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A test for APers/RVers.


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#31    bustacrab

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 12:34 AM

AtheistGod on Mar 5 2008, 11:48 PM, said:

A lot of members here claim to be able to leave their physical bodies and go anywhere. This test is to change my mind.

Every year I go to Vimy Ridge in France or try too anyway.

What I want you to do is to tell me what I have placed there every time I have went. The objects in question are placed out of view and not one has gone missing, Your goal is to tell me what it is I have left there.

Rules:

1: You only get one try.
2: All answers must be PM'ed.
3: The topic can be discussed however do not violate rule 2.

The correct answer will be posted here by me provided anyone gets it right.

The reason for only 1 try and for rule 2 is simple, it eliminates the possibility of simply guessing the correct answer via process of elimination.

Of course the answer can be guessed and the correct answer does not leave the realm of chance. However I will have a series of other challenges for the winner to confirm their ability.


As far as I know, astral projection doesn't allow you to travel around the physical dimension. I have been astral projecting (not on purpose) and I never can control where I go... I always just come out of my body in the room I'm in.. then get "teloported" somewhere else. I can't control it. A lot of times I will meet people and talk to them... I don't make any assumptions on whether it is "real" or not.

It's not like any of the people on this forum are here to make money, some attention maybe (at the most, if any), but really, whats the point of this except reinforcing your own beliefs? What if someone did get it right? Would that change your mind about it or would you just figure the 1% chance someone guessed what you were talking about?

Edited by bustacrab, 08 March 2008 - 12:40 AM.


#32    Nucular

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 01:52 AM

bustacrab on Mar 8 2008, 12:34 AM, said:

As far as I know, astral projection doesn't allow you to travel around the physical dimension.

That's not what many here claim, DarkBreed included.  This challenge/test is presumably addressed to them.

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I have been astral projecting (not on purpose) and I never can control where I go... I always just come out of my body in the room I'm in.. then get "teloported" somewhere else. I can't control it. A lot of times I will meet people and talk to them... I don't make any assumptions on whether it is "real" or not.

It sounds very difficult therefore to tell the difference between your own AP experiences and dreams.

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It's not like any of the people on this forum are here to make money, some attention maybe (at the most, if any), but really, whats the point of this except reinforcing your own beliefs?

Yep, I guess that's one of the points.  Not everyone does things for money; some, I suspect, are genuinely mistaken in believing they may have a magic power of some kind.  Perhaps some really do - that's what this test is designed to check out.

Quote

What if someone did get it right? Would that change your mind about it or would you just figure the 1% chance someone guessed what you were talking about?

It's been said already, but this seems to be intended as a screening test (i.e. the first, easy trial of several).  If someone manages to perform well on not only this, but other similar trials then I for one will sit up and take notice.  I won't lose my critical faculties, and if there's a possible explanation I'll say so, but these abilities (if true) should pass these tests with flying colours, shouldn't they?


#33    Atheist God

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 02:17 AM

I have only had on PM with an answer. While the answer was wrong at least it was an attempt.

It's been made clear to me that not one single person here despite the claims made can accomplish this rather simple task... so far anyway.

Johnny Truant kudos for at least giving it a shot.

Electrokinesis is me, you automatically disqualified yourself by posting a public answer.

I will let this thread continue for a few more days before I have it locked and reveal the answer to you all.

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#34    MarkSteven

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 02:46 AM

doesn't seem like an open minded discussion since you ignored my and blueguardians request.

i also don't see why a pm would be necessary for a correct answer, if the first attempt is correct then what else is there.

so i guess you better have the thread closed before someone gets it right, that way there is no explaining to do.

this is the way you want to look at it

Quote

They aren't in plain view but would be easily found... I've seen shows and read testimonials especially about remote viewers and their 'homing' ability to find something with little to no information. As far as I am concerned they have been given an easy task.


but i am thinking about the people that would ap or obe and go straight over and look.

Edited by MarkSteven, 08 March 2008 - 03:00 AM.

Warning:
anything that i say is based on my personal feeling of the topic at hand.
my opinion is mine and i'll try to be clear and to the point. i may be wrong, but that's my opinion.

This forum is called Unexplained-Mysteries, however some people think it should be called "Everything is provable with science"

check this - http://www.astralvoyage.com

#35    MarkSteven

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 02:56 AM

eight bits on Mar 6 2008, 11:24 AM, said:

Umm, not to labor the obvious, but there is only one target in the screening test proposed by the OP. What would assigning it an eight digit number accomplish?

Name it or pass. Pass? Noted. One excuse is as good as another.

Bon voyage.



this is what the numbers are for, taken from http://www.astralvoyage.com/

Quote

This is done in beta/alpha which is not the technique I use now, but what I was originally taught...

1. Clear your mind. Sit down at a desk in a quiet room and remove any items from the desk that would capture your interest. The plainer the better. Have pen and paper ready.

2. Relax. Take out several minutes to breathe deep and quiet the mind.

3. Look at the coordinate numbers below. DON'T GUESS what they are, because you will be wrong! Instead, let the images come to you. What do you feel? What colors and textures come into your mind? The trick is to stay "low level". Low level means to not try and guess what the target is, but try and get minimal data (colors, textures, etc.)

4. Start writing or verbalizing details. As the picture slowly unfolds, start sketching details. What are its attributes? An arc, a curve, a motion of energy, red, green, brown, soft, hard, mushy? Write down everything that you see, feel, hear or smell.

5. Get a bigger picture. As you get more information, you should be able to detect if it's man made, natural, human and so forth. Start to feel for the bigger picture.

A real session can take up to an hour, but if you are just having fun, I think you should be able to do this in 20 minutes or so. The more time you take with the above steps, the better your result. A lot is left out here because, again, if you are really interested in learning the correct protocols for remote viewing, you should take a course. Also, there isn't enough room to cover it all. When you are done with all of this, look at the target and see where you were close, and where you let guesses play a part.


Warning:
anything that i say is based on my personal feeling of the topic at hand.
my opinion is mine and i'll try to be clear and to the point. i may be wrong, but that's my opinion.

This forum is called Unexplained-Mysteries, however some people think it should be called "Everything is provable with science"

check this - http://www.astralvoyage.com

#36    Atheist God

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 03:03 AM

MarkSteven on Mar 7 2008, 08:46 PM, said:

doesn't seem like an open minded discussion since you ignored my and blueguardians request.

i also don't see why a pm would be necessary for a correct answer, if the first attempt is correct then what else is there.

so i guess you better have the thread closed before someone gets it right, that way there is no explaining to do.


The reason answers need to be PM's as opposed to posted here is that some answers may not be correct. Fact is there was already an honest attempt at getting the answer and it was incorrect.

By not having the incorrect answers posted it decreases the possibility of someone simply guessing via process of elimination. Basically the more incorrect answers that are posted here increases the likely hood of someone guessing the right answer and ruining the test.

Quote

astral projecting allows people to leave their bodys, it does not make them psychic lol, you have given an almost impossible feat. It would be like me telling you to go to my friends house and see is she can come over tomorrow, where is my friends house in taralgon? well im not going to tell you. seriously i mean no offence, im just saying you haven't given enough information. You cant ask people to go project to Vimy Ridge in france and expect them to find something you put ther, for one thing how big is vimy ridge and how would they know you put an item there. it makes this whole test pointless.

please come up with something more reasonable.


Ok it's at the memorial site, no more information should be needed and this and it narrows the field of search. There will be no hints in regard to the said objects, the objects themselves are unique and should be recognized easily.

To help you in your task I will provide a visual aid.

linked-image

I assumed people here were smart enough to know that it would have been at the memorial. Guess I was wrong....

Quote

It's not like any of the people on this forum are here to make money, some attention maybe (at the most, if any), but really, whats the point of this except reinforcing your own beliefs? What if someone did get it right? Would that change your mind about it or would you just figure the 1% chance someone guessed what you were talking about?


This question is answered in the OP. To rule out chance other challenges will be given to the person who gets the correct answer.



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#37    MarkSteven

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 03:31 AM

that's a little better, since i already asked if that was the location. for me, a location of said item or items need to be given. if i end up over there, i could be looking all over the place and finding all sorts of things. this would give me an objective, a reason to look, which should help.

Warning:
anything that i say is based on my personal feeling of the topic at hand.
my opinion is mine and i'll try to be clear and to the point. i may be wrong, but that's my opinion.

This forum is called Unexplained-Mysteries, however some people think it should be called "Everything is provable with science"

check this - http://www.astralvoyage.com

#38    eight bits

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 12:02 PM

Quote

this is what the numbers are for

With respect, Mark, I believe that there is some confusion about what the issue with the number is.

Darkbreed objected to OP's methods,  asking for an eight digit random number to identify the target. What you quote involves a meaningful number, which describes the location of the target in a systematic way.

Random and meaningful are mutually exclusive categories.

Although the OP has provided some additional information since darkbreed and I last exchanged views, at the time of our discussion, OP had provided little more than the coordinates of the object. OP used words, based upon a standard nomenclature of place names, rather than numbers.

I would also suggest the possibility that the little additional information OP provided, basically that the target was "smaller than a breadbox" and distinctive in its context, was comparable to the actual state of information available to subjects in the experiments darkbreed and I discussed.

The issue, ultimately, is whether or not participating in the screening experiment was worthy of darkbreed's valuable time and effort, compared to, say, the time and effort of regaling us at length about the magnificence of his many powers and his fitness as a World Teacher.

Your quoted matter supports my view that darkbreed's stated objection to the OP's test was unfounded. Thank you.

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#39    She-ra

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 12:10 PM

Wow this could have been a really fun thread if it wasn't so over-analyzed! I sent my PM guess to Aethiestgod. It's probably incorrect but at least I tried original.gif. I say let's have fun with this!!

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#40    MarkSteven

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Posted 08 March 2008 - 03:16 PM

the 8 digit number is the same, a random number that identifies the image, it was called a coordinate number because it relates to a specific picture.

i am still waiting for an exact location for a possible ap to directly find the item in question.

Warning:
anything that i say is based on my personal feeling of the topic at hand.
my opinion is mine and i'll try to be clear and to the point. i may be wrong, but that's my opinion.

This forum is called Unexplained-Mysteries, however some people think it should be called "Everything is provable with science"

check this - http://www.astralvoyage.com

#41    MarkSteven

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Posted 10 March 2008 - 09:05 PM

how about a wreath

Warning:
anything that i say is based on my personal feeling of the topic at hand.
my opinion is mine and i'll try to be clear and to the point. i may be wrong, but that's my opinion.

This forum is called Unexplained-Mysteries, however some people think it should be called "Everything is provable with science"

check this - http://www.astralvoyage.com

#42    eight bits

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Posted 11 March 2008 - 12:18 AM

Here's what I responded to, Mark:

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...t&p=2183562

Quote

However, in my experiment I want it to be a little different, I want to follow standard remote viewing protocols. That means I will know NOTHING about the target, and the only thing I will be given is a random 8 digit number that is a reference number for the target, and only the person who chose the target such as yourself will know what the target is.

This was after the OP had provided a location. The test involves a single trial. There is nothing for an 8-digit number, random or not, to do in this test.

The OP has subsequently explained why he chose to provde the information he did, no less and no more.

And you know what, Mark? I had a vision the last time I was out in the astral. There was this parallel universe where the OP provided an eight digit random number and nothing else, and this guy had some other song and dance about why that was no good either.

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#43    MarkSteven

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Posted 11 March 2008 - 12:46 AM

i know what the reason we were given the task but i wanted to expand on it, a direct location of the object in question. that way i could be sure to find the correct item. i am sure you can imagine the possibility that many people travel to the site, leaving all sorts of things behind. it's a memorial, people are not only drawn there to view the structure, many are there to pay their respects.

as for the astral, it can be very confusing and random. you really need to keep focus, an objective so to speak. just being able to move can be a challenge, the reason so many people can't seem to get past the paralysis state. then the other levels, i find the closest level to our daily life is the dream state, that can be very distracting, moving beyond that is challenging enough.

now if someone tries to mentally project, they may not need as much information, some others might. in order to have a fair test, more specific information would help people that aren't so in tune with their self.

however a test where i just walk out side and pull up a blade of grass then let it go in the wind and ask, how long is the blade, what color, where did it fall.

Warning:
anything that i say is based on my personal feeling of the topic at hand.
my opinion is mine and i'll try to be clear and to the point. i may be wrong, but that's my opinion.

This forum is called Unexplained-Mysteries, however some people think it should be called "Everything is provable with science"

check this - http://www.astralvoyage.com

#44    Blueguardian

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Posted 11 March 2008 - 07:36 AM

I agree MarkSteven, for a topic in this catagory to be done it needs to be well thought out, espicially on a large scale like this, on a small scale eg; a gorup of people get together and project and have to say the object that has been placed on the table in the next room. Its been done like that before. On a large scale however im not really sure how to go about it. Your main problems AtheistGod are:

Location - it has to be somewhere specific.

Object - ther has to be a way for an astral projecter to actually know what they are looking for, eg a football with a message on it or something similar, but how to do it so nobody can just go to the location and see what it says is a problem.

Good luck.

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#45    eight bits

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Posted 11 March 2008 - 09:33 AM

This is not my test, and I often disagree with the OP on scientific and methodological issues. Nevertheless, I think what he has proposed here is reasonable.

There probably is no one single test that will respond to all of the many and conflicting claims made by a variety of people about AP and RV.

The OP has identified which body of claims he chooses to test. The very fact that proponents of other varieties of AP or RV say that they cannot perform this task provides all of us with useful information about the phenomenon.

That harvest of information is itself a successful result from a scientific perspective.

In contrast, to say that one can do the test, but won't, because it isn't hard enough provides no information about AP and RV. However, that kind of answer is informative about other issues, although personally, I think that there was little doubt about those anyway.

Edited by eight bits, 11 March 2008 - 09:34 AM.

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