Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


- - - - -

McCain camp accuses Obama of playing race


  • Please log in to reply
49 replies to this topic

#31    ninjadude

ninjadude

    Seeker of truths

  • Member
  • 11,047 posts
  • Joined:11 Sep 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Illinois

  • "dirt collects at the interfaces"

Posted 02 August 2008 - 06:18 PM

the14u2cee on Aug 1 2008, 10:00 PM, said:

Please, Obama has flipped and flopped his whole campaign, The Black voter's are against Obama, maybe you haven't seen my other post on the Preacher who wants all Black Americans to boycott Oprah and most News stations because they are leaning to wards Obama, I can put that video on here...


Please give us some examples of flipping the "whole" campaign. The facts are, he has changed relatively few positions.

Obama is "getting" the black voters about 90%+ both in the primaries and current polls. Extremists get news but that's about it.

"Whatever you can do or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic in it. Begin it now!""
- Friedrich Nietzsche

#32    Incorrigible1

Incorrigible1

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,393 posts
  • Joined:04 Oct 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Eastern Nebraska, USA

  • Champanya?

Posted 02 August 2008 - 10:02 PM

ninjadude on Aug 2 2008, 01:18 PM, said:

Please give us some examples of flipping the "whole" campaign. The facts are, he has changed relatively few positions.

This morning BHO seems to have broached increased off-shore oil drilling. Amazing.

If a nation values anything more than freedom, it will lose its freedom; and the irony of it is that if it is comfort or money that it values more, it will lose that too. -- W. Somerset Maugham
Posted Image

#33    __Kratos__

__Kratos__

    -Staring-

  • Member
  • 25,876 posts
  • Joined:13 Oct 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Inside the moon

  • As darkness falls, night unfolds ebony wings to wrap the world in it's dark embrace.

Posted 02 August 2008 - 10:05 PM

ninjadude on Aug 2 2008, 01:13 PM, said:

So what's your response when someone smears you? (and the McCain camp did do this) Tell eveyone how great a guy he is?


McCain didn't attack his name nor his color of skin. So yes, he was playing the race card.

"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." ~Philip K. Dick

"Passion, peace. Strength, knowledge. Power, serenity. Victory, harmony. Freedom, the Force." ~Ashara Zavros

#34    Startraveler

Startraveler

    Fleet Captain

  • Member
  • 4,524 posts
  • Joined:25 Jun 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New England

  • Knowledge Brings Fear.

Posted 03 August 2008 - 05:40 PM

Quote

McCain didn't attack his name nor his color of skin. So yes, he was playing the race card.


Dog-whistle politics doesn't rely on directly attacking someone based on their skin color; that would get a backlash, which is obviously undesirable. No, it's more along the lines of having a young white woman seductively say "Call me, Harold" to a black candidate in an ad in order to stand up the antennae of voters uncomfortable with miscegenation (one could argue whether is juxtaposing a black candidate with two young white women is a similar attempt to stir up certain sentiments). We now have a line of attack in which a black candidate is being labeled as presumptuous and arrogant by his opponent (and a complicit media) for doing the exact same sorts of things that opponent is doing (and, indeed, in at least one case, taking that opponent's suggestion to do something). The implication here is that Obama doesn't know his place (presumptuous is dangerously close to the racially-charged "uppity"). We even have people like yourself suggesting there is something unusual about Obama getting 90% of the black vote, even after it was pointed out to you that any Democratic presidential candidate would be expected to get 88-90% of the black vote.  

There seem to be two major lines of attack on Obama being perpetrated by Republicans (and I hear reflections of these from many people):
1) We don't know if we can trust him. This meme taps into the subconscious seeds that were planted through whisper campaigns and viral emails months ago: Obama is somehow foreign, he's different, don't you know what his middle name is, oh and did you hear what his black preacher at his black church said? I've seen this sentiment rationalized into a false belief that there are McCain-esque inconsistencies in Obama's record. But the underlying reality isn't far from what Obama himself said: he doesn't look like those guys on the money. Don't forget and in case you do, I'll show his face in every ad I put out.
2) He isn't ready and is presumptuous for acting like he is. John McCain's *** has been filling a seat in the Senate longer, it's his turn, and Obama stealing his job from him is little more than an exercise in affirmative action ("he's getting special treatment! the media likes him and blacks are voting for him and . . ."). Obama's campaign and his actions show that he doesn't know his place.

Only certain segments are supposed to hear the dog-whistle. That's how it works.


#35    __Kratos__

__Kratos__

    -Staring-

  • Member
  • 25,876 posts
  • Joined:13 Oct 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Inside the moon

  • As darkness falls, night unfolds ebony wings to wrap the world in it's dark embrace.

Posted 03 August 2008 - 07:46 PM

Startraveler on Aug 3 2008, 12:40 PM, said:

Dog-whistle politics doesn't rely on directly attacking someone based on their skin color; that would get a backlash, which is obviously undesirable. No, it's more along the lines of having a young white woman seductively say "Call me, Harold" to a black candidate in an ad in order to stand up the antennae of voters uncomfortable with miscegenation (one could argue whether is juxtaposing a black candidate with two young white women is a similar attempt to stir up certain sentiments). We now have a line of attack in which a black candidate is being labeled as presumptuous and arrogant by his opponent (and a complicit media) for doing the exact same sorts of things that opponent is doing (and, indeed, in at least one case, taking that opponent's suggestion to do something). The implication here is that Obama doesn't know his place (presumptuous is dangerously close to the racially-charged "uppity").


It isn't close. You can say the same thing about McCain and it wouldn't have anything remotely to do with him being white.


Startraveler on Aug 3 2008, 12:40 PM, said:

We even have people like yourself suggesting there is something unusual about Obama getting 90% of the black vote, even after it was pointed out to you that any Democratic presidential candidate would be expected to get 88-90% of the black vote.


I only saw it on cnn the other day and it was the "black community" questioning that brought it up as different. CNN has this thing about being black in America right now so they're on quite a bit.

Even after? You only pointed it out a few days ago and I haven't really been online much since then and have yet to say it again so I'm not sure where you got that one from?

Startraveler on Aug 3 2008, 12:40 PM, said:

There seem to be two major lines of attack on Obama being perpetrated by Republicans (and I hear reflections of these from many people):
1) We don't know if we can trust him. This meme taps into the subconscious seeds that were planted through whisper campaigns and viral emails months ago: Obama is somehow foreign, he's different, don't you know what his middle name is, oh and did you hear what his black preacher at his black church said? I've seen this sentiment rationalized into a false belief that there are McCain-esque inconsistencies in Obama's record. But the underlying reality isn't far from what Obama himself said: he doesn't look like those guys on the money. Don't forget and in case you do, I'll show his face in every ad I put out.


Umm... It was the Clinton supporters that first started that he couldn't be trusted and that he was still too n00bish to lead.

That line has nothing to do with what you just said. Obama was responding to the ad with spears and hilton in it questioning his ability to lead. He's pretty new to this and people don't know him that well.

Startraveler on Aug 3 2008, 12:40 PM, said:

2) He isn't ready and is presumptuous for acting like he is. John McCain's *** has been filling a seat in the Senate longer, it's his turn, and Obama stealing his job from him is little more than an exercise in affirmative action ("he's getting special treatment! the media likes him and blacks are voting for him and . . ."). Obama's campaign and his actions show that he doesn't know his place.

Only certain segments are supposed to hear the dog-whistle. That's how it works.


Well as stated before he is new to this and it's not just the republicans that have brought this up but nearly all the dems before. Also his place has been a junior senator, compared to decades of service from McCain.

Well the media likes him... That's hard to question.

Has nothing to do with him being black... Only people really concerned about color of skin in this race are Obama and his supporters.



"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." ~Philip K. Dick

"Passion, peace. Strength, knowledge. Power, serenity. Victory, harmony. Freedom, the Force." ~Ashara Zavros

#36    Startraveler

Startraveler

    Fleet Captain

  • Member
  • 4,524 posts
  • Joined:25 Jun 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New England

  • Knowledge Brings Fear.

Posted 03 August 2008 - 08:16 PM

Quote

It isn't close. You can say the same thing about McCain and it wouldn't have anything remotely to do with him being white.


Race-baiting doesn't work symmetrically. Moreover, dog-whistle tactics are most effective when there is a layer of seemingly innocuous (if pointless) meaning piled on top. It's entirely possible that the McCain ad team is simply so inept that they ran a commercial designed to make the point that Obama is extremely popular. The random juxtaposition of his image with two young white women (instead of a celebrity Obama is actually associated with like, say, Oprah) might just be window dressing and had no (intentional) symbolic meaning. That's just one commercial and, sure, we can extend them the benefit of the doubt on that one.

But that doesn't change the nature of the narrative that's being constructed around Obama. Attack ads are, by their nature, designed to bring out the worst in politics and that's the road McCain has chosen. Now that the door's been opened, I'm sure we'll see much worse, if not from McCain then from surrogates or "independent" groups. Obama is different and he is dangerous. The "why's" of that are still being fleshed out on cutting room floors somewhere.


Quote

Well the media likes him... That's hard to question.


Actually, it's not. The Center for Media and Public Affairs released a study last week revealing that

Barack Obama is getting more negative coverage than John McCain on TV network evening news shows, reversing Obama’s lead in good press during the primaries, according to a new study by Center for Media and Public Affairs (CMPA).  The study also finds that a majority of both candidates’ coverage is unfavorable for the first time this year.  According to CMPA President Dr. S. Robert Lichter, “Obama replaced McCain as the media’s favorite candidate after New Hampshire.  But now the networks are voting no on both candidates.”


First up on their list of findings? "Since the primaries ended, on-air evaluations of Barack Obama have been 72% negative (vs. 28% positive).  That’s worse than John McCain’s coverage, which has been 57% negative (vs. 43% positive) during the same time period."

Edited by Startraveler, 03 August 2008 - 08:18 PM.


#37    __Kratos__

__Kratos__

    -Staring-

  • Member
  • 25,876 posts
  • Joined:13 Oct 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Inside the moon

  • As darkness falls, night unfolds ebony wings to wrap the world in it's dark embrace.

Posted 03 August 2008 - 08:24 PM

Startraveler on Aug 3 2008, 03:16 PM, said:

Race-baiting doesn't work symmetrically. Moreover, dog-whistle tactics are most effective when there is a layer of seemingly innocuous (if pointless) meaning piled on top. It's entirely possible that the McCain ad team is simply so inept that they ran a commercial designed to make the point that Obama is extremely popular. The random juxtaposition of his image with two young white women (instead of a celebrity Obama is actually associated with like, say, Oprah) might just be window dressing and had no (intentional) symbolic meaning. That's just one commercial and, sure, we can extend them the benefit of the doubt on that one.

But that doesn't change the nature of the narrative that's being constructed around Obama. Attack ads are, by their nature, designed to bring out the worst in politics and that's the road McCain has chosen. Now that the door's been opened, I'm sure we'll see much worse, if not from McCain then from surrogates or "independent" groups. Obama is different and he is dangerous. The "why's" of that are still being fleshed out on cutting room floors somewhere.


So basically you're just making up race questionable items in the ads you see.

The point of that commercial was that he was popular but that isn't equal to the ability to lead.

lol, Again, McCain hasn't had his ads or his speeches geared to the fact that Obama is black or has a 'funny name'.

Startraveler on Aug 3 2008, 03:16 PM, said:

Actually, it's not. The Center for Media and Public Affairs released a study last week revealing that

Barack Obama is getting more negative coverage than John McCain on TV network evening news shows, reversing Obama’s lead in good press during the primaries, according to a new study by Center for Media and Public Affairs (CMPA).  The study also finds that a majority of both candidates’ coverage is unfavorable for the first time this year.  According to CMPA President Dr. S. Robert Lichter, “Obama replaced McCain as the media’s favorite candidate after New Hampshire.  But now the networks are voting no on both candidates.”


First up on their list of findings? "Since the primaries ended, on-air evaluations of Barack Obama have been 72% negative (vs. 28% positive).  That’s worse than John McCain’s coverage, which has been 57% negative (vs. 43% positive) during the same time period."


I was basing that comment of mine off the recent overseas trip.


"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." ~Philip K. Dick

"Passion, peace. Strength, knowledge. Power, serenity. Victory, harmony. Freedom, the Force." ~Ashara Zavros

#38    Startraveler

Startraveler

    Fleet Captain

  • Member
  • 4,524 posts
  • Joined:25 Jun 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New England

  • Knowledge Brings Fear.

Posted 03 August 2008 - 08:41 PM

Quote

So basically you're just making up race questionable items in the ads you see.


If by "making up" you mean using my eyes. You're not going to see an ad that says "Obama is black or has a 'funny name'."

When Reagan made his first stop after the '80 convention at Philadelphia, MS (with its particular racial history) and said "I believe in states’ rights," one didn't have to "make up" the implicit meaning. Someone could easily argue he was just supporting the devolution revolution. And that's the point: the target audience hears and appreciates the more unsavory meaning, while everyone else says "no, it couldn't possibly have meant that." (although with hindsight it becomes very clear) It doesn't matter how that person interprets it because they weren't the target audience, the dog-whistle wasn't meant for their ears.

When you watch ads, look for the different layers of meaning. Try and figure who the target of the ad is. What ideas are they trying to cram into your head without saying it? Both sides do it; you don't think an ad like this is just meant to trumpet Obama's change message, do you?

linked-image

But similarly, given the context of the past year (madrasahs, "Hussein, Hussein, Hussein," pictures of traditional garb, etc, etc) one wonders if there's a purpose to this?
linked-image

Edited by Startraveler, 03 August 2008 - 08:43 PM.


#39    __Kratos__

__Kratos__

    -Staring-

  • Member
  • 25,876 posts
  • Joined:13 Oct 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Inside the moon

  • As darkness falls, night unfolds ebony wings to wrap the world in it's dark embrace.

Posted 03 August 2008 - 08:47 PM

Startraveler on Aug 3 2008, 03:41 PM, said:

If by "making up" you mean using my eyes. You're not going to see an ad that says "Obama is black or has a 'funny name'."


And that's just it. He dropped the race card without any reason to do so from the McCain camp.

Startraveler on Aug 3 2008, 03:41 PM, said:

When you watch ads, look for the different layers of meaning. Try and figure who the target of the ad is. What ideas are they trying to cram into your head without saying it? Both sides do it; you don't think an ad like this is just meant to trumpet Obama's change message, do you?

linked-image

But similarly, given the context of the past year (madrasahs, "Hussein, Hussein, Hussein," pictures of traditional garb, etc, etc) one wonders if there's a purpose to this?
linked-image


So then by your own pointing out, Obama would have to be a hypocrite even if there was warrant for the race card drop.

The 'same old politics' have always meant to me that it was trying to link McCain with Bush.



Edited by __Kratos__, 03 August 2008 - 09:18 PM.

"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." ~Philip K. Dick

"Passion, peace. Strength, knowledge. Power, serenity. Victory, harmony. Freedom, the Force." ~Ashara Zavros

#40    HKCavalier

HKCavalier

    Remote Viewer

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 531 posts
  • Joined:24 Oct 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Wilds of America

Posted 11 October 2008 - 05:17 AM

So much for dog whistles...


#41    InHuman

InHuman

    Alien Abducter

  • Member
  • 4,492 posts
  • Joined:03 Aug 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Canada

  • Running on Bravado.

Posted 11 October 2008 - 06:25 AM

Incorrigible1 on Aug 2 2008, 03:02 PM, said:

This morning BHO seems to have broached increased off-shore oil drilling. Amazing.


He offered a compramise to the pubs to get them to work together with the dems.

ZOMG !

There Will Be Brawl
Greatest Webseries Ever



Quote

If you carry out a policy that dehumanizes others, in the process you yourself are dehumanized.-Desmond Tutu

#42    Incorrigible1

Incorrigible1

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,393 posts
  • Joined:04 Oct 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Eastern Nebraska, USA

  • Champanya?

Posted 11 October 2008 - 05:12 PM

InHuman on Oct 11 2008, 01:25 AM, said:

He offered a compramise to the pubs to get them to work together with the dems.

ZOMG !

OMG! He actually crossed the aisle. First times for everything, eh?

If a nation values anything more than freedom, it will lose its freedom; and the irony of it is that if it is comfort or money that it values more, it will lose that too. -- W. Somerset Maugham
Posted Image

#43    OilFight

OilFight

    Apparition

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 313 posts
  • Joined:28 Apr 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Earth

Posted 12 October 2008 - 03:05 PM

Incorrigible1 on Oct 11 2008, 10:12 AM, said:

OMG! He actually crossed the aisle. First times for everything, eh?


ZOMG! Mccain has flip-flopped on abortion, privatization of social security, gay marriage, and immigration - it's politics, ZOMG!


#44    ShaunZero

ShaunZero

    Non-Corporeal Being

  • Member
  • 8,339 posts
  • Joined:13 May 2005
  • Gender:Male

Posted 13 October 2008 - 01:56 AM

InHuman on Jul 31 2008, 11:38 PM, said:

Where/when?

And the Mccain camp have been throwing that around for many months, they say that the poor blacks/minorities that vote for him JUST because he isn't white are racist.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you saying that Mccain and his camp are saying that the poor blacks which vote for Obama just because he's black are racist for doing so? If so, I agree and disagree.

In a way, it is a bit racist, because they are basing their vote mainly on his race, but on the other hand, it's not necessarily saying they dislike white people. BUT, it also shows that they prefer vote for a black man than a white man, based on just color. I live in Louisiana, and in my town, African Americans are the majority. Everyone here is poor, not just the African Americans. Before this election, I'd never see or hear many African Amercan's promote anything related to politics. Now that Obama is running, they are wearing Obama T-Shirts, and promoting him like crazy. A few I know barely even know anything about politics or what Obama has to say. It sort of urkes the hell out of me how they can do something like this, and yet if I bump into a black guy on the street, I'm a racist for it.

I'd have probably voted for Obama(I'm white), if he wasn't tied to that racist **** church.

Edited by ShaunZero, 13 October 2008 - 01:57 AM.

"What if there were no hypothetical questions?" ~ George Carlin
Are you a cynic?

#45    HollyDolly

HollyDolly

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,319 posts
  • Joined:02 Aug 2006

Posted 13 October 2008 - 02:00 PM

InHuman on Aug 1 2008, 01:03 AM, said:

So what do you make of the people who DONT vote for him? Unamericans?

Just don't vote if thats your mindset. There is no "lesser of two evils"... theres idependents that would love your vote..


Yeah but both you know and I know the independents won't win the presidency.I voted for Ralph Nader, but he didn't win.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users