Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


* * * * * 1 votes

American Atlantis


  • Please log in to reply
1338 replies to this topic

#31    darkbreed

darkbreed

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,052 posts
  • Joined:04 Nov 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Argentina

Posted 01 September 2008 - 07:10 PM

Regarding the cocaine mummies perhaps this is something to take in consideration:
From http://www.colostate.edu/Depts/Entomology/...2000/wells.html

moofy13 on Sep 1 2008, 07:00 AM, said:

American Drugs in Egyptian Mummies: A Review of the Evidence

Samuel A. Wells

Abstract:

The recent findings of cocaine, nicotine, and hashish in Egyptian mummies by Balabanova et. al. have been criticized on grounds that: contamination of the mummies may have occurred, improper techniques may have been used, chemical decomposition may have produced the compounds in question, recent mummies of drug users were mistakenly evaluated, that no similar cases are known of such compounds in long-dead bodies, and especially that pre-Columbian transoceanic voyages are highly speculative. These criticisms are each discussed in turn. Balabanova et. al. are shown to have used and confirmed their findings with accepted methods. The possibility of the compounds being byproducts of decomposition is shown to be without precedent and highly unlikely. The possibility that the researchers made evaluations from of faked mummies of recent drug users is shown to be highly unlikely in almost all cases. Several additional cases of identified American drugs in mummies are discussed. Additionally, it is shown that significant evidence exists for contact with the Americas in pre-Columbian times. It is determined that the original findings are supported by substantial evidence despite the initial criticisms.

-SNIP-

Considerations
The initial reaction to the findings of Balabanova et. al. were highly critical. These criticisms were not based on a known failing in the authors' research methodology, rather they were attempts to cast doubt on an implication of the research - that cocaine and nicotine were brought to Egypt from the New World before Columbus. This conclusion is not acceptable to conservative investigators of the past. In fact it suggests a deep-rooted aversion to what Balabanova suggested might mean an unraveling of aspects of history contrary to basic reconstructions. This aversion, according to Kehoe (1998) stems from the conviction that Indians were primitive savages destined to be overcome by the civilized world - that the acme of evolutionary success resided in the conquering race itself. "Childlike savages could never have voyaged across oceans."

Balabanova's findings bring yet other evidence forward that humanity is not so easily pinioned into the pre-conceived notions of primitive and advanced - even as this might be related to the presumed technology of earlier times. The quest for discovery - to find new worlds - is not just a modern selective advantage of our species. Perhaps it is the defining characteristic.


Please read the full article for more information with replies to the critics regarding points like:

Analytical Techniques and Contamination

Faked Mummies

Chemical Changes

Isolated Example

Pre-Columbian Voyages to America


Full article at http://www.colostate.edu/Depts/Entomology/...2000/wells.html

moofy13 on Sep 1 2008, 07:00 AM, said:

If there was no link between any of these places, no communication, then why would everyone build pyramids, and not burrow underground. and before saying, well they worshiped the sun and everything. i think there is a definite connection between how these were built, and the schemes used in creating them. if it was common practice, you would have seen it all around the globe, and not just in three locations. Which all have a lot still left uncovered, i think you are right, DB.


www.PleiadianTalk.tk/ - Perspectives from a member of the Great White Brotherhood
American Atlantis Research - Documenting pre-colombian world migration and Atlantis-America
Increase your astral proection skills - Here at Unexplained Mysteries Forums!

#32    darkbreed

darkbreed

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,052 posts
  • Joined:04 Nov 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Argentina

Posted 01 September 2008 - 07:19 PM

Some other things that might be worth considering is some of what is mentioned in this wikipedia article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-Columbian...oceanic_contact

Introduction:

Quote

Pre-Columbian trans-oceanic contact describes alleged interactions between the indigenous peoples of the Americas and peoples of other continents – Africa, Asia, Europe, or Oceania – before the arrival of Christopher Columbus in 1492. Many such contacts have been proposed at various times, based on historical accounts, archaeological finds, and cultural comparisons.

However, claims of such contact are often controversial and hotly debated. Only one instance of such contact — the Norse settlement at L'Anse aux Meadows in Newfoundland, Canada c. A.D. 1000 — is widely regarded as definitively proved.


-EA

www.PleiadianTalk.tk/ - Perspectives from a member of the Great White Brotherhood
American Atlantis Research - Documenting pre-colombian world migration and Atlantis-America
Increase your astral proection skills - Here at Unexplained Mysteries Forums!

#33    Qoais

Qoais

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,268 posts
  • Joined:08 Nov 2007
  • Gender:Female

Posted 01 September 2008 - 08:20 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXphCO1YDw4

An open-minded view of the past allows for an unprejudiced glimpse into the future.

Intuitive knowledge is knowledge beyond intellectual reasoning.

"Intellectual brilliance is no guarantee against being dead wrong."

#34    Area69

Area69

    Ectoplasmic Residue

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 172 posts
  • Joined:27 Jul 2004

Posted 01 September 2008 - 08:24 PM

This is very good stuff.

How could it be "in the direction of the opposite continent" if it was the opposite continent? Well, perhaps North America was the opposite, and South America is in that general direction.

This is great because it explains something I've always wondered (and I'd love for you historians like jayelmurphy to tell me)... How the hell did Europeans speak to Native Americans shortly after getting here? I mean, if I go to Mexico, I'm not going to pick up the language almost instantly. How come the natives were not terrified of the white man on the horse, lots of accounts of them just meeting up and talking. How did they talk right off the bat?


#35    darkbreed

darkbreed

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,052 posts
  • Joined:04 Nov 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Argentina

Posted 01 September 2008 - 08:28 PM

Good point there, dunno why I didn't think of that myself =)

Sounds very likely that North America could have been the opposite continent when presented like that.

Thanks for the clue =)

-EA

Area69 on Sep 1 2008, 09:24 PM, said:

This is very good stuff.

How could it be "in the direction of the opposite continent" if it was the opposite continent? Well, perhaps North America was the opposite, and South America is in that general direction.

This is great because it explains something I've always wondered (and I'd love for you historians like jayelmurphy to tell me)... How the hell did Europeans speak to Native Americans shortly after getting here? I mean, if I go to Mexico, I'm not going to pick up the language almost instantly. How come the natives were not terrified of the white man on the horse, lots of accounts of them just meeting up and talking. How did they talk right off the bat?



www.PleiadianTalk.tk/ - Perspectives from a member of the Great White Brotherhood
American Atlantis Research - Documenting pre-colombian world migration and Atlantis-America
Increase your astral proection skills - Here at Unexplained Mysteries Forums!

#36    Area69

Area69

    Ectoplasmic Residue

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 172 posts
  • Joined:27 Jul 2004

Posted 01 September 2008 - 08:35 PM

Here's a whole 'nother look at it:

In 2012, that scary year we're all wondering about, the Earth is going to pass through the center of our solar system. It happens every 26,000 years.

Maybe when it happens, everyone and everything on Earth gets wiped out. Buildings are melted by cosmic radiation, we all die, the Earth flips over and stops rotating long enough for gravity to cease existing, we all fly off into space, the satellites all fly off into space, and then the Earth flys through the universe until something hits it, makes it start spinning again, the whole thing starts over. Kind of like the Matrix, but with less leather and the same amount of plot holes.

So, maybe Atlantis was nothing more than a city during one of these civilizations that was flooded shortly before we got wiped out. Maybe there were rich people during the other eradications that lived underground to keep from dying and then when the world started turning again, they all came out, and that's where the underground people myths started.

So maybe Atlantis was just some city like New Orleans. Say we all die in 2012, the world starts spinning properly in 2050. Some little toga wearing city boy philosopher type pops up and starts warning people not to be bad, like New Orleans was! Or else we're all going to  die.

I just combined three conspiracy theories into one post, beat that.


#37    1.618

1.618

    Poltergeist

  • Member
  • 2,543 posts
  • Joined:09 Aug 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Northampton, Northamptonshire, England.

Posted 01 September 2008 - 08:39 PM

That was it..chemical changes.



#38    1.618

1.618

    Poltergeist

  • Member
  • 2,543 posts
  • Joined:09 Aug 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Northampton, Northamptonshire, England.

Posted 01 September 2008 - 08:41 PM

Area69 on Sep 1 2008, 09:24 PM, said:

This is very good stuff.

How could it be "in the direction of the opposite continent" if it was the opposite continent? Well, perhaps North America was the opposite, and South America is in that general direction.

This is great because it explains something I've always wondered (and I'd love for you historians like jayelmurphy to tell me)... How the hell did Europeans speak to Native Americans shortly after getting here? I mean, if I go to Mexico, I'm not going to pick up the language almost instantly. How come the natives were not terrified of the white man on the horse, lots of accounts of them just meeting up and talking. How did they talk right off the bat?


Sign language. I have to comunicate with people who don't speak a word of english near every day at work.


#39    darkbreed

darkbreed

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,052 posts
  • Joined:04 Nov 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Argentina

Posted 01 September 2008 - 08:54 PM

Very interesting video there, those anomalies found is really curious. As I stated in my previous post with the google earth image showing what seems to be underwater structures in Guatemala this is something that should be researched further. Getting some divers up in those lakes should quickly solve this, and as mentioned in the video there has been found an underwater temple in Lake Titicaca which is fascinating and also strengthens the theory that there is an unknown possibly Atlantean civilization that has been around there long time ago and that later generations or other cultures that got into the area built around these older structures, again possibly in the same manner incas seem to have settled down in other areas where pre-existing structures were found.

Here is an old BBC news article on the Lake Titicaca finding:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/892616.stm

Some more indepth information about the area:
http://www.peru-explorer.com/titicaca.htm

Qoais on Sep 1 2008, 09:20 PM, said:

The Collao Plateau Is the geographical space, where ancient and Important cultures like Pucara and, later, Tiahuanaco, appeared.This is the region where, according to the legend, Manco Capac and Mama Ocllo emerged from the sacred Lake Titicaca to found the Inca Empire.

According to legend, this lake gave birth to the Inca civilization. Before the Incas, the lake and its islands were holy for the Aymará Indians, whose civilization was centered at the Tiahuanaco, now a complex of ruins on the Bolivian side of Titicaca but once a revered temple site with notably advanced irrigation techniques.


Qoais on Sep 1 2008, 09:20 PM, said:




www.PleiadianTalk.tk/ - Perspectives from a member of the Great White Brotherhood
American Atlantis Research - Documenting pre-colombian world migration and Atlantis-America
Increase your astral proection skills - Here at Unexplained Mysteries Forums!

#40    jaylemurph

jaylemurph

    Lector Historiae

  • Member
  • 8,968 posts
  • Joined:02 Nov 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Seattle, WA

  • "You can lead a whore to culture, but you can't make him think." Dorothy Parker

Posted 01 September 2008 - 09:21 PM

Area69 on Sep 1 2008, 04:24 PM, said:

This is very good stuff.

How could it be "in the direction of the opposite continent" if it was the opposite continent? Well, perhaps North America was the opposite, and South America is in that general direction.

This is great because it explains something I've always wondered (and I'd love for you historians like jayelmurphy to tell me)... How the hell did Europeans speak to Native Americans shortly after getting here? I mean, if I go to Mexico, I'm not going to pick up the language almost instantly. How come the natives were not terrified of the white man on the horse, lots of accounts of them just meeting up and talking. How did they talk right off the bat?


Well, it's not like Mexico was the first place the Spaniards arrived. By the time Cortez went into Mexico, there had already been missionaries sent over from Cuba and Hispaniola into Mexico who had learnt the languages there like Nahuatl and Maya, and natives who had learned Spanish. Cortez took a native lover who spoke both Nahautl and Maya and acted as his interpreter.

When Columbus first arrived in the New World, he records in his journal using a type of sign language to communicate with the natives. Later, he took 25 (I think) Indians back with him, of which 7 or 8 arrived alive in Spain. The onus was on them to learn Spanish, but later they taught more Europeans their languages, and the Europeans left in the New World learned some of the native languages.

Later on, in the first English colony in the New World, Thomas Harriot developed a particularly advanced sign language to talk to the Roanoke people, but didn't (unfortunately) leave any specifics about it.

--Jaylemurph



"... amongst the most obstinate of our opinions may be classed those which derive from discussions in which we affect to search for the truth, while in reality we are only fortifying prejudice."     -- James Fenimore Cooper, The Pathfinder

Posted Image

Deeply venial

#41    Keelo

Keelo

    Alien Embryo

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 18 posts
  • Joined:08 Aug 2008

Posted 01 September 2008 - 10:05 PM

I am going to be one of the few who has no skepticism on this topic. I find all the information Darkbreed has listed to be very plausible, and I can't reason to not fully agree. There just isn't enough difference between the two to make someone not even consider it. I'll bet there isn't one person who has doubts in their own skepticism on this topic.

{Dragons}
click>>Posted Image<<click
CLiCK>>Help us hatch!<<CLiCK
Do me a big favor.


#42    Pax Unum

Pax Unum

    < 420 Conspirator >

  • Member
  • 18,766 posts
  • Joined:06 Feb 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Suburbia

  • "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle

Posted 01 September 2008 - 10:37 PM

darkbreed on Sep 1 2008, 01:53 PM, said:

Pax Umum: I think I already explained why I dont think the timelines are so important here when it comes to Egypt and the Latin Americas. I stated that the Atlanteans may in fact have been influenced by for example the Egyptians with some things, or the Latin Americans, and if they were in contact they all probably influenced eachother in some way. Also a lot of the ancient stone monuments we are talking about is hard to date and even scientists themselves disagree on this, some date them way further back while others more recently. Just because "most" believe them to date to one timeline do not mean that this larger group needs to be correct. It has been shown many times in the past that the "larger groups" were wrong. And some stone monuments seem to have been built by earlier unknown civilizations such as the pre-incan, which the incan seem to have discovered, so yes perhaps the timelines is more or less correct when it comes to various cultures/civilizations themselves, but not necessarily all their construction as they may as in the Incan case have built upon already pre-existing monuments.

To me I see a lot of evidence suggesting a ancient contact between both these continents as well as several others. Just the "labyrinth" thing itself is evidence enough on that and I'd like to hear that properly explained without any contact between people of different continents.
http://mmmgroup.altervista.org/e-labiri.html

Wikipedia article on ancient labyrinths: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labyrinth

Considering the swastika have also been found in many ancient sites at related locations to where this labyrinth have been found, and have been part of ancient cultures in these locations, there may be a link there as well. While the swastika alone could have been created by different cultures independently on eachother due to its simple design, it is still a pretty unique sign, and the labyrinth is such a complex design that I find it really hard to believe they have managed to "come up" with the same labyrinth design all over the world without any contact between eachother that dates back to a common origin.

With that said I will try do some more research on the different places these two symbols have been found, and their connection to eachother and hopefully find out more about how old they are estimated to be in the different locations (There are so many so I have not been able to get much into the details of this yet.)

Look, if you’re going to rewrite history, and simply reject historic reality and substitute your own, then I don’t see what there is to discuss... for anyone to take this ‘theory’ serious you’ll have to prove the currently accepted history is wrong, scientifically. Otherwise this is just a baseless fantasy... IMO

good luck with your 'research'...


#43    Qoais

Qoais

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,268 posts
  • Joined:08 Nov 2007
  • Gender:Female

Posted 01 September 2008 - 11:09 PM

Did we cover this already?  Thought I'd read it before, but maybe not here:

Ancient Amazon Cities Found; Were Vast Urban Network

John Roach
for National Geographic News
August 28, 2008

Dozens of ancient, densely packed, towns, villages, and hamlets arranged in an organized pattern have been mapped in the Brazilian Amazon, anthropologists announced today.

The finding suggests that vast swathes of "pristine" rain forest may actually have been sophisticated urban landscapes prior to the arrival of European colonists.

"It is very different from what we might expect using certain classic models of urbanism," noted study co-author Michael Heckenberger, an anthropologist at the University of Florida in Gainesville.

Nevertheless, he said, the repeated patterns within and among settlements across the landscape suggest a highly ordered and planned society on par with any medieval European town.

The finding supports a controversial theory that the Amazon River Basin teemed with large societies that were all but obliterated by disease when European colonists arrived in the 15th and 16th centuries.

The isolated tribes that remain in the Amazon today are the last survivors of these once great societies, according to the theory.

(Related story: "'Uncontacted' Amazon Tribe Actually Known for Decades" [June 19, 2008])

If this theory is correct, the networked structure of the ancient settlements may lend insight to better protect and manage the indigenous populations and forests that remain in the Amazon today, scientists said.

Heckenberger and his colleagues from the U.S. and Brazil—including a member of the Kuikuro, an indigenous Amazonian tribe—report their finding today in the journal Science.

Urban Plan

In 1993, Heckenberger lived with the Kuikuro near the headwaters of the Xingu River. Within two weeks of his stay, he learned about the ancient settlements and began a 15-year effort to study and map them in detail.

So far he has identified at least two major clusters—or polities—of towns, villages, and hamlets. Each cluster contains a central seat of ritualistic power with wide roads radiating out to other communities.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...html?source=rss


An open-minded view of the past allows for an unprejudiced glimpse into the future.

Intuitive knowledge is knowledge beyond intellectual reasoning.

"Intellectual brilliance is no guarantee against being dead wrong."

#44    darkbreed

darkbreed

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,052 posts
  • Joined:04 Nov 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Argentina

Posted 02 September 2008 - 12:31 AM

Reject is not the right word, "correct" is. We might have to correct some things regarding what is considered historical facts. Many of which are just theories already in any case. For me I personally think all of the above mentioned things in my posts suggest that there has been an earlier contact between different civilizations and continents as the evidence is pretty strong as far I see - and I'm not the only one who believe this, there are many who agree including acknowledged scientists whom have studied and done research on this themselves. Many facts have been proven wrong in the past, so i am sure many current "facts" will also prove wrong later on.

If I was just making up a story with no evidence to support it sure it would be a fantasy, but I think there IS evidence to back up the claims, suggesting what I am speaking about possibly being true, and as you see many others agree to this as well. If you don't agree that's fine by me, I'm not claiming to be right in any case, but I'd like to see something that could disprove the theory, such as explanations to many of the things mentioned here as evidence suggesting a connection between the ancients of different continents.

"Accepted history" and "historical facts", as well as other "facts of reality" to call it that have been changed and revised many times throughout history, and I'm pretty sure that will continue as new discoveries and facts are coming forth.

One of these previous "facts" is actually about the discovery of America and contact with other continents itself. It used to be a "fact" that Columbus discovered America (heck many still believe that) but later on it turned out vikings had been there and settled down hundreds of years before, almost half a millennium before.

Pax Unum on Sep 1 2008, 10:37 PM, said:

A Norwegian ship's captain named Bjarni Herjólfsson first came across a part of the North American continent ca. 985 when he was blown off course sailing to Greenland from Iceland. Subsequent expeditions from Greenland (some led by Leif Erikson) explored the areas to the west, seeking large timbers for building in particular (Greenland had only small trees and brush). Regular activity from Greenland extended to Ellesmere Island, Skraeling Island and Ruin Island for hunting and trading with Inuit groups. A short-lived seasonal settlement was established at L'Anse aux Meadows, located in the northern part of Newfoundland, Canada.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viking#North_America

-EA

Pax Unum on Sep 1 2008, 10:37 PM, said:

Look, if you’re going to rewrite history, and simply reject historic reality and substitute your own, then I don’t see what there is to discuss... for anyone to take this ‘theory’ serious you’ll have to prove the currently accepted history is wrong, scientifically. Otherwise this is just a baseless fantasy... IMO

good luck with your 'research'...


www.PleiadianTalk.tk/ - Perspectives from a member of the Great White Brotherhood
American Atlantis Research - Documenting pre-colombian world migration and Atlantis-America
Increase your astral proection skills - Here at Unexplained Mysteries Forums!

#45    Pax Unum

Pax Unum

    < 420 Conspirator >

  • Member
  • 18,766 posts
  • Joined:06 Feb 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Suburbia

  • "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle

Posted 02 September 2008 - 01:05 AM

Qoais on Sep 1 2008, 06:09 PM, said:

Did we cover this already?  Thought I'd read it before, but maybe not here:

Ancient Amazon Cities Found; Were Vast Urban Network

John Roach
for National Geographic News
August 28, 2008

Dozens of ancient, densely packed, towns, villages, and hamlets arranged in an organized pattern have been mapped in the Brazilian Amazon, anthropologists announced today.

The finding suggests that vast swathes of "pristine" rain forest may actually have been sophisticated urban landscapes prior to the arrival of European colonists.

"It is very different from what we might expect using certain classic models of urbanism," noted study co-author Michael Heckenberger, an anthropologist at the University of Florida in Gainesville.

Nevertheless, he said, the repeated patterns within and among settlements across the landscape suggest a highly ordered and planned society on par with any medieval European town.

The finding supports a controversial theory that the Amazon River Basin teemed with large societies that were all but obliterated by disease when European colonists arrived in the 15th and 16th centuries.

The isolated tribes that remain in the Amazon today are the last survivors of these once great societies, according to the theory.

(Related story: "'Uncontacted' Amazon Tribe Actually Known for Decades" [June 19, 2008])

If this theory is correct, the networked structure of the ancient settlements may lend insight to better protect and manage the indigenous populations and forests that remain in the Amazon today, scientists said.

Heckenberger and his colleagues from the U.S. and Brazil—including a member of the Kuikuro, an indigenous Amazonian tribe—report their finding today in the journal Science.

Urban Plan

In 1993, Heckenberger lived with the Kuikuro near the headwaters of the Xingu River. Within two weeks of his stay, he learned about the ancient settlements and began a 15-year effort to study and map them in detail.

So far he has identified at least two major clusters—or polities—of towns, villages, and hamlets. Each cluster contains a central seat of ritualistic power with wide roads radiating out to other communities.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...html?source=rss

yeah, and on page 2 they state the height of these settlements date all the way back to A.D. 1250 and 1650, thousands of years after the beginning of the Egyptian culture...





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users