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American soldier flees to Canada


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#16    Nxt2Hvn

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 09:26 PM

QUOTE (Talon S. @ Feb 24 2004, 08:21 PM)
Indeed he signed up, but now he wants to be like you and stay at home, why is he a coward because he changed his mind?  huh.gif

It's a contract... You are obvious not familiar with U.S. Military Policies.

It's like this,You sign up, then... ... well to quote fluffy from an earlier post.

QUOTE
Once you are in, you serve until you are injured, dead, or the date on your contract...

Leaving the country when you have already given your word of honor to support and defend it is frowned upon...

He can't come back to the US without serving jail time...and a dishonorable discharge.


This is why.... If I had signed up... I would go to war... why do you keep arguing this point... it is the way it is... you can't change facts... it is the way the U.S. Military works... like it or not!

Edited by Nxt2Hvn, 24 February 2004 - 09:30 PM.

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#17    Scar

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 09:33 PM

QUOTE (Aslan @ Feb 24 2004, 08:11 PM)
Speaking personally, if ever there was a war anywhere near me, I'd be the first hiding under a rug in the attic. And honour can go swing.

Better to live as a sheep than die as a tiger has always been my motto.

Fair point Aslan ,

I wonder however how you would react to a war,  which attacks your way of life, beliefs etc at your doorstep!

(im not trying to pick a fight , I know you would hide under the stairs  tongue.gif )

Well user posted image

I have and will defend myself and my loved ones from any harm that might happen to venture our way.

I did try and join the military (As mush as I loathe the Monarchy) I wanted to be pilot but my lazy ass eye failed me disgust.gif.

I agreed with the war in that Mr Hussain should be and thankfully has been removed, Im am appauled that a government I voted for blantantly lied about the 15 minute thing.

Anyhoow , If I had been in th R.A.F  I would have served my country to the death regardless on my personal feelings about it. The Military is about following the chain of command otherwise the military is as usless as a world armed with nukes.

The guy should go to Jail period, You serve your country  or you serve your time user posted image

Edited by Scar, 24 February 2004 - 09:37 PM.

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#18    Talon

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 09:38 PM

QUOTE
It's a contract... You are obvious not familiar with U.S. Military Policies.

It's like this,You sign up, then... ... well to quote fluffy from an earlier post


This is why.... If I had signed up... I would go to war... why do you keep arguing this point... it is the way it is... you can't change facts... it is the way the U.S. Military works... like it or not!


Doesn't really answer my question. He signed up and fought a war for you, then he decided it wasn't right for him, maybe he wanted a family or something, or was sickened him, either way your system left him with no option but to flee.
Had it been McDonalds he had left I doubt you'd be calling him a coward. At least he unlike so many of you actually fought at least once.

"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." -Plato

#19    Nxt2Hvn

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 09:45 PM

QUOTE (Talon S. @ Feb 24 2004, 08:38 PM)
Doesn't really answer my question.

Working for McDonalds is not working for the U.S. Military!!

I'm not sure what else ther is for you to understand.... he signed up.. like a contraact... with the U.S. Military.

When he signed up he knew before he singed up ... that he would not get out until his contract was up... war or no war..

That is policy.. the way it is.... they way the U.S. Military works.... he should not have signed up...and since he did fight in the first Gulf War... more than likely he has had chances to get out.... and he has re-signed into the Military... so this guy knew what he was getting in to!



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#20    Talon

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 09:49 PM

Your missing the point. So he broke a contract, big deal, why does him fight in Afghanistan and then decide enough is enough and leaving (breaking a contract or not) make him any more cowardly than someone who has never fought at all?

Surely it is the people he fought for but did not fit who are the cowards?

"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." -Plato

#21    Nxt2Hvn

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 09:57 PM

WHATEVER!

We are not on the same page... I'm over it!!

Believe what you want!  thumbsup.gif


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#22    Scar

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 10:02 PM

QUOTE (Talon S. @ Feb 24 2004, 08:49 PM)
Your missing the point. So he broke a contract, big deal, why does him fight in Afghanistan and then decide enough is enough and leaving (breaking a contract or not) make him any more cowardly than someone who has never fought at all?

Surely it is the people he fought for but did not fit who are the cowards?

If I am to read this right ,

A person who doesn't meet the requirements to join the Armed forces is a coward  blink.gif

Okay I know thats not what you meant (I hope)  

I think the Guy has a right to choose what he belives , but I'm sure some of  his fellow warriors in combat might have felt the same about Irag BUT followed the chain of command, which i think is a key principle in any military or orginization

The Guy is a Coward because , There would have been a clear indication on his contract that desertion would have some kind of punishment.

The man ran away from the consquence's of his action's. In my book that Is Cowardly

Edited by Scar, 24 February 2004 - 10:03 PM.

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#23    babyforrest

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 11:49 PM

So when you sign up for the US military, how long until your contract is up?

Let's rock this joint!

#24    Fluffybunny

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 03:30 AM

QUOTE (babyforrest @ Feb 24 2004, 03:49 PM)
So when you sign up for the US military, how long until your contract is up?

It depends. If the job you choose(MOS) has a short training time(Infantry and the like) it can be as little as 2 or 3 years. If the job you choose takes a lot more training(Medic/Electronics...) it is 4 years minimum.

Too many people on both sides of the spectrum have fallen into this mentality that a full one half of the country are the enemy for having different beliefs...in a country based on freedom of expression. It is this infighting that allows the focus to be taken away from "we the people" being able to watch, and have control over government corruption and ineptitude that is running rampant in our leadership.

People should be working towards fixing problems, not creating them.

#25    Kismit

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 04:02 AM

QUOTE
Leaving the country when you have already given your word of honor to support and defend it is frowned upon...

Just because I'm a bit of a sucker  for legalease , how is the contract worded ? Does ita actually say that you are to defend your country ? Do you actually sign up and agree to invade another country if necissary . I know that's badly worded and I'm sorry I don't wish to participate in a debate on the war so try not to be tempted .
I have often said that suport for the soldiers is not the same as support for the war , we have to remember not all the soldiers involved actually want to be involved .
Perhaps the so called coward is actually alot stauncher than we take him for. It can't be easy to have to go to such extremes, leaving family and country , risking imprisonment, to avoid a fight you don't want to be a part of .


#26    joc

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 04:23 AM

QUOTE
Better to live as a sheep than die as a tiger has always been my motto.


We in the States that allow conceal and carry gun laws have a motto:

Better tried by 12 than carried by 6. wink2.gif

Btw, don't tigers eat sheep? w00t.gif  

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#27    DC09

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 04:31 AM

QUOTE (joc @ Feb 24 2004, 10:23 PM)
QUOTE
Better to live as a sheep than die as a tiger has always been my motto.


We in the States that allow conceal and carry gun laws have a motto:

Better tried by 12 than carried by 6. wink2.gif

Btw, don't tigers eat sheep? w00t.gif

  laugh.gif  cool.gif  thumbsup.gif  


#28    KayEl

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 01:25 PM

Personally, instead of sending our men and women overseas where they are getting killed everyday, we should just seal our borders from the MIddle East.
Of course, we can't do that. We might offend some people.

If it would save at least one American life, it would well worth it.


#29    Seraphina

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 07:04 PM

You know, that's something I considered myself a while back...sometimes I look at the middle east at a cultural level, and just conclude that they're not on the same level we are, cannot think of exist with the same ideals and thinking that we do, and quite frankly, we canot coexist with them.

However, at the end of the day, the population of the middle east numbers in the millions, and the terrorists number in a thousands...while I do maintain that, as a culture, a great many of them are at the same level we were during the crusades, there's got to be a line drawn between protecting yourself, and turning xenophobic.

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