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2+2=4 equates a certainty of god


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#811    churchanddestroy

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 04:11 AM

Tangerine Sheri on Aug 4 2008, 08:34 PM, said:

i think church by all standards is one heck of a fair and compassionate  young man  and worth the trouble of  finding a way to make peace with....because  he will and he will see your side too Um is lucky to have him IMO....

Thank you for vouching for me Sheri.

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#812    Agent. Mulder

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 04:24 AM

MEATLOAF on Aug 4 2008, 10:15 PM, said:

Spirit photographs exist as well.  While there are no known recordings or images of God


then why did you say it Did before?

MEATLOAF on Aug 4 2008, 10:15 PM, said:

anything suggesting the existence of spiritual beings strengthens the concept of God's existence.


no. not at all. it would just suggest the paranormal and super natural. which is fine with me. i dig that stuff.

the truth is out there....

#813    MEATLOAF

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 04:49 AM

Agent. Mulder on Aug 5 2008, 02:24 PM, said:

then why did you say it Did before?


Bad wording on my part, I apologize.


Agent. Mulder on Aug 5 2008, 02:24 PM, said:

no. not at all. it would just suggest the paranormal and super natural. which is fine with me. i dig that stuff.


God himself is a paranormal entity.  Most collections of texts centered around God mention a spiritual world as well.  To say that EVPs, ghost images, etc. could reaffirm God is a natural assumption on my part.


#814    Agent. Mulder

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 04:52 AM

MEATLOAF on Aug 5 2008, 05:49 AM, said:

God himself is a paranormal entity.  Most collections of texts centered around God mention a spiritual world as well.  To say that EVPs, ghost images, etc. could reaffirm God is a natural assumption on my part.


IMO, i dont think it would lend any credence to god. BUT, do i think it would lend some credence to a spirit world, or something of the sort? For Sho.
but even if man Never came up with the idea of god. as in, No culture came up with any. we'd still be getting pics, and vids of odd lights, people or 'entities' in there. or images on thermal cams, and it wouldnt have anything to do with god. just the spirits or apparitions.

the truth is out there....

#815    MEATLOAF

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 05:42 AM

Agent. Mulder on Aug 5 2008, 02:52 PM, said:

IMO, i dont think it would lend any credence to god. BUT, do i think it would lend some credence to a spirit world, or something of the sort? For Sho.
but even if man Never came up with the idea of god. as in, No culture came up with any. we'd still be getting pics, and vids of odd lights, people or 'entities' in there. or images on thermal cams, and it wouldnt have anything to do with god. just the spirits or apparitions.


The spirit world and God are often heavily intertwined.  A spirit-world implies an after-life.  An after-life would most likely need a regulated system to operate by.  The regulator of this system would probably be a perfect and all-knowing individual, or, in other words, God.

Edited by MEATLOAF, 05 August 2008 - 05:43 AM.


#816    Agent. Mulder

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 05:55 AM

MEATLOAF on Aug 5 2008, 06:42 AM, said:

The spirit world and God are often heavily intertwined.  A spirit-world implies an after-life.  An after-life would most likely need a regulated system to operate by.  The regulator of this system would probably be a perfect and all-knowing individual, or, in other words, God.


i know they are Now. but thats my point. if man didnt come up with any gods, then we'd Still be seeing and photographing these things, regardless. meaning, i dont think it lends any credence to god existing.
and we dont know what the after-life is like, or if there IS one, and if someones 'running' it.

the truth is out there....

#817    Ecchi

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 05:59 AM

No no "2+2=4" is a mathematical equation .

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#818    Marcus Aurelius

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 06:19 AM

MEATLOAF on Aug 5 2008, 01:42 AM, said:

The spirit world and God are often heavily intertwined.  A spirit-world implies an after-life.  An after-life would most likely need a regulated system to operate by.  The regulator of this system would probably be a perfect and all-knowing individual, or, in other words, God.



Agreed. The idea that we even have a soul, that SOMETHING does survive suggests God to me as well. I mean, if the soul exists, then how did that get there? It certainly is not biological. How could any 'spiritual plane' come about if there is no God, no author? If spirit exists, then the spiritual realm exists, if the spiritual realm exists......where did it all come from? Its not a material existence, so what is it?

I think if anyone believes in ghosts, they should almost, by default believe in a God of some sort. Personal or impersonal. Just SOMETHING, you know?

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#819    Agent. Mulder

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 06:36 AM

brahman1888 on Aug 5 2008, 07:19 AM, said:

Agreed. The idea that we even have a soul, that SOMETHING does survive suggests God to me as well. I mean, if the soul exists, then how did that get there? It certainly is not biological. How could any 'spiritual plane' come about if there is no God, no author? If spirit exists, then the spiritual realm exists, if the spiritual realm exists......where did it all come from? Its not a material existence, so what is it?

I think if anyone believes in ghosts, they should almost, by default believe in a God of some sort. Personal or impersonal. Just SOMETHING, you know?


easy. like in my comment above. whether or not people created gods, wed still be seeing these things today. it doesnt make a god any more believable though.

the truth is out there....

#820    MARAB0D

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 06:46 AM

MEATLOAF on Aug 5 2008, 05:42 PM, said:

The spirit world and God are often heavily intertwined.  A spirit-world implies an after-life.  An after-life would most likely need a regulated system to operate by.  The regulator of this system would probably be a perfect and all-knowing individual, or, in other words, God.


"Often interwined"??? Where did you get this? God is God, an origin of all things existing, including us. Spirit World is what we make up ourselves - what God has to do with it? All it is, we create "astral" - a rubbish dump for the dead emotions (elementals), wasteland for incompletely dead people (ghosts) and our current emotions, what's God's part in this? We are Images of God, we are entitled to have our own little "creations", so we create them - and this is what is called "spirit-world".  God is Perfect, as such God can have no desires or emotions - and the world you talk about is MADE of emotions!

The structure of this our physical world is pretty simple - there is God, who is in fact just a Point, a Nothing, God is not here, God is out of this place; and there is God's reflection in Matter, which is everything around us - a neutron, a photon, an atom, a molecule, a planet, a dog, a human. We are more advanced than any dog we know, so we think we are the top - and, indeed, here on little earth we are the leading form of the Images of God. There is nothing else except God and God's images in Matter - there is no spirits, no angels, no phoenix bird, no Santa, no Tooth-fairy. Do not delude yourself - you are ALONE facing your Origin, which is God. There is no one in between for you to blame for your own imperfectness.


#821    MEATLOAF

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 06:48 AM

Agent. Mulder on Aug 5 2008, 03:55 PM, said:

i know they are Now. but thats my point. if man didnt come up with any gods, then we'd Still be seeing and photographing these things, regardless. meaning, i dont think it lends any credence to god existing.
and we dont know what the after-life is like, or if there IS one, and if someones 'running' it.


The spirit world itself implies a higher power even without prior knowledge of God.  From the evidence of the spirit world, we can infer that there is more to the universe than what is physical.  Just as the physical world needs limitations, the spirit world would as well.  Imagine if every spirit were allowed to roam with no limitation or order.  The ghost of Hitler could finish the awful plan created while he was alive.  If someone you love were to die, you needn't worry, as you can simply call their name and they will come and speak to you whenever you wish.  

It doesn't work like that, and, in many cases, that is a very good thing.  There are quite a few dead people out there that did horrible things while the were in their physical bodies, and one can only imagine what they would do in spiritual forms with boundless power.  No matter how one may think the afterlife works, it is generally believed that the good should be separate from the bad.  This kind of system, once again, would need a higher power to be regulated properly.

Marabod, your statements imply God in their own way.  How could emotions manifest themselves without a non-physical medium to do so?  They would need a spiritual realm.  And, also, I must ask how your idea of the spiritual realm could explain the fact that certain rituals can allow humans to summon and interact with mere "emotions"?  Sorry, but a spiritual realm would need an order to it.  If spirits were allowed free roam, there would likely be quite the horrid outcome.

Edited by MEATLOAF, 05 August 2008 - 06:58 AM.


#822    MARAB0D

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 06:53 AM

MEATLOAF on Aug 5 2008, 06:48 PM, said:

The spirit world itself implies a higher power even without prior knowledge of God.  From the evidence of the spirit world, we can infer that there is more to the universe than what is physical.  Just as the physical world needs limitations, the spirit world would as well.  Imagine if every spirit were allowed to roam with no limitation or order.  The ghost of Hitler could finish the awful plan created while he was alive.  If someone you love were to die, you needn't worry, as you can simply call their name and they will come and speak to you whenever you wish.  

It doesn't work like that, and, in many cases, that is a very good thing.  There are quite a few dead people out there that did horrible things while the were in their physical bodies, and one can only imagine what they would do in spiritual forms with boundless power.  No matter how one may think the afterlife works, it is generally believed that the good should be separate from the bad.  This kind of system, once again, would need a higher power to be regulated properly.


Find me "spirit world" in the Bible. I am telling you - there is no "spirits" or "angels", you are FULLY responsible for yourself and you have no one to blame. You represent God here, same as I do or anyone of us does. You are the Ambassador of God in the material world, bugger the spirits, they are long ago dead and recycled.


#823    MEATLOAF

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 07:02 AM

marabod on Aug 5 2008, 04:53 PM, said:

Find me "spirit world" in the Bible. I am telling you - there is no "spirits" or "angels", you are FULLY responsible for yourself and you have no one to blame. You represent God here, same as I do or anyone of us does. You are the Ambassador of God in the material world, bugger the spirits, they are long ago dead and recycled.


Once again, humans can use certain rituals to summon and interact with spirits.  I find it hard to believe that people can have something of a conversation or meeting with things that are nothing but trapped emotions.  Emotions are raw, they cannot think and act alone as many spirits have been known to do.

Edited by MEATLOAF, 05 August 2008 - 07:05 AM.


#824    MARAB0D

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 07:32 AM

MEATLOAF on Aug 5 2008, 07:02 PM, said:

Once again, humans can use certain rituals to summon and interact with spirits.  I find it hard to believe that people can have something of a conversation or meeting with things that are nothing but trapped emotions.  Emotions are raw, they cannot think and act alone as many spirits have been known to do.


I told you - all this crap you talk about resides in "astral", it has nothing to do with God, as astral is where we keep all those spirits, demons, vampires and kleinegotts we created for ourselves. Why take my word? Go and check for yourself! The entry procedure is pretty simple, you do not need to be a soccerer for this! Anyone can do it, just a bit of caution is required. You can use standard RV procedure or protocole, it seems by now they have removed this from the net, but few years ago they were published all around. Just walk up the tunnels until you get to the Light, but instead of entering the Light (you would die if you do) you look around underneath it, and you would see a black hole, which is astral entry. Thats all it is! As a general rule, you stay closer to dark places, as ligher places at the entry can be a faked Light, which is just an entry to Recycling Station. There must be few precautions taken and the code of conduct clearly learned, otherwise they would take your teeth for a necklace, but in general it is quite safe if you do not behave as a pushover. Don't come close to anyone there, and do not let anyone to come close to you, just chop the punks into sawdust, no mercy. From there you can see what these your "spirits" are and what a mess this astral is. You also can use it to travel to alpha centaurus, but this would not add too much to your knowledge, this is all just same old blah-blah, you won't find God in that place, I assure you.


#825    MEATLOAF

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Posted 05 August 2008 - 07:46 AM

marabod on Aug 5 2008, 05:32 PM, said:

I told you - all this crap you talk about resides in "astral", it has nothing to do with God, as astral is where we keep all those spirits, demons, vampires and kleinegotts we created for ourselves. Why take my word? Go and check for yourself! The entry procedure is pretty simple, you do not need to be a soccerer for this! Anyone can do it, just a bit of caution is required. You can use standard RV procedure or protocole, it seems by now they have removed this from the net, but few years ago they were published all around. Just walk up the tunnels until you get to the Light, but instead of entering the Light (you would die if you do) you look around underneath it, and you would see a black hole, which is astral entry. Thats all it is! As a general rule, you stay closer to dark places, as ligher places at the entry can be a faked Light, which is just an entry to Recycling Station. There must be few precautions taken and the code of conduct clearly learned, otherwise they would take your teeth for a necklace, but in general it is quite safe if you do not behave as a pushover. Don't come close to anyone there, and do not let anyone to come close to you, just chop the punks into sawdust, no mercy. From there you can see what these your "spirits" are and what a mess this astral is. You also can use it to travel to alpha centaurus, but this would not add too much to your knowledge, this is all just same old blah-blah, you won't find God in that place, I assure you.


I'm don't really support the whole astral thing, however, even such a plane existed, it cannot be explained using traditional science.  It would have to be created by a source other than the big bang.  It's very existence would be caused by a higher power, as only a higher power would have use for such a thing.





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