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Palin's Acceptance Speech @ RNC


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#31    Incorrigible1

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 01:48 AM

Startraveler on Sep 4 2008, 06:19 PM, said:

How, in the age of the internet, can a question like this be asked on the internet? Look it up.


Also, do look up what community organizing is.

Sponsored, not passed. Big Whoop.

If a nation values anything more than freedom, it will lose its freedom; and the irony of it is that if it is comfort or money that it values more, it will lose that too. -- W. Somerset Maugham
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#32    Startraveler

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 02:25 AM

Senate Passes Kerry-Obama Legislation to Close KBR Tax Loophole, Provide Tax Relief for Troops
WASHINGTON, D.C. - Senators John Kerry and Barack Obama today announced that the Senate passed the Heroes Earnings Assistance and Relief Tax Act of 2008 (The "HEART Act"). The Act would provide tax relief to the men and women in our nation's armed services and others volunteering service on behalf of the United States, including Peace Corps volunteers and AmeriCorps volunteers - and is paid for by the Kerry-Obama tax reform that closed the tax loophole that allowed defense contractor KBR to avoid paying its fair share of taxes. The Act passed the House yesterday and now goes to the President for his signature.


Obama, Lugar Secure Funding for Implementation of Nonproliferation Law
WASHINGTON, D.C. – U.S. Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) and Richard Lugar (R-IN) today announced that the Senate Appropriations Committee accepted their request to provide funding to implement the Lugar-Obama nonproliferation initiative. The Appropriations Committee expressed support for the initiative and provided $48 million for Lugar-Obama, $36 million for programs to destroy heavy conventional weapons, $10 million for efforts to intercept weapons and materials of mass destruction, and $2 million for rapid response to proliferation detection and interdiction emergencies. This is the culmination of an 18 month effort to authorize and fund the Lugar-Obama initiative.


Lugar-Obama Nonproliferation Legislation Signed into Law by the President
WASHINGTON – President Bush today signed the Lugar-Obama proliferation and threat reduction initiative into law.

Authored by U.S. Sens. Dick Lugar (R-IN) and Barack Obama (D-IL), the Lugar-Obama initiative expands U.S. cooperation to destroy conventional weapons. It also expands the State Department's ability to detect and interdict weapons and materials of mass destruction.


Senate Passes Obama-Hagel Provision Aimed at Preventing Nuclear Terrorism
WASHINGTON, DC -- The Senate recently passed a provision authored by Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) and Chuck Hagel (R-NE) to help keep nuclear weapons out of the hands of terrorists. The legislation was included as an amendment to the Fiscal Year 2008 State-Foreign Operations appropriations bill.


Senate Passes Coburn-Obama Bill to Create Internet Database of Federal Spending
WASHINGTON - U.S. Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) and Tom Coburn (R-OK) today hailed the Senate's passage of the "Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act," a bill that will create a Google-like search engine and database to track approximately $1 trillion in federal grants, contracts, earmarks and loans.


Congress Passes Obama-Hatch Tithing Bill
WASHINGTON - The House of Representatives today gave final approval to a bill sponsored by Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) Orrin G. Hatch (R-Utah) to protect an individual's right to continue reasonable charitable contributions, including religious tithing, during the course of consumer bankruptcy. The measure passed the United States Senate in late September and will now be presented to the President for his signature.


Obama, Feingold Laud Passage of Strong House Ethics Package
WASHINGTON, DC -- U.S. Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) and Russ Feingold (D-WI) today released the following statement lauding the House passage of lobbying reform legislation that included bundling disclosure and restrictions on the work of former lobbyists who transition to work on Capitol Hill. Senators Feingold and Obama sponsored the Lobbying and Ethics Reform Act, which set a standard for strong ethics legislation this Congress and included similar provisions.


Obama, Voinovich Secure Funding to Help Protect Great Lakes from Invasive Species
WASHINGTON, D.C. - U.S. Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) and George Voinovich (R-OH) successfully included an amendment in the Supplemental Appropriations Bill (H.R. 4939) to provide $400,000 to keep the Chicago Sanitary and Ship Canal demonstration barrier operating through the end of Fiscal Year 2006. The bill passed today by a vote of 78 to 20. The Senate version of the Supplemental Appropriations Bill will now go into a conference committee so that the differences between the bills can be resolved.


Obama, McCaskill Fight for Military Family Job Protection
WASHINGTON, DC – U.S. Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) and Claire McCaskill (D-MO) today applauded the inclusion of a provision they authored to provide job protection for military family members who are caring for wounded loved ones in the compromise Children’s Health Insurance Program (CHIP) bill. The Obama-McCaskill provision would provide a family member who is caring for a recovering servicemember wounded in combat with one year of protected leave.


Obama-Cardin Provision to Standardize Information about Recalled Products Passes Senate
WASHINGTON, D.C. - U.S. Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) and Benjamin Cardin (D-MD) today applauded the Senate's passage of the Consumer Product Safety Modernization Act (H.R. 4040), which included a provision they offered to provide consumers with comprehensive information about recalled products. In the wake of last year's toy recalls, this provision requires the Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) to develop standardized recall notices with critical product information - including where the products were sold, where they were produced, and how consumers can obtain a refund or replacement. This measure ensures parents have the information they need to immediately protect their children from dangerous products.


Obama Iraq Security Contractors Amendment Wins Approval in Senate
WASHINGTON, D.C. – Last night, the United States Senate accepted an amendment to the Defense Department Authorization bill introduced by U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) that will require federal departments to compile and report information to Congress on the role of private security contractors in Iraq.


Obama Amendment to End No-bid Contracts for Hurricane Katrina Reconstruction Passes Senate
WASHINGTON - Legislation requiring competitive bidding for Federal contracts for Gulf Coast reconstruction proposed by U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) passed the Senate today by a vote of 78 to 20.


Obama Amendment Requiring Evacuation Plans to Account for Society's Most Vulnerable Passes Senate Committee Unanimously
WASHINGTON - Legislation introduced by U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) that would require states to prepare disaster evacuation plans that account for the needs of society's most vulnerable members, including the poor, the disabled and the elderly passed the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs today unanimously.


Leahy, Obama Secure Key Panel's OK for Much-Needed Aid for Elections and Military Reform in the Democratic Republic of the Congo
WASHINGTON (Tuesday, April 4) -- U.S. Senators Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.) and Barack Obama (D-Ill.) Tuesday successfully attached an amendment to the Iraq Supplemental Appropriations bill that would provide $13.2 million for the Democratic Republic of the Congo (DRC). The amendment was cosponsored by Senator Sam Brownback (R-Kan.), Senator Dick Durbin (D-Ill.), and Senator Mike DeWine (R-Ohio).

The amendment, drafted as part of a collaborative effort by Leahy and Obama, provides $8.2 million for military reform and $5 million to support free and fair elections in the DRC. According to the United Nations, these are two key priorities if the DRC is to make a successful transition to democratic rule and bring peace and economic development to one of the largest nations in Africa.


Obama Amendment Provides $37.5 Million to Safeguard Drinking Water from Terrorist Attacks
WASHINGTON - U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) Tuesday passed a provision to provide $37.5 million over the next five years to protect our nation's drinking water from a terrorist attack. The amendment was included as part of the reauthorization of the Safe Drinking Water Act, which passed unanimously in the Environment and Public Works Committee today.


Obama Amendment Would Help Prevent Lead Poisoning in Children
WASHINGTON - The Senate approved an amendment by U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) Tuesday to the Interior Appropriations bill that would help speed the creation of regulations to protect our nation's children from dangerous lead-paint poisoning.


Obama Amendment Would Require Tracking of Spent Nuclear Fuel Rods
WASHINGTON - U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) Wednesday passed a provision in the Environment and Public Works Committee that requires the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) to track unaccounted-for spent nuclear fuel rods used at power plants in the United States. Spent nuclear fuel is periodically removed from reactors in nuclear power plants.


Obama, Durbin Laud Final Passage of Amendment to Provide $12 Million to Protect Federal Judges
Thursday, May 12, 2005

WASHINGTON - U.S. Senators Barack Obama (D-IL) and Dick Durbin (D-IL) today announced that with the final passage of the 2005 Supplemental Appropriations bill, an amendment to provide $12 million to protect federal judges in their homes and courthouses will soon be signed into law.

In March, the Illinois Senators wrote to Senate Appropriations Chairman Thad Cochran (R-MS) and Ranking Democrat Robert C. Byrd (D-WV), urging increased funding for the protection of federal judges and for courtroom security in the Supplemental Appropriations bill, citing the recent murders of the husband and mother of federal judge Joan Lefkow in Chicago and the courtroom killings in Atlanta.

Both Obama and Durbin praised the Senate's decision to include their amendment in the final bill.


Obama Amendment to Pay for Wounded Soldiers' Food Passes Senate
WASHINGTON - An amendment offered by U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) to ensure that wounded veterans recovering in military hospitals don't have to pay for their own meals passed the Senate yesterday in the emergency supplemental appropriations bill and will soon be signed into law.



#33    Guardsman Bass

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 04:02 AM

Incorrigible1 on Sep 4 2008, 07:48 PM, said:

Sponsored, not passed. Big Whoop.


At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed); that's better than John "I voted for McCain-Feingold in 2002, a global warming bill, and an immigration bill but let's not mention those" McCain. He's been running away from his few true "maverick" moments ever since he started the 2008 campaign, and he gets away with it because the Republicans know what they're getting and the independent by and large are a bunch of idiotic mouthbreathers who can't be bothered to actually do some political research when casting their vote.

"You say that it is your custom to burn widows. Very well. We also have a custom: when men burn a woman alive, we tie a rope around their necks and we hang them. Build your funeral pyre; beside it, my carpenters will build a gallows. You may follow your custom. And then we will follow ours." -Sir Charles Napier

"The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted."  — D.H. Lawrence

#34    Incorrigible1

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 04:44 AM

Guardsman Bass on Sep 4 2008, 11:02 PM, said:

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed); that's better than John "I voted for McCain-Feingold in 2002, a global warming bill, and an immigration bill but let's not mention those" McCain.

Interesting you didn't answer the actual question, that is: What actual bills has Obama had passed? Evidently none too many, since you chose to bypass the actual question.



As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.

If a nation values anything more than freedom, it will lose its freedom; and the irony of it is that if it is comfort or money that it values more, it will lose that too. -- W. Somerset Maugham
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#35    Startraveler

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 04:45 AM

Are you...blind?


#36    Guardsman Bass

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 07:24 AM

Incorrigible1 on Sep 4 2008, 10:44 PM, said:

Interesting you didn't answer the actual question, that is: What actual bills has Obama had passed? Evidently none too many, since you chose to bypass the actual question.


Perhaps I should bold it for you - Startraveler probably rightly suspects that you are, in fact, visually impaired.

QUOTE ("Guardsman Bass")
At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



"Guardsman Bass")

At least he takes credit for his bills (and they passed);



QUOTE
As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 200, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 200, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in year, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 200, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 200, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill
e past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in year, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 200, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 200, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in year, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 200, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill Oblivion to die once it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.<
it became obvious that it had kicked up a ****-storm in his own party (and which he's spent the past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 200, said:

As for Senator McCain, he has several by-partisan bills named for himself and his Democratic co-sponsors: The McCain-Kennedy bill, and the McCain-Feingold bill. Still, I can understand why you might wish to fluff over these facts.


The former of which he allowed to be sent into Bill
e past year or so running away from in debates and the like, even though it was arguably one of the best immigration bills to be proposed in years), and the latter of which he got because in spite of the fact that party leadership on both sides despised the bill, they couldn't come off opposing it because of the issue of soft money that had come up in 2000. Hell, it wasn't even his idea; Bush said in his
ces of funding again. The wind was at his back, so to speak.

But I can understand why you might wish to fluff over those facts. They might indicate that McCain is far less competent t
lk versus action).

"You say that it is your custom to burn widows. Very well. We also have a custom: when men burn a woman alive, we tie a rope around their necks and we hang them. Build your funeral pyre; beside it, my carpenters will build a gallows. You may follow your custom. And then we will follow ours." -Sir Charles Napier

"The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted."  — D.H. Lawrence

#37    Caesar

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 08:02 AM

Guardsman Bass on Sep 5 2008, 03:24 AM, said:

But I can understand why you might wish to fluff over those facts. They might indicate that McCain is far less competent than he seems, and far less of a maverick in action as opposed to talk (something for which he criticizes Obama over - talk versus action).

Yeah but McCain didn't have the option of voting "present" 129 times on many of the big issues he had/has in Congress like Obama did, thats about one of every 31 votes in his legislative career. eight years in the Illinois Senate. you cant pass like that on the executive level. Palin sure didn't have that option.



#38    Guardsman Bass

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 08:21 AM

Caesar on Sep 5 2008, 02:02 AM, said:

Yeah but McCain didn't have the option of voting "present" 129 times on many of the big issues he had/has in Congress like Obama did, thats about one of every 31 votes in his legislative career. eight years in the Illinois Senate. you cant pass like that on the executive level. Palin sure didn't have that option.


He had the option of simply failing to show up to cast important votes - like he did on all of the recent attempts to extend the alternative energy credit. If he was opposed to them, he could have at least have had the decency to actually show up and vote against it - but he prefers to hang on to the image of actually doing something with regards to energy independence as opposed to promoting a short-sighted and short-term solution that does little.


"You say that it is your custom to burn widows. Very well. We also have a custom: when men burn a woman alive, we tie a rope around their necks and we hang them. Build your funeral pyre; beside it, my carpenters will build a gallows. You may follow your custom. And then we will follow ours." -Sir Charles Napier

"The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted."  — D.H. Lawrence

#39    Caesar

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 08:34 AM

Guardsman Bass on Sep 5 2008, 04:21 AM, said:

He had the option of simply failing to show up to cast important votes - like he did on all of the recent attempts to extend the alternative energy credit. If he was opposed to them, he could have at least have had the decency to actually show up and vote against it - but he prefers to hang on to the image of actually doing something with regards to energy independence as opposed to promoting a short-sighted and short-term solution that does little.

You have no idea what your talking about. when nations like Georga are invaded by Russia you can just say I'm not home or vote "present" this guy has 0, nothing, nadaaaaa!!! experience dealing with important matters that you have to deal with. he said they should work it out between eachother, then oh let the U.N. deal with it, then a few days later (knowing Russia has veto power) finaly calls russia out. this is just insane. I see nothing wrong with being a community organizer but I just don't think he is qualified to make important executive decisions 0, nothing, nadaaaaa!!!

I see the legislation that Startraveler posted. my question is why don't I see anything he is running on, like, maybe, uh, change?


#40    Startraveler

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 03:03 PM

Ethics reforms, transparency in government, a firmer hand on military contractors in Iraq and the post-Katrina bidding process, slipping provisions protecting the jobs of military families into the CHIP bill, a renewed bipartisan focus on nonproliferation and nuclear terrorism, closing tax loopholes and providing tax relief to those who need it (in this case, soldiers, though his presidential platform expands upon this example significantly)--what do you think change is? Is it possible you just actually don't know what he's campaigning on aside from that word?

Quote

when nations like Georga are invaded by Russia you can just say I'm not home or vote "present" this guy has 0, nothing, nadaaaaa!!! experience dealing with important matters that you have to deal with. he said they should work it out between eachother, then oh let the U.N. deal with it, then a few days later (knowing Russia has veto power) finaly calls russia out.


Parliamentary maneuvers are available to legislators. And Obama has use that particular tool, the "present" vote, to object to the constitutionality of legislation, to provide political cover to other state senators, and, yes, probably to save his own @ss at times (McCain has adopted something similar in the 110th Congress--he just stopped showing up to vote on anything at all). That's politics, that's how it works. Even executives have escape hatches they sometimes use, yes, even on matters of grave importance to the military. Example:

Recent events have brought the legal status of the pocket veto back to the forefront of American politics.

In December of 2007, President George W. Bush pushed the pocket veto into murky waters by claiming that he had pocket vetoed H.R. 1585, the "National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2008,"[4] even though the House of Representatives had designated agents to receive presidential messages before adjourning.[5] The bill had been previously passed by veto-proof majorities in both the House and the Senate. If the President had chosen to veto the bill, he would have been required to return it to the house whence it originated, which, in this case, was the House of Representatives. The House then could have voted to override the veto, and the Senate could then do likewise. In the event that each house had voted by at least two-thirds majority to override the veto, the bill would become law.[6]


And about that U.N. thing:

Quote

The United States and our allies should continue efforts to bring a resolution before the United Nations Security Council condemning Russian aggression, noting the withdrawal of Georgian troops from South Ossetia, and calling for an immediate ceasefire and a withdrawal of Russian troops from Georgian territory. -- John McCain, August 11



#41    Guardsman Bass

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Posted 05 September 2008 - 03:32 PM

Caesar on Sep 5 2008, 02:34 AM, said:

You have no idea what your talking about. when nations like Georga are invaded by Russia you can just say I'm not home or vote "present" this guy has 0, nothing, nadaaaaa!!! experience dealing with important matters that you have to deal with.


Have you never heard of taking a neutral stance? Sorry to interrupt your grammatically challenged little rant here, but at least Obama actually showed up to see the votes through, whether or not he took a neutral stance; McCain simply failed to show up at all on bills like the Alternative Energy Tax Credit that have enormous ramifications for domestic energy security and development. That tax credit is basically the difference between investment in alternative energy and no investment in alternative energy (other than nukes), which is a nice way of saying that we get to spend the next 20 years relying on coal for our electrical needs.

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he said they should work it out between eachother, then oh let the U.N. deal with it, then a few days later (knowing Russia has veto power) finaly calls russia out. this is just insane. I see nothing wrong with being a community organizer but I just don't think he is qualified to make important executive decisions 0, nothing, nadaaaaa!!!


He said that they should work it out rather than escalating the fighting (the same thing the Bush Administration said, and McCain did as well- eventually), and that there should be a Security Council resolution, which McCain also said should be done. The only exception is that he hasn't resorted to a irrational hate-on for Russia like McCain did, probably because he recognized (unlike McCain) that you can't basically tell Russia to ****-off on their security concerns while preaching at them for not being democratic, and expect somehow that things will work out.

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I see the legislation that Startraveler posted. my question is why don't I see anything he is running on, like, maybe, uh, change?


Like the Ethics Reform bill? Try reading next time.


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#42    Caesar

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Posted 06 September 2008 - 02:11 AM

Guardsman Bass on Sep 5 2008, 11:32 AM, said:

Have you never heard of taking a neutral stance? Sorry to interrupt your grammatically challenged little rant here, but at least Obama actually showed up to see the votes through, whether or not he took a neutral stance

No this is the first time I've heard of taking a neutral stance. why didn't he make a comment as to why he voted "present" in the first place?



Guardsman Bass on Sep 5 2008, 11:32 AM, said:

He said that they should work it out rather than escalating the fighting

True then he said?



#43    Caesar

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Posted 06 September 2008 - 02:28 AM

Startraveler on Sep 5 2008, 11:03 AM, said:

Ethics reforms, transparency in government, a firmer hand on military contractors in Iraq and the post-Katrina bidding process, slipping provisions protecting the jobs of military families into the CHIP bill, a renewed bipartisan focus on nonproliferation and nuclear terrorism, closing tax loopholes and providing tax relief to those who need it (in this case, soldiers, though his presidential platform expands upon this example significantly)--what do you think change is? Is it possible you just actually don't know what he's campaigning on aside from that word?

These are very small meaures of change vs what he is running on. I'm sure McCain has supported this same stuff, that is if their wasn't other bills attached. even Joe Lieberman said he didn't really accomplish anything significant, I'm just going by what Lieberman said, he is a democrat and was the vp pick just 8 years ago.  

Startraveler on Sep 5 2008, 11:03 AM, said:

Parliamentary maneuvers are available to legislators. And Obama has use that particular tool, the "present" vote, to object to the constitutionality of legislation, to provide political cover to other state senators, and, yes, probably to save his own @ss at times

one of every 31 votes in his legislative career?


#44    Startraveler

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Posted 06 September 2008 - 02:49 AM

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No this is the first time I've heard of taking a neutral stance. why didn't he make a comment as to why he voted "present" in the first place?


He often did explain why he voted "present." Many times it was because he questioned the constitutionality of a law (Obama was a senior lecturer on con law at UChicago).

To register a vote in the Illinois General Assembly, lawmakers have a choice of three buttons on their desk. The "yes" button is green. The "no" button is red, and the "present" button is yellow, says Rich Miller, who writes and publishes The Capitol Fax, a daily newsletter and blog on Illinois politics.

"There's a saying in Springfield that there's a reason why the present button is yellow," Miller says.

But Miller says that not all "present" votes are cowardly, including those cast by then-state Sen. Obama.

"After having put some thought into it, I don't think that Barack Obama was necessarily a coward for voting present on those bills. In fact, I think he believed that he was doing the right thing, because something, in his mind, might have been unconstitutional," Miller says.

Miller points out that, at times, Obama was the only lawmaker voting "present" on bills winning near unanimous support, even on issues he supported and on one he sponsored.

Chris Mooney is a political science professor at the University of Illinois, Springfield.

"A person as cerebral as Sen. Obama might be prone to such a thing, thinking things through a little too carefully," Mooney says.

Mooney and other state capitol watchers and players say Illinois lawmakers often vote "present" as part of a larger party or issue bloc strategy.

Pam Sutherland is the president and CEO of the Illinois Planned Parenthood Council. She says Obama voted "present" at least seven times to provide cover to other abortion-rights supporters on such bills as the "Born Alive Infant Protection Act."

"Senators didn't want to vote pro-choice anymore, because they knew these were being used against them in their campaigns," Sutherland said.

>


Note that John McCain has missed 64% of votes in the 110th Congress, more than any other senator. That's significantly more than the runner up, Tim Johnson, who has been recovering from a stroke.

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These are very small meaures of change vs what he is running on.


I'm not sure what that means.

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I'm sure McCain has supported this same stuff, that is if their wasn't other bills attached. even Joe Lieberman said he didn't really accomplish anything significant, I'm just going by what Lieberman said, he is a democrat and was the vp pick just 8 years ago.


You're going by what Lieberman, a McCain supporter, said at the Republican National Convention? Lieberman who was booted from the Democratic party by his constituents? Look, I've posted some of what Obama's done above. Take it, leave it, whatever. The facts are there.

Edited by Startraveler, 06 September 2008 - 02:57 AM.


#45    ninjadude

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Posted 06 September 2008 - 03:01 AM

THE FACTS: Obama acknowledges that over nearly eight years in the Illinois Senate, he voted "present" 129 times. That was out of roughly 4,000 votes he cast, so those "presents" amounted to about one of every 31 votes in his legislative career.

Illinois legislators often vote "present" and for a wide variety of reasons. Sometimes blocs of lawmakers do it as a protest in some dispute over rules and procedures. Obama was often joined in his "present" votes by 10 or 20 other senators.

In other cases, lawmakers do it to signal objections to the details of a measure that they support in principle. They also use "present" votes as strategic moves to defeat legislation or, of course, simply to avoid taking a firm position.

Clinton highlights several of Obama's "present" votes that she considers questionable.

Several involve abortion -- a ban on certain late-pregnancy abortions, a requirement that a minor's parents be notified and restrictions on a type of abortion where the fetus sometimes survives for short periods.

"A woman's right to choose ... demands a leader who will stand up and protect it," said one Clinton campaign mailer.

But the Illinois Planned Parenthood Council says Obama's "present" votes were actually part of a careful strategy to prevent those restrictions from passing.

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