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Tony Abbott's climate change plan


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#16    psyche101

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Posted 08 February 2010 - 05:04 AM

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Hi Psyche,

GEE I dunno!!! maybe they lost all their funding? Less money, more money, enough or not enough, it's the scam that is at the root of our environmental problems right now!
The monetary system has reached it's use by date..It's not about accomplishing more for less anymore in my opinion. Even when a great policy is introduced, try and deal with the minions called Councils to get funded for setting up REAL grass roots projects. Clover Moore just spent a million bucks on a bike path from surry hills to the opera house, complete with inedible shrubs and park benches as part of the city's s'sustainable Sydney' project...In the same breath a fully up and running voluntary community garden was 'dismantled' to make way for yet more development. It's all a bunch of bull and you know what i'm saying is true right?
It's the whole system, it's incredibly flawed. We can accomplish the same result for no money all. We could just do the right thing for the environment right now. Just do it!..without our politicians, just because it needs to be done, using the knowledge, technology and resources we have right now. Unite and do it.
Politicians are the puppets, the managers of a system that has no substance to it at all. The polling booth is a sad distraction, a make-shift delusion, a spectacle - that relies on us believing a particular set of political beaurocrats can actually make life better for a population and that the people have real power to make positive changes through governments. We don't, we have no power through governments at all. Money is the ruler of our lives so mesmerised are we. The banks aren't serving us anymore, we are serving them and saving the environment is expensive!!! haven't you heard?
- Look at the whole picture, go right back into the history of the economic and political world. Look at the patterns, they're repetitive and predictable - just like the stock markets, You can predict war through the stock markets.
it's a big farce and i don't even think it's a conspiracy anymore. I think it's just ignorance, arrogance, and fear of change.
Just like in the matrix, we are born feeding this system our lives in return for our birthrights.
We nurture a world system intsead if it nurturing the earth and us in return. there is no cyclical giving or regeneration. It's all take and it's eaten itself.
The only reason i vote is to bring in the lessor of two evils it seems  Rudd is fine for now, i prefer him to Abbott he seems a little unhinged to me, it's his energy...Costello was better actually. (hehe Abbott and Costello)
It's no use fighting it either, we just have to turn away from all this madness and go higher, do what has to be done.

Hi illuminol

Thank you very much, and I have to agree, a sensible evaluation of the current status of the nation, I also agree with you in that we have 2 evils, picking the lesser is probably more opinion than fact as they be as bad as each other. Yep, what you are saying is all too true.

I got a little suspicious when I did not see Senator Brown falling over himself to get on this bandwagon, I figure of it was pro-active and beneficial for the environment, they would be there helping push Abbots barrow, but we only have KRudd up there saying, well, whatever Liberal says is evil, cover your ears. It seems it might be a viable solution, but not in it's present form. I like the idea of more trees in Australia. I admit, I find the proposal appealing, but only want to pay into it (via taxes) if beneficial.
I don't know if we can ever "Just do it", although I must say I do like this train of thought. Ignorance from the masses is keeping us from utilizing Nuclear Power, which we could sustain ourselves with. Every single voter seems to think that means transporting Chernobyl over here and staring it up again.
As you say, be it one or the other, we have to do what is right, that was my point in starting this thread, but I really should have realized that politics will always have a personal attachment. Sorry for being grumpy. Top post.
Cheers.

Edited by psyche101, 08 February 2010 - 05:18 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#17    psyche101

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Posted 08 February 2010 - 05:12 AM

View PostSupertramp09, on 08 February 2010 - 12:09 AM, said:

I don't trust Abbott one bit. He's a snake.

Planting trees isn't going to solve the problem, restricting the rate at which industry pollutes will. But the problem in that is, it would simply cost too much money. So, instead of doing what's right, they'll do whatever is the cheapest. In doing so, I believe, they have doomed us all.

To be honest, I don't like any politician. However, there is something about Tony that isn't quite right.


Yeah but same with KRudd. He used underhanded tactics on Twitter and Facebook to become a personal friend to over 100,000 Australians at voting time. I am ashamed to say as a nation we seem to have fallen for his "I'm your geeky mate" campaign. His model is for capping the industry, but as I showed in a personal example 2 posts back, if more money can be made up ramping up business and paying the cap, that is how business will be done. In effect, Rudds plan appears to be "pollute now, pay later." But the big question is, can we plant enough trees so that no matter what they throw into the atmosphere, we can deal with it?

Looking at Br Cornelius' post, it seems there are more questions to ask before we know if that is the case.

I will endeavor to find a Tony Abbot contact, and ask him these questions.
Thank you all.

Edited by psyche101, 08 February 2010 - 05:14 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#18    Mr Meowgi

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Posted 09 February 2010 - 01:57 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 08 February 2010 - 05:12 AM, said:

Yeah but same with KRudd. He used underhanded tactics on Twitter and Facebook to become a personal friend to over 100,000 Australians at voting time. I am ashamed to say as a nation we seem to have fallen for his "I'm your geeky mate" campaign. His model is for capping the industry, but as I showed in a personal example 2 posts back, if more money can be made up ramping up business and paying the cap, that is how business will be done. In effect, Rudds plan appears to be "pollute now, pay later." But the big question is, can we plant enough trees so that no matter what they throw into the atmosphere, we can deal with it?

Looking at Br Cornelius' post, it seems there are more questions to ask before we know if that is the case.

I will endeavor to find a Tony Abbot contact, and ask him these questions.
Thank you all.

I agree, his tactics were underhanded, however, I'd prefer that over false/misleading election promises from either party.

As for the bolded, when I worked for Conservation Volunteers Australia a few years back, most seemed to believe that if every person on earth planted 40 trees each, and those trees matured, it would reverse all the damage to the atmosphere. I don't know how true that is, but I think at least its a good place to start.


#19    cluey

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Posted 09 February 2010 - 05:57 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 03 February 2010 - 05:54 AM, said:

May I ask your opinions.

Is this going to have the effect claimed? Should we be voting this guy in?






I was listening to Kevin Rudd in parliament yesterday about this.......and basically he was saying.........with country's like China that produces like 1/3 of the emissions we produce and other country's that produce 1/10 of the emissions we do.......if we don't actively change what we produce...how can we honestly expect other counties to take us seriously....and join together to make a change......Posted Image

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#20    psyche101

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Posted 09 February 2010 - 06:34 AM

View Postcluey, on 09 February 2010 - 05:57 AM, said:

I was listening to Kevin Rudd in parliament yesterday about this.......and basically he was saying.........with country's like China that produces like 1/3 of the emissions we produce and other country's that produce 1/10 of the emissions we do.......if we don't actively change what we produce...how can we honestly expect other counties to take us seriously....and join together to make a change......Posted Image


Hi Cluey

I think that is wrong, I am pretty sure China creates a great deal more Greenhouse gasses than we do, but he is saying as a first world country, we need to lead by example.
Per capita, I believe we have a high output, but globally, we produce one of the smaller percentages. About 1.4 per cent of global greenhouse gasses.
Problem is, the Asian countries are older than us, and do not give a hoot for our examples re: Whaling. They have not taken any of our greenhouse measures to date seriously either.

Like I say, I am 100% positive that business will treat caps as a business decision, not a limit. I think KRudds hoopla about a big group hug and it all goes away is just muddying the waters.

It would be great to see a third major group to keep the other two honest. What I find frustrating is for all these ideas. Nobody is explaining them, they just want us to believe either Kevin or Tony.

What I like about this idea is that the trees are in charge of the carbon levels, not man.

I want to now if it will work, and why and how effective it would be.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#21    psyche101

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Posted 09 February 2010 - 06:38 AM

View PostSupertramp09, on 09 February 2010 - 01:57 AM, said:

I agree, his tactics were underhanded, however, I'd prefer that over false/misleading election promises from either party.

Id love to see a new player upset the apple cart with honesty.

View PostSupertramp09, on 09 February 2010 - 01:57 AM, said:

As for the bolded, when I worked for Conservation Volunteers Australia a few years back, most seemed to believe that if every person on earth planted 40 trees each, and those trees matured, it would reverse all the damage to the atmosphere. I don't know how true that is, but I think at least its a good place to start.


Interesting. I will have a look around and see if that can be confirmed. That would be 240 billon trees. Who knows?

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#22    psyche101

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Posted 09 February 2010 - 06:57 AM

I have found the address, and emailed Tony Abbott. We can only await a reply now to see if he wishes to address these concerns from a citizen.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.





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