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sandy hook "exposed"?


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#571    Babe Ruth

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:05 PM

Holy Cow Horace, they even had 2 dressed up as nuns! :cry:

As time goes on and more is discovered, it is harder and harder to believe the OCT.

Now it seems Carver was right in the middle of it.  How long had it been planned?


#572    Tiggs

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:34 PM

View PostAsteroidX, on 20 March 2013 - 08:05 PM, said:

He did not say the parents have requested he not disclose these reports. Nor is this a common circumstance.

Perhaps you didn't read the second sentence of my post, given that I added it after only originally posting the first - but, as per the letter I've linked - he didn't request the legislation, and believed the bill to be legally unnecessary.


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#573    ouija ouija

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:43 PM

View PostTiggs, on 20 March 2013 - 07:57 PM, said:

As per the Bill Summary - The bill was raised to allow the parents of a child who was a homicide victim to request that the autopsy report not be publicly disclosed.

However - Dr Carver didn't ask for the legislation and actually sent the Senate a letter stating that it was unnecessary.

Thanks for that information and the links.

Dr.Carver states that the Chief Medical Office does not make public the autopsies of homicide victims because they are very conscious of protecting the privacy of grieving relatives. Therefore, he says, the proposed bill is redundant ....... HOWEVER, what the new bill does do is override this section of the previous statutory and regulatory scheme:
' 3) Under seperate statutory provisions autopsy reports are available to the general public if the decedent was in the custody of the state at the time of the death.'

The pupils at the Sandy Hook school were in the custody/care of the state at the time of their death ...... yes?

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#574    Tiggs

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:48 PM

View Postouija ouija, on 20 March 2013 - 08:43 PM, said:

Thanks for that information and the links.

Dr.Carver states that the Chief Medical Office does not make public the autopsies of homicide victims because they are very conscious of protecting the privacy of grieving relatives. Therefore, he says, the proposed bill is redundant ....... HOWEVER, what the new bill does do is override this section of the previous statutory and regulatory scheme:
' 3) Under seperate statutory provisions autopsy reports are available to the general public if the decedent was in the custody of the state at the time of the death.'

The pupils at the Sandy Hook school were in the custody/care of the state at the time of their death ...... yes?
No.

Custody of the state is a legal term that actually means that the State are a child's designated parents - such as orphaned children.

Not that they're attending school.


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#575    AsteroidX

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:54 PM

Quote

The pupils at the Sandy Hook school were in the custody/care of the state at the time of their death ...... yes?

Good question

But then also what is the standard for other states ?


#576    Babe Ruth

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:59 PM

I think if one is attending a public school, one is at least temporarily in the custody of the state.  Examples are numerous.

If a school is 'locked down', does the individual child have the option of walking out?  I don't think so.


#577    ouija ouija

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:08 PM

View PostTiggs, on 20 March 2013 - 08:48 PM, said:

No.

Custody of the state is a legal term that actually means that the State are a child's designated parents - such as orphaned children.

Not that they're attending school.

Hmm, I have an idea that that isn't the case over here(don't know for sure). So when the children are in school, whose responsibility are they?

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#578    Tiggs

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:25 PM

View Postouija ouija, on 20 March 2013 - 09:08 PM, said:

Hmm, I have an idea that that isn't the case over here(don't know for sure).
In the UK, they're more commonly called Wards of the State.

Quote

So when the children are in school, whose responsibility are they?
Physical care is not the same as legal custody.

The school can't authorize any legal decisions on your child's behalf.

They can't, for example, make the legal decision to give your son a blood transfusion if you're a practicing Jehovah's witness just because he's on school premises.


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#579    AsteroidX

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:27 PM

But they can seek medical care for them in case of emergency. I remember signing that form for my child. So there was still no assistance offered per Connecticut :aw and First responders were available to determine need and triage. Even death. A LEO cannot declare someone dead.


#580    Kowalski

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:31 PM

Quote

Autopsies are conducted by a coroner, medical examiner or forensic pathologist in the state of Texas. The Texas Public Information Act deems autopsies public information. Anyone can request an autopsy report.

That's what my state says anyway...




#581    AsteroidX

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:37 PM

Oregons seems more similar to Connecticut so its not unique.

Quote


Oregon State Medical Examiner Laws state: "Any parent, spouse, sibling, child or personal

representative of the deceased, or any person who may be criminally or civilly liable

for the death, or their authorized representatives respectively, or those within

the bounds of the Protection and Advocacy for Individuals with Mental Illness Act,

may examine and obtain copies of any medical examiner's report, autopsy report or

laboratory test report ordered by a medical examiner under ORS 146.117."




#582    ouija ouija

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:47 PM

View PostTiggs, on 20 March 2013 - 09:25 PM, said:

In the UK, they're more commonly called Wards of the State.


Physical care is not the same as legal custody.

The school can't authorize any legal decisions on your child's behalf.

They can't, for example, make the legal decision to give your son a blood transfusion if you're a practicing Jehovah's witness just because he's on school premises.

Sorry to keep labouring this point, but surely when children are in school the teachers, as representatives of the state, have a duty of care to the children, they are in loco parentis? The children are literally in their custody, they make decisions as to where the children can go in the building and who they can go with; if there is an emergency they decide what action to take regarding the children   ...... if I was a lawyer I would have a good go at making that interpretation of 'custody' in a court of law! At the very least, that paragraph has been rather sloppily worded.  It only says 'custody' not 'legal custody'.

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#583    Tiggs

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:47 PM

View PostAsteroidX, on 20 March 2013 - 09:27 PM, said:

But they can seek medical care for them in case of emergency. I remember signing that form for my child. So there was still no assistance offered per Connecticut :aw and First responders were available to determine need and triage. Even death. A LEO cannot declare someone dead.
There's no official confirmation that I'm currently aware of - but I expect you'll find that multiple rounds from an assault rifle at close range to the torso and the head would mean that most of the children were transected and/or decapitated.


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#584    AsteroidX

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:51 PM

Thats a grizzly thought. But yes I agree. But were ALL of them ? Was the shooter ?


#585    ouija ouija

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 10:08 PM

Getting back on track: if the Chief Medical Officer/Office says that the new bill is unnecessary, who was it who introduced the bill in the first place and more importantly, why? And why did others involved in the passage of the bill go against the suggestion of the Chief Medical Officer?

Why limit the bill to to under 18's? Do those connected to older victims not need protection too(if you're going to go down that road)?

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