Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


- - - - -

How/why would psi powers evolve?


  • Please log in to reply
25 replies to this topic

#16    DfizzleShizzle

DfizzleShizzle

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,318 posts
  • Joined:13 Jan 2008
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Laurel, MD

Posted 11 April 2008 - 07:13 PM

eight bits on Apr 11 2008, 06:40 AM, said:

Hi, Kevin. Thank you for the clarification, and I think I understand where you are coming from.

The question of what confers advantage is a trickier one than it might first appear. When you write about "parlor ticks," you are comparing one hypothetical mode of communication with the medium you and I are using now. Compared to that, of course, all biological systems fall short.

From an engineering perspective, however, things look different. I have in mind a specific engineer, Richard Epstein, who wrote The Theory of Gambling and Statistical Logic.

Intuitively, we might compare communication channels along two dimensions: baud rate and reliability, say. But it has been understood since before World War II that there really is only one dimension: baud rate (how many bits I can move per unit time). Reliability depends on how the message is coded (how many bits I must move to ensure that one bit of source message is actually received at the destination).

It is a theorem that so long as the baud rate is positive (not zero - some bits move), then any message that can be sent at all can be sent using any channel with whatever reliability you choose (and no channel is 100%). You just code the message correctly to accommodate the channel. Grab a candy bar, because it will take a while with some channels. But with time, the message will get through.

We know that natural selection can exploit the coding theorem. There is a severe bottleneck between your retinas and central visual processors, the optic nerve. It is "slow" and "noisy," and yet a high resolution picture of the visual surround gets through in acceptably "real time" with high reliability. We do not yet know all the details, but we do understand that the feat depends on the sophisticated coding of information that passes through the channel.

So, suppose hypothetically that you and I both could really have an average 21% success rate on the 20% Zener card card task. Then it would be possible for us to exchange messages with the same reliability as we are doing right now. It would be much slower, and only "practical" for short messages, but it would work.

So, is there any selective advantage in having a highly reliable, low volume communications channel? We can debate that, but I am content to leave it as a question for now, that it is at least not obvious that the answer must be no.

This would look nothing like the comic book psi crap, nor the hoodwinkers', exploiters', and charlatans' signs and wonders. Instead, it would look like everything else in nature: just good enough to add a tiny fraction of a percent to the probability that I live long enough to have a child, whether or not I live a moment longer than that. Bloody business, natural selection is.


But, even havin them is still helpful...I mean..Usin telepathy, wouldnt be practical, if the person was right next to you, and if you used telepathy, only some of the message would get across...But, if you're out in the city, and a guy in a red pickup truck comes and kidnaps you, and you have no cell phone, no one saw you..You have nothing.....Havin the telepathy would help, because atleast some communication would get across...


And, I do believe, that if you didnt teach kids the concepts of "reality" then they would be able to do psi easier cause the biast that thse things dont exist wont be there...

"A believer is a songless bird in a cage, a freethinker is an eagle parting the clouds with tireless wings." -Robert G. Ingersoll

"Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence." -Richard Dawkins

#17    Paranormalcy

Paranormalcy

    Interterrestrial Being

  • Member
  • 5,758 posts
  • Joined:04 May 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:NE OK USA

  • "This Saturday, we gon' do it bigger than, we ever had before
    I don't want this Saturday to end!" - Rebecca Black

Posted 11 April 2008 - 10:37 PM

Its actually a good question, why would psi abilities develop. Even as much as I like to believe in some spontaneous function on this level and consider a few things/reports likely candidates, applying this sort of reasoning does seem to make psi less likely. Anomolist Charles Forte and psychologist Carl Jung believed in extranormal functions in Man, I'm not sure their exact reasoning or personal answer to the question as to why these would develop.

| Ouija/Ideomotor | Sleep Paralys./Hypnogogia | Ouija: 252 hrs/4yrs



#18    Nik Xues

Nik Xues

    The Still Wanderer

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,468 posts
  • Joined:27 Nov 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Canada

Posted 12 April 2008 - 12:18 AM

telepathy and preminition have purpose.

If you can see it coming you can prepare for it.


telekenetics way fringe
may have zero g applications put i dont see a current use.

True Scientists consider all possibilities until they have evidence stating otherwise.
the others are idiots simply waiting for proof of existence.

#19    Radian

Radian

    Καρδιά ενός &a

  • Member
  • 8,002 posts
  • Joined:13 Jul 2006
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Καρδιά ενός δράκου

  • Καρδιά ενός δράκου

Posted 12 April 2008 - 12:22 AM

Clovis on Apr 11 2008, 03:15 AM, said:

Of course there is the odd tale of a redhead being able to sit on a pile of fire ants without being stung once.


Should I laugh or ask if this is foreal?

Posted Image <-- my attack bee

#20    Rosewin

Rosewin

    Omnipotent Entity

  • Banned
  • 8,967 posts
  • Joined:26 Oct 2004
  • Gender:Not Selected

Posted 12 April 2008 - 09:35 AM

It is real. There could be other explanations but it is most unusual.


#21    DfizzleShizzle

DfizzleShizzle

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,318 posts
  • Joined:13 Jan 2008
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Laurel, MD

Posted 12 April 2008 - 11:25 PM

Lol...I'm gonna find a redhead and try this...I've heard it somewhere before other than this site, not sure though...

Just wondering, does it matter the ant type? Or must it be red ants?

"A believer is a songless bird in a cage, a freethinker is an eagle parting the clouds with tireless wings." -Robert G. Ingersoll

"Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence." -Richard Dawkins

#22    Cradle of Fish

Cradle of Fish

    Alien Abducter

  • Member
  • 4,583 posts
  • Joined:07 Apr 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:South Australia

  • "He who makes a beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man." - Dr. Johnson

Posted 13 April 2008 - 04:34 AM

Nik Xues on Apr 12 2008, 01:18 AM, said:

telekenetics way fringe
may have zero g applications put i dont see a current use.


I've heard some quite ridiculous things from this thread. Animals know when earthquakes are coming because they can sense the changes that come before them, vibrations in the ground that are incredibly subtle, humans can't, but they could probably learn to. Ants seem to be most active before rain, but that's not psychic powers, that's thousands of generations of being ants and learning to stockpile before the rain comes and makes it impossible to get food.

This whole thing about 'we don't need them, yet' is ridiculous and shows a great misunderstanding of how evolution works. Our five senses are enough for us to survive in the wild, and we've done great relying on them. We wouldn't evolve something if we didn't need it at the moment. It's not like something that is planted there by evolution so when we reach a certain technological peak we'll be able to utilize it fully, natural selection is a blind watchmaker, it didn't predict technology, intelligence, or thumbs, it didn't know that after a certain number of years there'll be an age of Aquarius when the stars are aligned properly and we'll all be able to bend spoons with minds.

I am not a man, merely a parody of one.


#23    Sporkling

Sporkling

    Poltergeist

  • Closed
  • 2,841 posts
  • Joined:25 Aug 2007

Posted 13 April 2008 - 04:49 AM

Sure humans have no need for cars to survive. Yet it was invented. I wonder why.
We do not need paper to survive. We invented them. Again, I don't know why.


#24    Cradle of Fish

Cradle of Fish

    Alien Abducter

  • Member
  • 4,583 posts
  • Joined:07 Apr 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:South Australia

  • "He who makes a beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man." - Dr. Johnson

Posted 13 April 2008 - 06:25 AM

Sporkling on Apr 13 2008, 05:49 AM, said:

Sure humans have no need for cars to survive. Yet it was invented. I wonder why.
We do not need paper to survive. We invented them. Again, I don't know why.


The invention of the car has nothing to do with evolution. We didn't evolve to be ready for cars when we eventually come around to inventing them, in fact some people can get quite car sick, which suggests that our bodies weren't meant to move at 100kmh in enclosed capsules. The same goes for planes, the effects of cabin pressure and sickness during flying are evidence that man wasn't meant to fly, but we've managed to do just that, contrary to our physical nature.

I am not a man, merely a parody of one.


#25    Sporkling

Sporkling

    Poltergeist

  • Closed
  • 2,841 posts
  • Joined:25 Aug 2007

Posted 13 April 2008 - 06:28 AM

Cradle of Fish on Apr 13 2008, 02:25 PM, said:

The invention of the car has nothing to do with evolution. We didn't evolve to be ready for cars when we eventually come around to inventing them, in fact some people can get quite car sick, which suggests that our bodies weren't meant to move at 100kmh in enclosed capsules. The same goes for planes, the effects of cabin pressure and sickness during flying are evidence that man wasn't meant to fly, but we've managed to do just that, contrary to our physical nature.

I think you are quite right. Well said


#26    darkbreed

darkbreed

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,052 posts
  • Joined:04 Nov 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Argentina

Posted 13 April 2008 - 07:59 AM

I made a new thread regarding my "devolution theory" as well as including some info on the current revival, or re-evolution of that which was taken away from us.

This thread is found at http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...howtopic=123446 and titled Devolution and revival of the spiritual.

Enjoy.

-EA

www.PleiadianTalk.tk/ - Perspectives from a member of the Great White Brotherhood
American Atlantis Research - Documenting pre-colombian world migration and Atlantis-America
Increase your astral proection skills - Here at Unexplained Mysteries Forums!




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users