about pagans is because he has lived as one for many years.He has also taken a lot of time to study other religions,which is always a plus.Most people wouldn't bother,yet he did.This in itself rates very high in my book.

He raised some very valid points in that sermon,and the next time I have some free time I will be listening to his other sermons.I think he'll be raising some very valid points with those as well.

[dlv]

If you even bothered to take the time to look at the guy's credentials...you'll notice that he's not really a "Christian".He's a pagan who went through the Universal Life Church (and a couple of others) to get ordained.Just because one wears the typical "priest collar" doesn't mean that they belong to a Christian or Catholic religion...*anyone* who is ordained can wear those.Now,the Universal Life Church believes that anyone who feels the call to be ordained should be able to be ordained as a minister...no matter which religion they belong to.There have been many pagans (including myself) who went through that church to become ordained because all of the regular Christian churches will not allow anyone not of their religion to become ordained through them.

The reason that the Reverend Derreck Younger knows so much about pagans is because he has lived as one for many years.He has also taken a lot of time to study other religions,which is always a plus.Most people wouldn't bother,yet he did.This in itself rates very high in my book.

He raised some very valid points in that sermon,and the next time I have some free time I will be listening to his other sermons.I think he'll be raising some very valid points with those as well.

Yes, I did read his credentials; it is the reason why I added "a Christian." Since he is acting like a preacher in Christian clothing, and is actually "ordained through three entities" to act like one, he is a legal "Christian" in that particular situation. Therefore, he is also a "Christian," relatively speaking.

And yes, I agree with you that he raised some very valid points... Others have, as well.

Peace to you.

Edited February 4, 2007 by dlv

[Wolf MacCanine]

Yes, I did read his credentials; it is the reason why I added "a Christian." Since he is acting like a preacher in Christian clothing, and is actually "ordained through three entities" to act like one, he is a legal "Christian" in that particular situation. Therefore, he is also a "Christian," relatively speaking.

And yes, I agree with you that he raised some very valid points... Others have, as well.

Peace to you.

Just because one wears the typical black robes and white collar of a Christian doesn't mean that they *are* a Christian by any means though,and to call them that can be construed as an insult.Truthfully,it shouldn't matter whether or not he acts like a Christian...as long as he continues to help defuse the situation between Pagans and other religions.It is the *intent* that matters,not the look or mannerisms.

Besides...I have not seen very many Pagans stand up and make the attempt to inform those of other religions as to the true nature of the Pagan beliefs on a wide scale.I do hope that many stumble across his sermon regarding this matter...and of course I hope that many see the idiocy in automatically calling us something that we're not because of his sermon.

[dlv]

Besides...I have not seen very many Pagans stand up and make the attempt to inform those of other religions as to the true nature of the Pagan beliefs on a wide scale.

I could only speak for myself (and those pagans and/or "non-labels" I know so well, my closest friends): basically, we don't like to give advice, unless asked. We don't like to shove our belief system on anyone. This website is a free for all..., and I'm anonymous.

Even then, I don't tell people that what I actually tell them is THE only truth, absolute knowledge, reality, and so on. I usually tell them that the stuff they hear/read comes from my personal experience and practice. If they want to go into the details to really know my personal "work," then I SOMETIMES tell them that they just have to hang around me (and get to know me better)...

Edited February 5, 2007 by dlv

[Desty]

Christianity is merely a splice between paganism and judaism, so I'm not surprised at all.

As far as a christians would be concerned however, worshiping anything other then God,(and/or) Jesus, (and/or) the Holy Ghost would be as bad as worshiping the devil.

So that part of his sermon was rather constrewed. And the quote from fight club, makes me wonder if he was a christian at all? Christian priest watching Rated R movies "Fight Club"?? with nudity, profanity, violence, images of disruction??

...Well atleast he isn't raping little boys, I assume.

[dlv]

Just because one wears the typical black robes and white collar of a Christian doesn't mean that they *are* a Christian...

That's already been answered. And in this case, the quote above is very relative and uncertain because other people thought of him to be a Christian man (right away). Usually, the quote above is correct, but NOT on this case. And I don't think he was trying to deceive people by wearing his Christian "Rev" drag. He's on a Christian "Rev" gig.

...as long as he continues to help defuse the situation between Pagans and other religions.

Exactly. I agree with you, 300%. And as long as he doesn't presume to DEFEND the entire PAGAN WORLD -- to dumb it down. Some of us don't need his man-size defense. And others do, I never discounted that, whatsoever.

Edited February 5, 2007 by dlv

[Laughing Wolf]

This is an interesting topic.

However I read some of the posts on here and I can't believe that we saw the same video.

Personally, in review of this video, I think this Rev. Derrek Younger is a full fledged moron.

First off, I am a practicing Pagan. I have been a Druid for the past fourteen years.

Most of them were as a solitary practicioner; though, I have been involved with several Groves but have now co-founded our own Grove.

I found my path to be anything but linear; it has been long and winding with many different deviations but I always (naturally) found my way back to druidism.

It has been an odyssey rich with good, bad and otherwise; just like nature itself.

This being said; I do not proffess to speak of or for Pagans, other Druids or even those of our Grove.

Therefore my words on this subject, in this post, are mine and mine alone.

That being said; I found the Rev. Younger to be highly offensive in his video on demystifying Paganism.

I will cede to the point that a message of tolerance needs to be spread through-out the [religious?] community (and why stop there?) but my empathy stops there.

Rev. Younger's video is just wholly unacceptable. It was a poor quality lecture [sermon?] on the topic of tolerance spoken by someone who displayed anything but that. This is someone the entire Pagan community can do without!

In fact, I am not even sure from what community he comes?

His credentials [laugh] anyone with forty-five minutes to kill and a few bucks to burn, could earn by simply going to their websites.

Think I am kidding, do the research yourselves!

By the way; who was he speaking to in his video? Who was his audience? WHERE WAS HIS AUDIENCE?

This just goes to show you that any idiot with a webcam can make a video.

How about his lame-assed excuse for wearing Christian garb and trying to pawn it off as something universally minister(ish)?

Well, when was the last time any of you saw a Muslim dressed in a black and white cossack? Or a Buddist, Hindu or even a Rabbi?

You know; no Pagan I know wears one. The black and white cossack is EXCUSIVELY Christian.

Except for Rev. Younger who dons it simply because "he" feels it is a universal symbol for ministers.

Well, while Rev. Younger my find shelter under the Christian authority; But most of the Pagans I know, don't need it.

His body language alone speaks volumes on how he is so far removed from his material. To me Rev. Younger appears to be the type of guy who (maybe) met five Pagans in his whole life. I can go on and on, picking this moron apart but somehow it feels like kicking someone in a wheelchair, so I will just get to the point.

I think the thing that burned me up most about Rev. Younger's video was his condecending tone.

How did you like the part where he finally turned on us? Come on now, you had to see that comming.

He spends twenty minutes chiding Christians for persecuting Pagans and then lashes out at Pagans for persecuting Satanists.

I see, so now Rev. Younger has himself created a hierarchy. See where he puts himself? At the top of course.

Remember, he "use to" wear a pentagram. Now I guess his message to us lowley Pagans is if we just listen to "his tune" we can end up on top, like him.

In Rev. Younger's little world [with no audience] he was once a Pagan but now has "elevated", evolved into a higher being. He now lives lofty above us, above Christians and in fact above everybody. You see according to Rev. Younger, we are all little clay figureens in his little nativity set. "Shame on you Christians for chiding those harmless Pagans!" And shame on you Pagans for chiding those Satanists!"

If he were to speak like that at our Grove, there would've been a riot! In two minutes, he would've been hung up on our maypole by his underwear (laugh).

Relax! I am kidding; but that kind of speech laced with vitriolic hatred and condescention against ANYBODY would and should NOT be tolerated. Especially in the Pagan community. This is but a mere glimpse into the delusional world of Rev. Younger we see in his video.

Now I ask of you beautiful Pagan people; do we need the Rev. Youngers' of the world speaking for us?

Love, Light and Charm,

Laughing Wolf

[SilverCougar]

However, when he rounded on pagans for going against satanists, he is correct in the sence that there are a rather large amount of pagans who don't know what Satanism is about, and it's in human nature to rip on something you don't understand.

We as pagans should know this all to well.

His tone comes off as one who is sick and tired of the hypocrasy shown when the few christians out there who rag on pagans for the same things their god once demanded of his followers.

Was that a good tone to take? That depends on the listener. I understood where he was comming from, simply because I also amd tired of being ragged on, being called a devil worshiper, a satanist (I do know what satanism is... however, I am not one.). Tired of being told I'm going to hell, when I don't even believe in that theology.

He makes some very valid points though. Where is it ok for those few christains who say we pagans are evil because we perform "human sacrifices." when we don't.. yet their god demands such a thing? They don't either.. but still just because at one time pagans used to... the same thing goes for those in the abrahamic faiths. They also performed human sacrifices. (but pagans are evil for it I guess...)

Do we need him? Not.. really.However it is nice to have someone stand up to say "Hey listen. This is what paganism is. And this is what paganism is not." And you, my sweet wolf, are welcomed to do the same in your own way, and your own tone. And I will be right there to back you up as well.

[texasgirlheather]

I have read before in a few different places that satanists don't set out to worship Satan. I am under the impression that satanists actually worship human nature. The human mind, ego, and personality are the things that they will tell you they worship. Is that correct, or not? They differ from pagans in that pagans worship nature and the elements. Do I have this correct in a nutshell, or no?

Edited February 20, 2007 by texasgirlheather

[SilverCougar]

I have read before in a few different places that satanists don't set out to worship Satan. I am under the impression that satanists actually worship human nature. The human mind, ego, and personality are the things that they will tell you they worship. Is that correct, or not? They differ from pagans in that pagans worship nature and the elements. Do I have this correct in a nutshell, or no?

You are correct as that they believe in human nature, and that humans are their own gods. Satan is just a figure head to be a symbol for human carnal nature.

As for them being pagans. I guess it depends on the satanist. If they consider themselves pagans, then hey.. who's to stop them? If not.. then they're just who they are.