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Alien photos that make you go HHHMMM .......

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#76    psyche101

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:29 AM

View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 02:00 AM, said:

Forget an alien looking good, I would be suprised to see one that is even mildly human looking or humanoid looking. I would honestly be suprised if the aliens had 4 limbs or resembled any mammal we have seen on Earth. The only way that is even plausible is if they came from a planet exactly like earth, and that is still a shot in the dark IMO.

Hello Hutton.

I honestly do not believe that is that case at all. Considering convergeant evolution, the bipedal creature with 4 limbs is the most successful pattern to accomodate everything from farming to technology. No other form has the leverage, dexterity or maneuverability to make an Industrial Revolution happen. Simon Conway Morris, well known Palaeontologist puts forth a very good argument that I think if darn near impossible to refute. A very good example of convergeant evolution is the Tasmanian Tiger. The canine shape was very successful as a hunting model, and it was adapted by this marsupial. The bipedal stance, the opposable thumb and our brain make our pattern one that really ought to show up again in the evolutionary stakes. You would not be the first one to say that life will be unrecognisable, yet I have not seen a good argument why the bipedal shape would not be utilised in evolution extensively for life as we know it. It is a bit arrogant to think of this as "our shape" as it is anything but. We are the product of the which nature provides us -  the environment. e are looking at earth like planets to find intelligent life, so why would an earth like planet not have earth like beings following evolution, just as they did here? 50 Billion species have evolved here, and only one shape made it through to intelligence capable of establishing a civilisation, and more than once considering the Neanderthal's, The Denisovians, Flores People, and many more yet to come I am sure.
Harvard University Biologist Ed Wilson agrees with this position.
I agree with Sagan that life can take all forms, but I do not believe all forms are suitably adapted to allow an Industrial Revolution to take place. Intelligent life I feel is likely to be quite familiar.

LINK - Professor Simon Conway Morris Homepage.


LINK - Paper

Edited by psyche101, 15 November 2012 - 03:30 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#77    psyche101

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:34 AM

View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 02:01 AM, said:

There are some sexy Romulans and Vulcans. That green chick in the new Star Trek movie is pretty hot...and what about the movie Avatar? That blue chick is bangin lol

At 4 meters tall, you are a gamer man than I. Ans we do not know the green chick in Star Trek was not human. Might be a side effect of Soylent Green, or the latest in all body future tattoos. People get their eyes tattooed these days. Looks gross.

Romulans and Vulcans are just humans with pointy ears. I was kinda hoping someone might come up with something "not human" that is aesthetically pleasing. I have racked my brains, and struggle with half a creature at best. And even that is a personal view.

Romulans and Vulcans have copper based blood if my memory of Dr McCoy is correct. Other than that, we are identical, they even only have one heart.


I would like to see an Alien that does make me go Hrmmmmm!

Edited by psyche101, 15 November 2012 - 03:38 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#78    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:40 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 15 November 2012 - 03:34 AM, said:

At 4 meters tall, you are a gamer man than I. Ans we do not know the green chick in Star Trek was not human.
According to Trek lore, she's from the Orion system and is basically a member of a species of sex fiends, the females emit hormones that drive males of most species wild.

Quote

Romulans and Vulcans have copper based blood if my memory of Dr McCoy s correct. Other than that, we are identical, they even only have one heart.
Heart's in a different place though.

I must not fear. Fear is the Mind-Killer. It is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and to move through me. And when it is gone I will turn the inner eye to see it's path.
When the fear is gone, there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.

#79    psyche101

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:56 AM

View PostWearer of Hats, on 15 November 2012 - 03:40 AM, said:

According to Trek lore, she's from the Orion system and is basically a member of a species of sex fiends, the females emit hormones that drive males of most species wild.


?? Sure?

Is that not Kamala from the TNG episode "The Perfect Mate"?

View PostWearer of Hats, on 15 November 2012 - 03:40 AM, said:

Heart's in a different place though.

Not so sure. The rumour of it being where the human liver cannot be true, although according to DS9 it is grey in colour. Sullu stabs a Romulan in the chest in Star Trek XI when he and Kirk fight the Romulan's on the drill over Vulcan. It is fatal.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#80    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:05 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 15 November 2012 - 03:56 AM, said:

?? Sure?
Is that not Kamala from the TNG episode "The Perfect Mate"?
Yeap, Orion's are like that too it's a plot point in one of the episodes of Enterprise.



Quote

Not so sure. The rumour of it being where the human liver cannot be true, although according to DS9 it is grey in colour. Sullu stabs a Romulan in the chest in Star Trek XI when he and Kirk fight the Romulan's on the drill over Vulcan. It is fatal.
In one of the TOS episodes someone listens to Spock's chest after being told he's a daemon and has no heart and hears no heart beat.
Maybe they've got something else in their chest that's lethal to wound (stomach perhaps?).

I must not fear. Fear is the Mind-Killer. It is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and to move through me. And when it is gone I will turn the inner eye to see it's path.
When the fear is gone, there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.

#81    Rlyeh

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:05 AM

View PostOverSword, on 14 November 2012 - 06:33 PM, said:

Meanwhile, I am not sure what it is, but there is a blue/green/yellow light that bounces ontop of a table near the alien. The UFO repeatedly bounces through the footage.
I think the guy said it was a heart rate monitor.


#82    psyche101

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:14 AM

View PostWearer of Hats, on 15 November 2012 - 04:05 AM, said:

Yeap, Orion's are like that too it's a plot point in one of the episodes of Enterprise.

Not so much phenomenal from Orion though, slave girls aren't they? Which begs the questions, what is a slave girl doing at Starfleet academy?

View PostWearer of Hats, on 15 November 2012 - 04:05 AM, said:

In one of the TOS episodes someone listens to Spock's chest after being told he's a daemon and has no heart and hears no heart beat.
Maybe they've got something else in their chest that's lethal to wound (stomach perhaps?).

Or

Hi Everybody!

Posted Image

Or perhaps more appropriately?

Posted Image

Edited by psyche101, 15 November 2012 - 04:19 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#83    Slave2Fate

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:23 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 15 November 2012 - 03:34 AM, said:

At 4 meters tall, you are a gamer man than I. Ans we do not know the green chick in Star Trek was not human. Might be a side effect of Soylent Green, or the latest in all body future tattoos. People get their eyes tattooed these days. Looks gross.

Romulans and Vulcans are just humans with pointy ears. I was kinda hoping someone might come up with something "not human" that is aesthetically pleasing. I have racked my brains, and struggle with half a creature at best. And even that is a personal view.

Romulans and Vulcans have copper based blood if my memory of Dr McCoy is correct. Other than that, we are identical, they even only have one heart.


I would like to see an Alien that does make me go Hrmmmmm!

There are those that think attraction outside of the human species to be somewhat taboo. I don't know if I should be concerned here or not?





Kidding, of course! :w00t: :tu:

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#84    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:23 AM

http://en.memory-alp...rion_slave_girl
http://en.memory-alp...ki/Gaila_(Orion)

I love how the pilot for TOS basically has the captain of the Enterprise casually discussing selling and buying slaves (sex slaves for that matter). Political correctness? That's for other TV shows!

I must not fear. Fear is the Mind-Killer. It is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and to move through me. And when it is gone I will turn the inner eye to see it's path.
When the fear is gone, there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.

#85    CommunitarianKevin

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:26 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 15 November 2012 - 03:29 AM, said:

Hello Hutton.

I honestly do not believe that is that case at all. Considering convergeant evolution, the bipedal creature with 4 limbs is the most successful pattern to accomodate everything from farming to technology. No other form has the leverage, dexterity or maneuverability to make an Industrial Revolution happen. Simon Conway Morris, well known Palaeontologist puts forth a very good argument that I think if darn near impossible to refute. A very good example of convergeant evolution is the Tasmanian Tiger. The canine shape was very successful as a hunting model, and it was adapted by this marsupial. The bipedal stance, the opposable thumb and our brain make our pattern one that really ought to show up again in the evolutionary stakes. You would not be the first one to say that life will be unrecognisable, yet I have not seen a good argument why the bipedal shape would not be utilised in evolution extensively for life as we know it. It is a bit arrogant to think of this as "our shape" as it is anything but. We are the product of the which nature provides us -  the environment. e are looking at earth like planets to find intelligent life, so why would an earth like planet not have earth like beings following evolution, just as they did here? 50 Billion species have evolved here, and only one shape made it through to intelligence capable of establishing a civilisation, and more than once considering the Neanderthal's, The Denisovians, Flores People, and many more yet to come I am sure.
Harvard University Biologist Ed Wilson agrees with this position.
I agree with Sagan that life can take all forms, but I do not believe all forms are suitably adapted to allow an Industrial Revolution to take place. Intelligent life I feel is likely to be quite familiar.

LINK - Professor Simon Conway Morris Homepage.


LINK - Paper
You are thinking about this way too much. It is quite simple and I think my point is more logical. You are using the evolution of humans on this planet as an example. The Industrial Revolution was started by humans, not in spite of them. A 4 limbed creature has certainly appeared to be the most successful, but that only depends on how you define ‘success.’ I personally find the Bdelloid rotifers to be the most successful creatures. They have not sexually reproduced in 50-100 million years. They have not had to because they work. They have no reason to evolve. They are essentially “perfect.”

Besides that fact, it is important to understand that 4 limbs, and any feature, came about by a random mutation that provided a sexual advantage. We must take in to consideration that that particular random mutation occurred and that it offered an advantage in their environment at that particular time. To compare that to the Industrial Revolution on earth is highly irrelevant. It is just as plausible that a creature with 2, 6, 8, or 10 limbs could fare just as well, if not better. Someone in the industrial revolution would certainly have been more productive with 4 arms rather than 2.

The fact of the matter is that this is based on random mutation and the environment they came from. To think the same random mutations would happen on another planet, that has the same conditions, at the right time, which would mirror earth, is highly unlikely…

There is no reason to believe other intelligent life would look anything like us.

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#86    psyche101

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:32 AM

View PostSlave2Fate, on 15 November 2012 - 04:23 AM, said:

There are those that think attraction outside of the human species to be somewhat taboo. I don't know if I should be concerned here or not?





Kidding, of course! :w00t: :tu:


LOL, I have not seen a species outside of human that make me turn my head yet, but I am hoping something exists out there I had not thought of!

It's a bit depressing to think of bulbous headed aliens being an only alternative!

This is where I could use a good imagination I suppose! 747400's words are have come to haunt me!

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#87    psyche101

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:33 AM

View PostWearer of Hats, on 15 November 2012 - 04:23 AM, said:

http://en.memory-alp...rion_slave_girl
http://en.memory-alp...ki/Gaila_(Orion)

I love how the pilot for TOS basically has the captain of the Enterprise casually discussing selling and buying slaves (sex slaves for that matter). Political correctness? That's for other TV shows!


Well mate. I have to concede. Well said. Still one good looking alien is a bit shy I reckon! The statistics could use some evening up :D

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#88    psyche101

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 05:43 AM

View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

You are thinking about this way too much.

LOL, that is exactly what I do. But I fail to see a problem with it? How does this affect my argument adversely?

View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

It is quite simple and I think my point is more logical.

I beg your pardon but, what point? That is just "should be"? No offence but I see no more than that in your rebuttal? What logic have you presented that states an anthropomorphic design could be superseded by a better design?

View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

You are using the evolution of humans on this planet as an example.

Indeed, a pool of one arising from microbial life, just like the planets we are looking for life on. It is all we have that we can take to the bank. If we are looking at planets like earth for intelligent life, why would life be different? Do you feel a different evolutionary process would happen? If so, why? All life, plants and animals come from a single spark. Would that be different elsewhere?


View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

The Industrial Revolution was started by humans, not in spite of them. A 4 limbed creature has certainly appeared to be the most successful, but that only depends on how you define ‘success.’ I personally find the Bdelloid rotifers to be the most successful creatures. They have not sexually reproduced in 50-100 million years. They have not had to because they work. They have no reason to evolve. They are essentially “perfect.”

I believe an Industrial Revolution is simply an aspect of evolution. And a necessary step on the way to achieving an intelligent society. Whilst this one was started by humans, how would one achieve the ability to travel amongst the stars without such? Bdelloidea are not interstellar travellers, or even intelligent. What do they have to do with convergeant evolution if they have achieved evolutionary equilibrium? Do you feel they are some sort of argument against convergent evolution? Not sure I am following you here 100%, hopefully you can clarify.

And I bet rags to riches that if the planets conditions changed, they would evolve again. There is no pinnacle of evolution. The Giraffe is also at a perfect harmony with it's environment and has no need to evolve further, in fact I believe Dawkins said it has nowhere left to go.  But if the environment was to change, so would the Giraffe.

Bdelloidea are not intelligent. Never have been. They are rudimentary microbes. We are talking intelligent life are we not? I expect such microbes to be far more common in the Universe than intelligent life, being a very basic form of life. When discussing success with regards to intelligence, these guys do not have a dog in this race.

LOL, to me no sex for 80 million years is not intelligent at all :w00t:

View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

Besides that fact, it is important to understand that 4 limbs, and any feature, came about by a random mutation that provided a sexual advantage. We must take in to consideration that that particular random mutation occurred and that it offered an advantage in their environment at that particular time. To compare that to the Industrial Revolution on earth is highly irrelevant. It is just as plausible that a creature with 2, 6, 8, or 10 limbs could fare just as well, if not better. Someone in the industrial revolution would certainly have been more productive with 4 arms rather than 2.

Why would a creature retain 4, 6 or 8 arms when they are simply not necessary? We lost the tail, we used to be a five limbed creature, but it was not necessary. This body plan is well shaped, and developed to accomplish industrial and technological feats.

It is not irrelevant to include the Industrial Revolution being an important step to intelligence, or at least I cannot see why you think so, other than a plain outright objection, Could I ask you to extrapolate any points supporting this claim?

Why would a 4 armed person be more efficient in an industrial revolution? Additional energy and resources would be required for the extra body mass that can just as easily be achieved with two limbs and leverage. Utilisation of your surrounding environment. Those that can utilise with the greatest efficiency win. As the Neanderthal found out.

View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

The fact of the matter is that this is based on random mutation and the environment they came from. To think the same random mutations would happen on another planet, that has the same conditions, at the right time, which would mirror earth, is highly unlikely…

Why?

Link - Earth Like Planet Found Next Door

Link - Earth Like Planet Can Sustain Life

Link - 100 Earth Like Planets Found Within 30 Light Years!

Speciation and Convergeant Evolution is more what I am talking about in any case. But I do not see how random mutation make a difference here? Successful mutations are successful mutations. Why would what works for one group not work for another? i.e. if it works here, why is it impossible that it would work on another earth like planet?

View PostHuttonEtAl, on 15 November 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:

There is no reason to believe other intelligent life would look anything like us.

I have given several reasons and a paper. I  would appreciate it if you could adress why those points are incorrect, and perhaps tell me why convergent evolution would be restricted to a planet as opposed to a Galaxy, or the Universe for that matter? From what I can see there is every reason to think life would be very familiar. And no reasons why alternate body shapes would be more successful. Why would an 8 limbed creature evolve into intelligence over a two armed one? What would be the advantage of 8 arms? I understand 3 if one was in Total Recall but beyond that, reasons seem to not exist. More limbs, more energy is required, and more body plan. In many cases, less is more. The Anthropomorphic design holds the best features from all plans. What would work better, and why?



Examples of Convergent Evolution.

Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image


Posted Image

Edited by psyche101, 15 November 2012 - 06:01 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#89    Slave2Fate

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:08 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 15 November 2012 - 05:43 AM, said:

What would work better, and why?

Not trying to jump in the middle of something here but It is more about what works, period. The humanoid model works well...for us. I don't think it is as definitive as you would suggest though. Don't get me wrong, there are undeniable advantages to a humanoid form though I think there is room in the great scope of life to incorporate higher intelligence and subsequent space travel in other body types as well. I don't have anything to back that up with though, it's just an opinion of mine. :tu:

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#90    Lava_Lady

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:12 AM

View Postfreetoroam, on 14 November 2012 - 02:41 PM, said:

In photo 4, if you look really really carefully with a microscope, you can see the virgin Mary.....somewhere.

Hahahahaha!!!!!

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