Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


* * * * * 1 votes

I Am Bradley Manning


  • Please log in to reply
170 replies to this topic

#136    Kowalski

Kowalski

    The Original Penguin Conspiracy Theorist

  • Member
  • 4,102 posts
  • Joined:14 Mar 2013
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:* Madgascar *

  • It's All Some Kind Of Wacked Out Conspiracy....

Posted 23 August 2013 - 04:53 PM

Quote

Libertarian Texas congressman Ron Paul spoke to Larry King on a new episode of Politicking, advocating an end to the surveillance programs exposed over recent months and calling for former Army Private Bradley Manning's immediate release from prison.

Quote

Paul, who conducted an "Ask Me Anything" session Thursday on the social news site Reddit, is perhaps best known as the perennial presidential hopeful who has advocated for a deregulated free market economy and drastic cuts in US foreign aid. He recently launched the Ron Paul Channel, an online news network that will air three 30-minute shows each week.  

Quote

Most military personnel who are caught committing war crimes never receive any penalties,” Paul said in the Reddit question-and-answer session. “I think he should be released now, [and] that he has done us a great service by letting the people know the truth.”

Link:  http://rt.com/usa/larry-king-ron-paul-875/

He tells it like it is! :)

Edited by Kowalski, 23 August 2013 - 04:53 PM.


#137    Babe Ruth

Babe Ruth

    Non-Corporeal Being

  • Member
  • 7,979 posts
  • Joined:23 Dec 2011
  • Gender:Not Selected
  • Location:27North 80West

Posted 24 August 2013 - 01:54 PM

View PostTiggs, on 23 August 2013 - 02:08 PM, said:

* Sighs *

The judge, Army Col. Denise Lind, began deliberating Friday after closing arguments brought to an end the nearly two-month trial. Manning asked for a military judge, rather than a jury, to hear his case.

Source: CBS news



Probably helps, of course, that Manning actually pleaded guilty to most of the charges, too.

Bravo Tiggs, Manning chose not to have a jury.  I stand corrected, happily.

Now if only you would be equally candid in engaging in hypothetical question discussions.....


#138    Tiggs

Tiggs

    Relax. It's only me.

  • 8,942 posts
  • Joined:30 Jan 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Orange County, California

  • Universe Service Pack 2 still needs patching.

Posted 24 August 2013 - 04:13 PM

As usual, BR, any message that you're trying to convey to me has got buried beneath your ad hominem attacks. I have absolutely no idea what it is that you're trying to imply.


"What happens when an irresistible force meets an immovable object?" - Tiggs vs PA - Did Jesus Really exist? - The Formal Debate:
HERE
Posted Image


#139    Leonardo

Leonardo

    Awake

  • Member
  • 14,876 posts
  • Joined:20 Oct 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK

  • Hell is a guilty conscience

Posted 24 August 2013 - 04:28 PM

View PostTiggs, on 23 August 2013 - 04:25 PM, said:

Aside from the obvious direct US casualties caused via it's sponsored terrorist groups such as Hezbollah, Hamas (and on occasion - Al Qaeda), the most immediate danger to the US is Iran's program to create nuclear weapons and it's expected delivery of those weapons to it's sponsored terrorist groups in strategic locations throughout the globe.

There is no direct evidence that Iran's nuclear program includes weaponisation. While the IAEA has not inspected all Iranian nuclear sites, what inspections they have carried out provide no cause for alarm along those lines.

If the US has specific information that an Iranian weaponisation program is in place, they should release that information to justify their bellicosity. Otherwise, the pursuit of nuclear technology for the purpose of power generation is within the rights of the Iranian State to pursue, being signatory to the NPT.

Project Koussar is irrelevant unless there is proof Iran is actively seeking the weaponisation of nuclear technology.

Basically, the US should put up, or shut up.

As for Iran's sponsored terrorism...

Quote

The circumstances that have led to Iran's hatred of the US is the US's attempts to interfere with Iran's government, both during world War 2 and after, by installing a US friendly regime and then backing Iraq to fight Iran in the Iraq/Iran war, after the Iranian revolution.

Personally, although I deplore they have resorted to violence, I can understand why Iran chooses this method of response to the violent US intrusion (and revolution is very violent) into their sovereign affairs. Additionally, with US foreign policy attempting to isolate Iran and surround it with US-backed or friendly nations, I can make analogies between their situation and that of Israel. So, will you be as forthright in your condemnation of that State and it's actions to defend it's sovereignity?

Don't blame Iran for America's troubles when those troubles are of America's making. Instead of trying to isolate and marginalise Iran, America should recognise it's role in making Iran what it is today and look to a peaceful resolution with, first off, an apology for it's past actions.

Edited by Leonardo, 24 August 2013 - 04:29 PM.

In the book of life, the answers aren't in the back. - Charlie Brown

"It is a profound and necessary truth that the deep things in science are not found because they are useful; they are found because it was possible to find them."  - J. Robert Oppenheimer; Scientific Director; The Manhattan Project

"talking bull**** is not a victimless crime" - Marina Hyde, author.

#140    Tiggs

Tiggs

    Relax. It's only me.

  • 8,942 posts
  • Joined:30 Jan 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Orange County, California

  • Universe Service Pack 2 still needs patching.

Posted 24 August 2013 - 05:51 PM

View PostLeonardo, on 24 August 2013 - 04:28 PM, said:

There is no direct evidence that Iran's nuclear program includes weaponisation. While the IAEA has not inspected all Iranian nuclear sites, what inspections they have carried out provide no cause for alarm along those lines.
Well, one of us is definitely living in an alternate Universe, then.

From the BBC:

The UN's nuclear watchdog says it has information indicating Iran has carried out tests "relevant to the development of a nuclear explosive device".

In its latest report on Iran, the IAEA says the research includes computer models that could only be used to develop a nuclear bomb trigger.


Quote

As for Iran's sponsored terrorism...

Personally, although I deplore they have resorted to violence, I can understand why Iran chooses this method of response to the violent US intrusion (and revolution is very violent) into their sovereign affairs. Additionally, with US foreign policy attempting to isolate Iran and surround it with US-backed or friendly nations, I can make analogies between their situation and that of Israel. So, will you be as forthright in your condemnation of that State and it's actions to defend it's sovereignity?
Is Turkey lobbing mortars into Iran's cities on a regular basis? Is Pakistan calling for Iran's utter destruction? Is Turkmenistan putting bombs on buses to kill Iranian children?

Because, if not - then there's probably a difference between Iran and Israel's position.


Quote

Don't blame Iran for America's troubles when those troubles are of America's making. Instead of trying to isolate and marginalise Iran, America should recognise it's role in making Iran what it is today and look to a peaceful resolution with, first off, an apology for it's past actions.
Perhaps you missed the link I posted showing that Iran was instrumental in assisting Al Qaeda's destruction of the twin towers.  

As such - I expect you'll find that apologising to Iran is pretty much the last thing on the American diplomacy "To do" list.


"What happens when an irresistible force meets an immovable object?" - Tiggs vs PA - Did Jesus Really exist? - The Formal Debate:
HERE
Posted Image


#141    and then

and then

    Abyssus Abyssum Invocat

  • Member
  • 12,880 posts
  • Joined:15 Dec 2011
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Land's End

  • Because what came before never seems enough...

Posted 25 August 2013 - 05:37 AM

View PostLeonardo, on 24 August 2013 - 04:28 PM, said:

There is no direct evidence that Iran's nuclear program includes weaponisation. While the IAEA has not inspected all Iranian nuclear sites, what inspections they have carried out provide no cause for alarm along those lines.

If the US has specific information that an Iranian weaponisation program is in place, they should release that information to justify their bellicosity. Otherwise, the pursuit of nuclear technology for the purpose of power generation is within the rights of the Iranian State to pursue, being signatory to the NPT.

Project Koussar is irrelevant unless there is proof Iran is actively seeking the weaponisation of nuclear technology.

Basically, the US should put up, or shut up.

As for Iran's sponsored terrorism...



Personally, although I deplore they have resorted to violence, I can understand why Iran chooses this method of response to the violent US intrusion (and revolution is very violent) into their sovereign affairs. Additionally, with US foreign policy attempting to isolate Iran and surround it with US-backed or friendly nations, I can make analogies between their situation and that of Israel. So, will you be as forthright in your condemnation of that State and it's actions to defend it's sovereignity?

Don't blame Iran for America's troubles when those troubles are of America's making. Instead of trying to isolate and marginalise Iran, America should recognise it's role in making Iran what it is today and look to a peaceful resolution with, first off, an apology for it's past actions.
So you agree that America and or Israel should be justified in totally annihilating Iran if you are wrong and Iran in fact DOES assemble and use a nuclear weapon?  Or would you , even then, say we had it coming?

  Imagination is the power in the turn of a phrase.

#142    DieChecker

DieChecker

    I'm a Rogue Scholar

  • Member
  • 16,287 posts
  • Joined:21 Nov 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portland, Oregon, USA

  • Hey, I'm not wrong. I'm just not completely right.

Posted 25 August 2013 - 06:36 AM

I think it is IDIOTIC to believe that Iran is not working toward a nuclear weapon. Clearly they are working on the delievery system and the detonation system. Even if they do build a plutonium fueled medical reactor, it would take hours for them to remove some plutonium and load it into a weapon. Even if Iran uses 295 kg (of a speculated 300kg) to fuel a reactor, they could easily have 5 kg for several weapons. Each 1 kg weapon being rated at 10 kilotons or more. Each would be very comparable to a Nagasaki/Hiroshima level explosion.

To ignore such a threat, and just hope rosy-posy that nothing happens is the height of naivety.

Edited by DieChecker, 25 August 2013 - 06:38 AM.

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

At times one remains faithful to a cause only because its opponents do not cease to be insipid. - Friedrich Nietzsche

Qualifications? This is cryptozoology, dammit! All that is required is the spirit of adventure. - Night Walker

#143    Admiral Rhubarb

Admiral Rhubarb

    An Inspiration to Millions

  • Member
  • 23,466 posts
  • Joined:09 May 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Hammerfest

  • Vampires are people too.

Posted 25 August 2013 - 06:52 AM

So what would people recommend then? Iran should be Annihilated pre-emptively, because they're Mad and Evil?

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


Posted Image


#144    DieChecker

DieChecker

    I'm a Rogue Scholar

  • Member
  • 16,287 posts
  • Joined:21 Nov 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portland, Oregon, USA

  • Hey, I'm not wrong. I'm just not completely right.

Posted 25 August 2013 - 06:56 AM

Elimination of key personnel and key facilities perhaps.

Would it be better to stop Hitler before he got into Poland, rather then wait and see?

Sure, Iran might not be a Hitler level issue, but what if it is and we did nothing?

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

At times one remains faithful to a cause only because its opponents do not cease to be insipid. - Friedrich Nietzsche

Qualifications? This is cryptozoology, dammit! All that is required is the spirit of adventure. - Night Walker

#145    Admiral Rhubarb

Admiral Rhubarb

    An Inspiration to Millions

  • Member
  • 23,466 posts
  • Joined:09 May 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Hammerfest

  • Vampires are people too.

Posted 25 August 2013 - 07:23 AM

Trouble is, you can blame GW for antipathy towards the idea of doing anything about Iran, because he said exactly the same things about Iraq, and everyone now knows (and most people knew at the time) that it was a lie. So even if the evidence about Iran may be immeasurably stronger, no one will believe it.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


Posted Image


#146    Tiggs

Tiggs

    Relax. It's only me.

  • 8,942 posts
  • Joined:30 Jan 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Orange County, California

  • Universe Service Pack 2 still needs patching.

Posted 25 August 2013 - 07:56 AM

View PostColonel Rhuairidh, on 25 August 2013 - 06:52 AM, said:

So what would people recommend then? Iran should be Annihilated pre-emptively, because they're Mad and Evil?
I have absolutely no idea what should be done. I don't see any good long term solutions that don't involve regime change, to be honest - and that's partly what started the whole mess in the first place. My best guess is that the Powers Who Be are sabotaging the nuclear program in hope that the Arab spring will finally roll into Iran before it's operational.


View PostColonel Rhuairidh, on 25 August 2013 - 07:23 AM, said:

Trouble is, you can blame GW for antipathy towards the idea of doing anything about Iran, because he said exactly the same things about Iraq, and everyone now knows (and most people knew at the time) that it was a lie. So even if the evidence about Iran may be immeasurably stronger, no one will believe it.
That is the problem with crying Wolf of Mass Destruction.


"What happens when an irresistible force meets an immovable object?" - Tiggs vs PA - Did Jesus Really exist? - The Formal Debate:
HERE
Posted Image


#147    Babe Ruth

Babe Ruth

    Non-Corporeal Being

  • Member
  • 7,979 posts
  • Joined:23 Dec 2011
  • Gender:Not Selected
  • Location:27North 80West

Posted 25 August 2013 - 01:58 PM

View PostTiggs, on 24 August 2013 - 04:13 PM, said:

As usual, BR, any message that you're trying to convey to me has got buried beneath your ad hominem attacks. I have absolutely no idea what it is that you're trying to imply.

That's why mine are not ad hominem.

IF mine were ad hominems, there would be no doubt in your non-military mind. :tu:


#148    Leonardo

Leonardo

    Awake

  • Member
  • 14,876 posts
  • Joined:20 Oct 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK

  • Hell is a guilty conscience

Posted 25 August 2013 - 02:25 PM

View Postand then, on 25 August 2013 - 05:37 AM, said:

So you agree that America and or Israel should be justified in totally annihilating Iran if you are wrong and Iran in fact DOES assemble and use a nuclear weapon?  Or would you , even then, say we had it coming?

Absolutely not.

Even if Iran does have a program for the weaponisation of nuclear technology, and actually get to the point of having a nuclear weapon, that is no justification for military intervention.

For all Tiggs accusations of Iran sponsoring terrorism, and I did not deny those accusations, has Iran EVER supplied WMD's to a terrorist organisation?

Iran's possession of nuclear weapons would effect the current status quo between Iran and Israel, and certain other of Iran's belligerent neighbours, but would not lead to the sort of "mad mullah" scenario being promoted by those nations and their Western allies. Iran already has WMD's (chemical, biological) and the addition of nuclear to this would change practically nothing.

The hyperbole surrounding Iran's presumed plan to acquire nuclear weapons technology is just that.

In the book of life, the answers aren't in the back. - Charlie Brown

"It is a profound and necessary truth that the deep things in science are not found because they are useful; they are found because it was possible to find them."  - J. Robert Oppenheimer; Scientific Director; The Manhattan Project

"talking bull**** is not a victimless crime" - Marina Hyde, author.

#149    Tiggs

Tiggs

    Relax. It's only me.

  • 8,942 posts
  • Joined:30 Jan 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Orange County, California

  • Universe Service Pack 2 still needs patching.

Posted 25 August 2013 - 04:02 PM

View PostBabe Ruth, on 25 August 2013 - 01:58 PM, said:

That's why mine are not ad hominem.

IF mine were ad hominems, there would be no doubt in your non-military mind. :tu:
I've already stated that they are ad hominems.


"What happens when an irresistible force meets an immovable object?" - Tiggs vs PA - Did Jesus Really exist? - The Formal Debate:
HERE
Posted Image


#150    Tiggs

Tiggs

    Relax. It's only me.

  • 8,942 posts
  • Joined:30 Jan 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Orange County, California

  • Universe Service Pack 2 still needs patching.

Posted 25 August 2013 - 04:17 PM

View PostLeonardo, on 25 August 2013 - 02:25 PM, said:

Absolutely not.

Even if Iran does have a program for the weaponisation of nuclear technology, and actually get to the point of having a nuclear weapon, that is no justification for military intervention.

For all Tiggs accusations of Iran sponsoring terrorism, and I did not deny those accusations, has Iran EVER supplied WMD's to a terrorist organisation?
Does Syria count?


"What happens when an irresistible force meets an immovable object?" - Tiggs vs PA - Did Jesus Really exist? - The Formal Debate:
HERE
Posted Image





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users