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Capital Punishment - For or against?


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#46    mysticwerewolf

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:08 AM

a lot of people don't   agree with me and that is their right. who knows maybe they are right.
but at the same time
The green rivers killers victims didn't deserve to die, the pig farmers victims didn't deserve to die, the children in puyallup wa who were beaten and burned to death last year because their father was hounded by police and the new corps didn't deserve to die, the young lady  who was shot down by a gang  banger  in seattle a while back didn't deserve to die.  why should their killers live getting three squares a day and a pool table and a gym  and books and  all the stuff they get at the tax payers expense?


#47    Knight Of Shadows

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:24 AM

strict punishment makes the criminals think twice before commiting a crime
more importantly should they do it .. they won't have the chance to do it again
truth to be told .. the world would be better off without them

by the name of Allah the Gracious the Merciful
Say, "I seek refuge in the Lord of daybreak From the evil of that which He created
And from the evil of darkness when it settles And from the evil of the blowers in knots
And from the evil of an envier when he envies"
truthful was Allah The Most High And Great


#48    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:24 AM

View Postpallidin, on 05 February 2013 - 04:01 AM, said:

BM, I think you're misuderstanding my position.

Ok then, let's see..

Quote

   I am against Capital punishment by any country.

As you casn see, you are against it done legally by law

Quote

  But if I come up against someone brutally rapping my daughter, and if to stop it requires lethal force, yes, I will do it.

  
And in this instance, you would kill the criminal illegally if you had to.. You should think more about this... IF some mad man brutally raped and killed your daughter, you would rather you kill him than the law doing it instead.. It is clear what you have said..  I too would want to kill anyone who took my kids, raped them and took their lives away ..Of course I would.. BUT I  would not be against capital punishment, because in that case, it would be hypocritical of me ...

Quote

I see absolutely no contradiction there, because they are wholly different circumstances.

I call it being most ironic

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 05 February 2013 - 10:28 AM.

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#49    AsteroidX

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:25 AM

Im completely for the death penalty for child molesters and serial killers.


#50    Bonecrusher

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:08 PM

I need to clarify my position here because my reasons are totally non- religious.
Who honestly needs the scriptures and the Bible when all is required is a little bit of common sense.

Tbh capital punishment is one the biggest questions when it comes to morals and morality.
I'm just glad I'm here to get the opportunity to answer it.
Here's a little factoid to disgest....
I was the one who initiated this debate in the forum that refuses to be named.
The Chav hating one that you'll never guess the name of even in a million years.
But by that time the trolls had moved on because it was subscription only.

Btw death penalty for any kind of drug peddling and I can't emphasis this better is total overkill.
There's also this ridiculous law where Brits can be done for treachery to the UK.
Whether the coalition have repealed it is anybody's guess.


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#51    GreenmansGod

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 07:56 PM

View PostKnight Of Shadows, on 05 February 2013 - 10:24 AM, said:

strict punishment makes the criminals think twice before commiting a crime
more importantly should they do it .. they won't have the chance to do it again
truth to be told .. the world would be better off without them


But capital punishment doesn't prevent crime.  Criminals don't think they are going to get caught, so they do the crime no matter what the punishment is.

http://www.deathpena...er-murder-rates

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#52    ouija ouija

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 08:04 PM

View PostDarkwind, on 05 February 2013 - 07:56 PM, said:

But capital punishment doesn't prevent crime.  Criminals don't think they are going to get caught, so they do the crime no matter what the punishment is.

http://www.deathpena...er-murder-rates

That's not really something that can be quantified ....... who knows how many people have not committed a serious crime because they definitely don't want to go to prison? There aren't any figures for that, are there?

Also, the link that you gave includes some odd, unconvincing(IMO), statistics, plus a statement that I don't believe is true: " 'revenge'(i.e. capital punishment), won't help the victims' families". I'm willing to bet that if you asked them, the vast majority of family members would say they feel a whole lot better once the murderer is dead!

Edited by ouija ouija, 05 February 2013 - 08:14 PM.

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#53    GreenmansGod

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 08:17 PM

Did you look at the site I posted?  More than likely not. It shows the murder rates consistently lower in states without capital punishment. So I repeat, capital punishment doesn't prevent crime.

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#54    CRIPTIC CHAMELEON

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 08:31 PM

Hmm I'm not into capital punishment but instead of sending some of these criminals/repeat criminals to the hilton hotel for R & R I do believe we should make it harsher for them.


#55    Goblin-5

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 09:05 PM

View PostCRIPTIC CHAMELEON, on 05 February 2013 - 08:31 PM, said:

Hmm I'm not into capital punishment but instead of sending some of these criminals/repeat criminals to the hilton hotel for R & R I do believe we should make it harsher for them.

You mean something like exile to Devils Island? I think that would be illegal under international law wouldn't it? Cruel and unusual punishment or some such?
Capital punishment or any punishment for that matter is hardly a deterrent to career criminals. It is the potential cost of doing business (anyone remember the opening dialogue of the old BBC series "Porridge"?) and a cost that is unlikely to be born out, given the low detection/conviction rates.
Death will not deter crimes of passion when one is not thinking rationally, and frankly, if you cold bloodedly set out to take a life or multiple lives by whatever means (bomb, gun, knife, missile), then surely you know that you own life would be forfeit should you be caught? Equally though, as I said, if you deliberately cause someone to be convicted of a capital crime due to commission or active omission then the same penalty should be applied to you (and that includes judges who are supposedly learned and impartial arbiters and yet who are unable to be called to account for their actions).
Something else that I think needs to be questioned is the role of a jury in a trial. They are mushrooms, forbidden to take any active part in a trial, denied access to a ton of information and then called upon to decide someones fate. I think there is scope for a far more active role to be played on the part of the ultimate judges... the defendants peers on the jury.

Edited by Goblin-5, 05 February 2013 - 09:09 PM.


#56    ouija ouija

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 09:29 PM

View PostDarkwind, on 05 February 2013 - 08:17 PM, said:

Did you look at the site I posted?  More than likely not. It shows the murder rates consistently lower in states without capital punishment. So I repeat, capital punishment doesn't prevent crime.

There's no need to be rude. Of course I looked at the link you posted, that's why I commented on it! The actual difference in numbers between states with capital punishment and those without, seems to be so slight as to not be worth mentioning.

And how exactly do you 'divide the number of murderers, by the total population'? That indicates that there are more murderers than general populace!

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#57    praetorian-legio XIII

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:14 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 05 February 2013 - 10:24 AM, said:

Ok then, let's see..



As you casn see, you are against it done legally by law


And in this instance, you would kill the criminal illegally if you had to.. You should think more about this... IF some mad man brutally raped and killed your daughter, you would rather you kill him than the law doing it instead.. It is clear what you have said..  I too would want to kill anyone who took my kids, raped them and took their lives away ..Of course I would.. BUT I  would not be against capital punishment, because in that case, it would be hypocritical of me ...



I call it being most ironic


He was referrng to stopping it in progress not seeking revenge or justice afterward.


#58    praetorian-legio XIII

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:27 PM

I am all for it.

If you take a life, you forfeit your own. It shouldn't matter if its a cop or just an average joe. There is no justice when a family has lost a member and the murderer is sitting in a prison eating good food, watching TV, with available dental and medical services, with visiting rights with their own families.

Crime requires punishment. IMO.


#59    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:19 PM

View Postpraetorian-legio XIII, on 05 February 2013 - 10:14 PM, said:

He was referrng to stopping it in progress not seeking revenge or justice afterward.

He said he would kill  if someone raped his daughter.. That indeed is revenge.  See a previous post of his below..


View Postpallidin, on 04 February 2013 - 04:39 PM, said:

For myself, I'm against the death penalty handed down by a government court.

Curiously enough, I'm somewhat OK with, say, my shooting to kill someone molesting my daughters, or raping someone else, or a bad hostage situation, etc...

Yea I think that does spell revenge..Also known as vigilantism. If you followed his posts from the beginning, you will see he did indeed mean revenge .Anyone who kills another because they raped their daughters, is out for their own kind of justice and revenge..They are not doing it for the sheer hell of it..

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 05 February 2013 - 11:30 PM.

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#60    Mr Right Wing

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:25 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 04 February 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

Posted Image
Legend


***** Abolished for all crimes

****** Abolished for all crimes except under exceptional/special circumstances (such as crimes committed in wartime)

****** Abolished in practice (under a moratorium or haven't used capital punishment in at least 10 years)

****** Retainers of the death penalty

There is more to read on this, including a full table of the countries who use capital punishment ( death penalty ) for various crimes .. You can see those listed in the table
Click here -> http://en.wikipedia....ment_by_country


I am interested in seeing how both religious and non religious feel towards the capital punishment... Is it totally wrong? OR is it acceptable depending on the crime?   ALSO - Should the death penalty never have existed?  If it should never have existed, why is that?   And on the other hand  - If it should have existed, why is that?

UK - Abolished for all crimes except treason and witchcraft.

I'm all for execution for any criminal who would have got 5+ years in prison.

Edited by Mr Right Wing, 05 February 2013 - 11:26 PM.





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