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On the Topic of Vegetarianism...


RPM

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So I want to get healthy.

It doesn't get much simpler than that.

But I want to know what I should do.

I've been considering eating a vegetarian diet focusing mostly on fruits (grapes, bananas, nectarines) and leafy greens like spinach.

That and rigorous weightlifting, sit-ups, jogging, etc.

I'm not sure how quickly I can lose weight and build muscle, but I've lost weight pretty rapidly before.

If my metabolism is anything like it was a year or two ago, I think I can really change my life.

I feel like the immediate cause of my laziness and my procrastination is my mindset.

I feel like the ultimate cause of my mindset is my lifestyle.

I used to be pretty active and, looking back, I did better in school.

Along with that, I didn't eat a lot of microwaved freezer food.

So I was thinking of moving to a one-year vegetarian diet in which I ate a ton of grapes and bananas and mostly spinach and corn/bean/pepper dishes.

But if it's not worth the extra money (freezer food is cheap, dawg) and I can be healthy with other food and the same workouts, I'm not sure I should do it.

From what I've learned in AP Bio, eating vegetables is better than eating meat as far as energy consumption goes.

We get more energy from primary producers (plants/crops) than we do from primary (herbivores) or secondary (carnivores/omnivores) consumers.

So what do you guys think?

Is vegetarianism valid? What are the biggest benefits?

Similarly, is vegan-ism a good diet? I know some vegans but they don't look like very healthy.

Very scrawny and pale people.

Edited by RPM
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I am not a nutritionist, but I noticed you didn't mention any proteins (doesn't have to be meat) yet you mentioned rigorous exercise and weight lifting. I believe protein sources are something to seriously consider also.

And why do you limit your fruit and veggie choices to so few? "a ton of grapes and bananas and mostly spinach and corn/bean/pepper dishes"

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I am not a nutritionist, but I noticed you didn't mention any proteins (doesn't have to be meat) yet you mentioned rigorous exercise and weight lifting. I believe protein sources are something to seriously consider also.

And why do you limit your fruit and veggie choices to so few? "a ton of grapes and bananas and mostly spinach and corn/bean/pepper dishes"

But... spinach, potatoes, and corn have more protein than almost any other vegetables/crops. That's why I picked them, man.

Bananas have lots of fiber and Vitamin C. Grapes are loaded with Vitamin K.

Plus I really like bananas and grapes.

I did my research, more or less.

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But... spinach, potatoes, and corn have more protein than almost any other vegetables/crops. That's why I picked them, man.

Bananas have lots of fiber and Vitamin C. Grapes are loaded with Vitamin K.

Plus I really like bananas and grapes.

I did my research, more or less.

I'm not familiar with spinach, potatoes or corn as being touted as complete high protein sources for vegetarians. Rather, legumes, lentils, tofu, etc. But I defer to your research, it's your body.

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I have just recently discovered Chia, it's a seed that when combined with water or moisture bulks up and creates a gelatinous mixture. The best is with coconut milk and mango or banana pureed and mixed together, then chilled. Drink plenty of water with it, it continues to expand with fluid and keeps you feeling full for longer. Look it up, it does not come across as very attractive visually but it tastes just fine, I prefer sweeter dishes such as I have described but there are recipies for using it in savory dishes too.

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Getting all the essential amino acids is not easy if one is to have the varied diet one should also strive for. Lentils, nuts, corn, legumes, tofu (of course tofu) all help, but it takes attention and probably a good calculator.

Another issue is vitamin B12. Here a supplement is probably needed.

Personally unless one has ethical or religious reasons, I think completely avoiding animal protein is not a good idea. Just eat very little if any meat.

Another vegetarianism issue (and since I live in a Buddhist country I run into this often, especially when I have monks over) is what to do when the host is ignorant or uses some animal or fish product (such as our "nuc mum" -- fish sauce) without thinking. The answer is eat it without comment. The guest does not embarrass the host by making an issue of it or even informing the host -- at least that was the Buddha's view.

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I have just recently discovered Chia, it's a seed that when combined with water or moisture bulks up and creates a gelatinous mixture. The best is with coconut milk and mango or banana pureed and mixed together, then chilled. Drink plenty of water with it, it continues to expand with fluid and keeps you feeling full for longer. Look it up, it does not come across as very attractive visually but it tastes just fine, I prefer sweeter dishes such as I have described but there are recipies for using it in savory dishes too.

I use the stuff on my oatmeal, along with banana and berries and a touch of salt and a few cashews. Keeps me full all morning.
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Some good non-meat protein sources are eggs, yogurt, nuts, beans, cheese. I really don't eat much red meat myself (too much cholesterol). I generally stick to fish or organic chicken breast.

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Some good non-meat protein sources are eggs, yogurt, nuts, beans, cheese. I really don't eat much red meat myself (too much cholesterol). I generally stick to fish or organic chicken breast.

Me too. While I've been in the States I've been stuffing myself with turkey, since that is very hard to get in Vietnam (it's called "Western chicken"). I really don't see why they aren't there, and think some entrepreneur could make a bundle introducing them, but until that happens I have to stick with while I'm here.

The vegetarians in Vietnam are mainly Caodai and Buddhist officials, monks and nuns. The rest of the population eats meat more as a condiment and has a lot of chicken and fish and shellfish. The cuisine though is mainly vegetables, of the sort a lot of Americans call "rabbit food" since it has so many grassy and leafy things in it. Very little dairy here until the government decided it wanted taller people, and so started pushing dairy on children. Now it's readily available and cheap.

This thread is about vegetarian foods though, so I should stop letting myself be distracted. There is a wonderful vegetarian phu (pronounced "fuh" with a slight uptone) made from tofu and mushrooms and a fake chicken broth that really does taste like it's a whole chicken having been boiled a couple days (the normal way to make phu). I must see if I can find out how they do it.

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Iam not a health nut I kinda eat what I wanna ,I have donuts every morning with my coffee.i eat lots of meat.pizzia, bacon egg,

Bakey stuff is what I like ,,I don't eat chips and stuff like that but I do walk a lot I might walk 2 miles a day with my dog

And I drink a lot of soda and milk if I have a heart attack and d rop dead iam not worried about it lol

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Maybe just cutting out processed food and going full organic might be better to start with.

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Maybe just cutting out processed food and going full organic might be better to start with.

This is a really good idea ( I do it myself). If one does decide to become a vegetarian it's important to get other sources of protein and iron (and other nutrients) that commonly come from meat. As long as a person's getting proper nutirents and food that's not processed/messed with all will be well.

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We owe it to ourselves to eat sensibly and take care of ourselves. We also owe it to those who love us.

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.

I have no issue with vegetarianism.

Nor do I. I see it as a personal decision and understandable if one accepts that animals are sentient beings.

My general view is that a lot depends on the "degree" of sentience and other cultural factors. Things like dog meat or horse meat I would never eat. Domestic cows are another matter, and I don't think fish and birds can be seen as anywhere near as intelligent as say a pig.

If animals bred for human meat are treated well and killed humanely (unlike the horrible Muslim practice), I have no problem, since they are better off than animals in the wild. Unfortunately that is rarely the case.

Another factor is the health issues -- meat is not good for us, and meat of carnivores and omnivores is outright dangerous

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So, you'll need protein, MUCH more than spinach has. You're also describing a diet of all fruits and vegetables, with a focus on bananas and grapes (which isn't vegetarian, it's vegan and not very healthy vegan at that)... which are both extremely high sugar fruits. Not too mention that you're not going to be able to get your required calories in a day eating nothing but that. If you're looking for a diet that will help you lose weight, and grain muscle, you're really going to want to look into the "clean" diets, or low carb diets. All of which contain eating a lot of lean animal proteins.

I was raised a vegan. People will argue with me until they're blue in the face, but it's not a very healthy way to eat. My folks did it for 40+ years... Neither of them are terribly healthy at 67 years old. About six years ago, they reintroduced lean animal proteins into their diets and they're doing much better now, but frankly a lot of the damage is done.

Your best bet is to cut out all processed foods. Cook for yourself, watch your portions, join a calories and macronutrient site like Sparkpeople or MyFitnessPal and follow their sensible diet plans. you'll lose slowly (which is best) you'll eat better healthier foods, and you'll get the proper balance of nutrients and a good supportive community. Both sites are free.

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Eating just a few fruits and veggies isn't going to give your body the fuel it needs for just sitting around, let alone the fuel it needs for working out. A well rounded diet that cuts out or reduces processed foods, salt, and refined sugars is a good start rather than an imbalanced diet. Soy, quinoa, and teff are all good sources of non-animal protein.

And really, instead of asking UM for diet and nutrition advice, it might be wiser to go do sites that are for diet and nutrition instead. What you are asking is almost bordering on medical advice here.

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  • 5 weeks later...

Vegetarianism doesn't equal healthier living.

Meat is an easy way to get your required protein. If you are trying to gain muscle mass you need to intake 1.5 - 2 grams of protein per pound of body weight, depending on goals. try doing that with beans and such only, not easy.

The better option is to cut out all the crap foods, no fast food, processed food, no candy, no soda/alcohol, limit juices, drink lots of water, eat leafy greens, limit your fruit, eat lean meat. You need carbs, but limit them.

Your best bet is to find a gym with a nutritionist, and chat for awhile.

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Vegetarianism isn't the guaranteed way to good health, but overall vegetarians, all else being equal, tend to be healthier than their carnivorous counterparts. Still, health is not the reason to be a vegetarian. Ethics or religion or something of that sort is.

The vegetarian has to be much more aware of what food he or she is eating, to get the right mix of amino acids and to get certain nutrients found mainly in meat. However, we would be better off if we abandoned meat for environmental and expense reasons and stuck with poultry and fish and eggs and some dairy and nuts and legumes for our protein. Red meat also contributes to a lot of health problems.

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for me it isn't a health thing. It is a moral thing.

You can eat a really unhealthy vegetarian diet if you put your mind to it. But it is good to focus on what you eat although it isn't always easy in the modern world. But it does mean you can look a cow straight back in the eyes if you wish!

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for me it isn't a health thing. It is a moral thing.

The Buddhist church encourages vegetarianism a bunch of ways, with meatless festivals and special meatless periods and so on, and of course the monks are vegetarian for the most part.

I see this as a left over from earlier times and a bit superstitious. The edict is to have maximum compassion for all sentient beings, and I do not question that a cow is sentient, albeit maybe there are degrees of sentience. The thing is what shows the cow maximum compassion, and the miserable cows of India are not being shown much compassion. Better to arrange things so that meat animals are well treated and protected and die without suffering.

Of course the horrible way Muslims kill their animals is an outrage, just another example of Muslim cruelty.

I don't eat meat often -- generally only when it is offered me when I am a guest somewhere -- but mainly because I think the animal industry as it now stands harms the environment and wastes resources and helps perpetuate hunger around the world by giving needed grains to animals so that the rich can eat meat while the poor starve. (A bit colorful there but the gist should be clear). Also of course, red meat is not good for you -- ironic retribution there.

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